# What would be the best way to mine ice from Pluto? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 4, 2015, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826 "2015-04-04T20:14:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 9:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/21 "2015-04-05T09:01:42Z")
A space elevator would work in Pluto’s low gravity, assuming you could find somewhere to anchor it… ---
**Author:** ![Ignotus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ecc23a/32.png) [@Ignotus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignotus)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 9:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/22 "2015-04-05T09:51:15Z")
> [@](#): > > **Mangetout** : A space elevator would work in Pluto’s low gravity, assuming you could find somewhere to anchor it… Yeah, but Clarke (Damn Him! Damn Him to Hell for using up all Great Science Fiction Ideas!!:D) has already taken care of that one… (Probably of the comet idea too, but I haven’t read that story… as yet!) ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/23 "2015-04-05T10:52:35Z")
> [@TheCozyMicrobe](#): > > Hey there! My name is Cozy, and I’m writing a science-fiction book. The problem is, I want it to be a lot more heavy on the science than most similar books, but I’m not particularly knowledgeable. Okay, in the first place “heavy on the science” is a recognised sub-genre. It’s called [hard science fiction](hard science fiction). It isn’t rare. Your book won’t stand out as different to the others just because it has some science details Second, remember the best advice for authors: Write what you know. Hard science fiction is written by people with a scientific background. If you don’t have the knowledge, then don’t try for accuracy. Just make it magic future technology, handwave the details, and concentrate on telling an entertaining story. ---
**Author:** ![Ignotus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ecc23a/32.png) [@Ignotus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignotus)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/24 "2015-04-05T11:15:33Z")
> [@](#): > > [R]emember the best advice for authors: Write what you know. Hard science fiction is written by people with a scientific background. So, you’re saying that a person without a solid science education shouldn’t even try to make his/her story scientifically plausible? This is very patronizing; akin to: If you can’t write grammatically correct English, why are you posting here? I beg to differ. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/25 "2015-04-05T11:22:19Z")
The energy you spend getting to Pluto - circularizing the orbit, encounter, orbit and possible landing, would seem to take far more fuel and time then going direct to interstellar - you seem OK with that part but that is a long time to go without the shielding that the water is to provide. If they survive all the way to Pluto without this water shielding it does not seem like it was needed. ---
**Author:** ![Ignotus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ecc23a/32.png) [@Ignotus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignotus)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/26 "2015-04-05T11:34:51Z")
Pluto is like next door; Alpha Centauri is in New Zealand. Makes a difference? (Posting from Sweden) ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/27 "2015-04-05T11:57:25Z")
> [@Ignotus](#): > > So, you’re saying that a person without a solid science education shouldn’t even try to make his/her story scientifically plausible? No, I’m saying that it shouldn’t try to be “heavy on the science.” > [@](#): > > This is very patronizing; akin to: If you can’t write grammatically correct English, why are you posting here? Akin to “if you can’t write grammatically correct English, then don’t try to write a story where the niceties of grammar are an important plot point” ---
**Author:** ![Ignotus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ecc23a/32.png) [@Ignotus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignotus)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/28 "2015-04-05T12:58:08Z")
Well… let’s not derail this thread over our personal quarrel! Take it to the pit, huh? Concerning the OP: I love and admire your ambition! Let’s see more of it! ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/29 "2015-04-05T13:54:41Z")
What you probably want to do is to use comets. But you don’t want to get the ice away from the comet to your ship, nor do you even want to attach your ship to the comet. What you probably want to do is to make your ship out of the comet in the first place. EDIT: Oh, and as for heavy or light on the science, if you’re not intimately familiar with all of this, your best bet is probably just to leave out most of the details. Say where your ship is going, of course, probably say how long the journey is going to take, and maybe say how big the ship is, and you’ve probably got all you need for your story. What kind of engines does it have? That’s easy, it has mighty engines. What orbit did it take? One that leaves the Solar System. Even if the questions come up, you can still leave off a lot of detail. Like, for instance, you might mention the ice shielding without saying where it came from. Or mention that it came from space, without saying where in space. Or say that it came from comets, without saying how you processed it from comets. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/30 "2015-04-05T13:58:39Z")
Pluto has only a tenuous atmosphere (we’d call it a vacuum for most practical purposes), so the best way to get ice from it would be to build a “mass driver” (linear accelerator) that would launch loads of ice out of Pluto’s gravity, to be collected by tugs. BTW, the ice not only serves as a dust shield and radiation protection but it can also be used for reaction mass at the end of the voyage. ---
