# What Would Be the Result: "cocktail of lye and sulfuric acid"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 15, 2022, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980 "2022-07-15T02:07:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![am77494](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d2c977/32.png) [@am77494](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/am77494)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/21 "2022-07-15T19:00:48Z")
> [@gnoitall](#): > > And then back into a fresh lye bath to dissolve the demineralizated tissue. > > Seems like a lot of work, tbh. Nope. Tissue will dissolve in both Sulfuric Acid and Lye. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/22 "2022-07-15T19:17:08Z")
> [@am77494](#): > > Busted by MythBusters. Both Hydro Fluoric Acid and Mercury Fulminate uses in BB were busted by Mythbusters Except if you read the details, for the big experiment, they used sulfuric acid, not hydrofluoric acid, which is completely wrong. They don’t get to say “well, sulfuric acid is stronger than hydrofluoric, therefore it will dissolve even more” - things don’t work that way. Fluorine ions react with pretty much anything. Reactivity =/= acid strength. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/23 "2022-07-15T19:17:33Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > “…a cocktail of lye and sulfuric acid.” This would be correctly read as “a cocktail of salt.” Specifically, sodium sulfate, possibly quite warm from the reaction. It sounds like a very pleasant bath to me. Of course this depends on the cocktail being mixed in exactly equal molar quantities of lye and sulfuric acid. If you get too much of one, some of it won’t react and will be left over. ---
**Author:** ![am77494](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d2c977/32.png) [@am77494](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/am77494)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/24 "2022-07-15T20:45:48Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > Fluorine ions react with pretty much anything. Reactivity =/= acid strength. I have worked with Hydrofluoric acid (HF) in fertilizer industry and oil refineries. Without going into a lot of details, I believe Mythbusters is correct. HF is extremely dangerous if you get it on your skin and there are a lot of precautions around that. It penetrates through skin and gets to the bones quickly and wreaks havoc from there. At the same time HF is used in soil samples to get rid of the inorganic matter when studying organics. “ Hydrofluoric acid (HF) is a powerful tool in the investigation of soil organic matter (SOM) due to its ability to dissolve minerals but not break the chemical bonds of organic matter. ” [https://hero.epa.gov/hero/index.cfm/reference/details/reference\_id/6649250](https://hero.epa.gov/hero/index.cfm/reference/details/reference_id/6649250) It is a peculiar chemical but so are the others 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/25 "2022-07-15T21:21:30Z")
> [@am77494](#): > > Without going into a lot of details, I believe Mythbusters is correct. Depends on what part Mythbuster is testing. If they are testing if HF will dissolve a body into goo, then they are correct - it won’t (or at least there are much better ways of doing it). But if they are testing if it will dissolve a bathtub, then it certainly will if there’s enough. I worked with fluorine gas in a research lab. Talk about scary… ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/26 "2022-07-15T21:35:06Z")
Mix them both at once and the heat of reaction is going to be astounding. That’d probably do more than any chemical reaction with the organic matter. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/27 "2022-07-15T22:55:22Z")
A piranha solution is glass-safe and will work on both flesh and bone but I suspect most working with enough of it to dissolve an entire body would injure or kill themselves. > **[Piranha solution](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piranha_solution)** > > Piranha solution, also known as piranha etch, is a mixture of sulfuric acid (H2SO4) and hydrogen peroxide (H2O2), used to clean organic residues off substrates. Because the mixture is a strong oxidizing agent, it will decompose most organic matter, and it will also hydroxylate most surfaces (by adding –OH groups), making them highly hydrophilic (water-compatible). This means the solution can also easily dissolve fabric and skin, potentially causing severe damage and chemical burns in case of i Ma... ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/28 "2022-07-16T00:01:08Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > A piranha solution is glass-safe and will work on both flesh and bone but I suspect most working with enough of it to dissolve an entire body would injure or kill themselves. There are YouTube videos on piranha solution to help those needing to dissolve flesh and bone quickly and conveniently. For innocent purposes, of course. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/29 "2022-07-16T05:29:00Z")
I’m not sure whether I need to point this out or not, but just in case. . . They do purposefully get this stuff wrong on TV shows. They do so to avoid becoming an instruction resource for serial killers. Breaking Bad also avoided providing a workable method for making methamphetamine. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/30 "2022-07-16T12:55:41Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > Breaking Bad also avoided providing a workable method for making methamphetamine. Excuse me, I just need to make a couple of phone calls…… ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/31 "2022-07-16T13:09:22Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > then he’d be drowned and