**Author:** ![Aquadementia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aquadementia/32/555_2.png) [@Aquadementia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aquadementia)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/31 "2015-04-05T16:27:17Z")
I think every author should do research on the setting for his book. You don’t have to have been in WWII New Orleans to write a book taking place then and there. And it would make for a really boring story if the author failed to investigate who was there doing what and the places unique to that time. Here are some unresearched ideas. Pluto’s gravity is 1/15 g so what you do is use your fusion reactor to generate heat or a laser pulse that will vaporize the nitrogen ice to work like a rocket. You could use your imaginative license to say there are outcrops of methane ice on Pluto if you want to use methane. Or that there is water ice form an impacted comet, uncovered by a second impact millions of years later. > [@Ignotus](#): > > Yeah, but Clarke (Damn Him! Damn Him to Hell for using up all Great Science Fiction Ideas!!:D) has already taken care of that one… > > (Probably of the comet idea too, but I haven’t read that story… as yet!) Yeah, in “Songs of Distant Earth” he had a spaceship from Earth replenish their ice shield form the oceans of another terraformed world. I think he was a bit vague about how they “lifted” the giant hexagonal sections of ice. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blue_blistering_barnacle/32/3386_2.png) [@Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blue_Blistering_Barnacle)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/32 "2015-04-05T18:05:25Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > What you probably want to do is to use comets. But you don’t want to get the ice away from the comet to your ship, nor do you even want to attach your ship to the comet. What you probably want to do is to make your ship out of the comet in the first place. > > EDIT: > Oh, and as for heavy or light on the science, if you’re not intimately familiar with all of this, your best bet is probably just to leave out most of the details. Say where your ship is going, of course, probably say how long the journey is going to take, and maybe say how big the ship is, and you’ve probably got all you need for your story. What kind of engines does it have? That’s easy, it has mighty engines. What orbit did it take? One that leaves the Solar System. Even if the questions come up, you can still leave off a lot of detail. Like, for instance, you might mention the ice shielding without saying where it came from. Or mention that it came from space, without saying where in space. Or say that it came from comets, without saying how you processed it from comets. Check out Heart of the Comet , a novel by David Brin and Gregory Benford, for ideas along this line. These guys know there astronomy. > **[Heart of the Comet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_of_the_Comet)** > > Heart of the Comet is a novel by David Brin and Gregory Benford about human space travel to Halley's Comet published in 1986. Its publication coincided with the comet's 1986 approach to the Earth. > Written in the third person, the perspective alternates between the three main characters, the "spacer" Carl Osborn, the computer programmer Virginia Herbert and the doctor and geneticist Saul Lintz. > The novel tells the story of an expedition beginning in the year 2061 to capture Halley's Comet into a... ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/33 "2015-04-05T18:39:03Z")
> [@Ignotus](#): > > Yeah, but Clarke (Damn Him! Damn Him to Hell for using up all Great Science Fiction Ideas!!:D) has already taken care of that one… > > (Probably of the comet idea too, but I haven’t read that story… as yet!) There’s nothing new under the sun. Clarke’s didn’t invent the Space Elevator anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/34 "2015-04-05T19:09:40Z")
By “ice”, do you mean _water_ ice, or some frozen gas? ---
**Author:** ![TheCozyMicrobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ed8c4c/32.png) [@TheCozyMicrobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheCozyMicrobe)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/35 "2015-04-05T20:05:15Z")
This got a lot more responses than I thought it ever would, thank you guys so much! So this is going to be a bit of a long post, if you don’t mind bearing with me. I’ll try as best I can to get to explain to you guys a general story overview, as well as what I THINK I’m looking for. Again, you’re dealing with someone who doesn’t know much about science, but really does want to learn, so anything is appreciated. So far as the story portion of it, it’s set in an alternate version of our universe, so the same rules of physics and such still apply. History on Earth was mostly the same, up until 1878. Joseph Stalin was stillborn, and as a result, never rose to power. In his stead, cooler heads prevailed, and instead of the corrupt, failing USSR we see in real-world history, they formed a mighty nation, both economically and in terms of military power. In 1907, Adolf Hitler was accepted into art school, and as a result, was able to pursue his true passion of painting. World War II never happened, therefore America never stopped it’s isolationist phase, instead seeking stronger alliances with Canada and Mexico, as well as South America. Great Britain was able to use it’s military power to hold onto it’s colonies, therefore never losing it’s place as a world power. NATO and the UN were never formed. The Cold War never happened, and as a result, there was no race to space. Instead, the individual powers focused on exploring and exploiting our world as best they could, leading to great advances in the areas of deep-sea exploration and in-atmosphere flight. The first spaceflight didn’t happen until the year 2023, by a privately-owned, multinational company. It was more of a novelty than anything else, but the company continued to pour funding into more research on the possibilities of space travel. By 2100, we were running out of resources, and battles were breaking out all over the world. At around this time, Russian scientists discovered four solar systems, each of which had a planet that could sustain life, despite being a harsh climate. Their original intent was to construct a large ship to go to each planet, but they realized that it would be impossible to do so in secret. So they shared their findings with the three other powers which consisted of Great Britain, the assorted American countries, and a group of smaller European countries which had banded together for safety. They all agreed that each would get one solar system, and would each build one ship, helping out with construction and maintaining peace as needed. So the first part of the book is on Earth, the lead up to discovering the planets, and then the repercussions of the discovery. The second part will be the construction of the ships, which is where the need for shielding comes in. The third part will be the journey of the ships, which will take somewhere between 400 and 450 years, with no FTL travel. The final portion will be planetfall. So a little more about the ships so you all know more about what we’re trying to shield. Each ship will be massive, housing one point five million people. However, at any given time, most of those people will be in cryogenic sleep. A large portion of the ship will be dedicated to the storage of the sleepers. This will be behind the cargo hold. What I was thinking was have the cargo hold at the front of the ship, that way if anything hit the ship, that would take the hit first. This area would also be in zero gravity, to save energy, if that’s a plausible idea. They don’t have anti-gravity or anything like that, so they have to use centrifugal force for their gravity. Anyway, behind the cargo hold will be the living areas. From this point back, everything will be divided into redundant sections of three, with the living people evenly distributed and airlocks plentiful. Safety is a huge concern at the point. The bridge, at the very back of the ship, will also have two identical, fully staffed copies, any one of which is capable of controlling the ship in an emergency. So that’s the kind of ship we need to shield. I bow to your more scientific knowledge on details, and am looking forward to hearing more! ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/36 "2015-04-05T21:30:48Z")
Interesting storyline. Send ships ahead of your fleet and ‘nuke’ the surface to send ‘ice’ into orbit around Pluto. ‘Mine’ the ice in orbit. That’s what I’d do. Now, I just have to feed the dogs. They’re starting to orbit me. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/37 "2015-04-05T21:59:18Z")
> [@Ignotus](#): > > Pluto is like next door; Alpha Centauri is in New Zealand. > > Makes a difference? > > (Posting from Sweden) But for the travelers this is not the case since it is a generational ship. Pluto is like next door and your end of your expected life is 3 to 4 houses after that, is more like it. The trip to Pluto could easily take 15 yrs or more for the adult crew members who left earth, a significant portion of their space life, which is spent without the shielding. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/38 "2015-04-05T23:10:38Z")
> [@TheCozyMicrobe](#): > > So this is going to be a bit of a long post, if you don’t mind bearing with me. I’ll try as best I can to get to explain to you guys a general story overview, as well as what I THINK I’m looking for. A few questions: [ul] [li]What’s your reason for setting it in an alternate history? If the main action of the story doesn’t begin until 2100, why couldn’t it be in our timeline? Is there a reason you’d really like it to be about imperial Britain colonizing the stars?[/li][li]What’s going on back in Sol system? If you can build generation starships you have a massive space-based industrial infrastructure. If your colonists can survive centuries aboard ship couldn’t people live in habitats in our solar system? Sending a few million people out to the stars leaves a legacy but doesn’t do much for the mass of humanity back home.[/li][li]What’s the hook of the story? So far you’ve mentioned people discover inhabitable worlds, they build starships to go there, and then they go there. That pretty much is the _setting_ for the story; what’s the drama?[/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/39 "2015-04-05T23:13:36Z")
> [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](#): > > By “ice”, do you mean _water_ ice, or some frozen gas? If keeping it frozen isn’t a problem (I assume as much in deep space), then it’s pretty much irrelevant if the ice is frozen water, ammonia, methane, or some mixture. All will be hydrogen-rich compounds of low atomic weight, good for shielding against cosmic rays. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2015, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826/40 "2015-04-05T23:56:23Z")
I would just add that many years ago, a novel “Artery of Fire” by Thomas N. Scortia dealt with some incredible energy source that piped (so to speak) from Pluto to Earth. Other than that, I got nuthin’. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-best-way-to-mine-ice-from-pluto/716826.md?page=3)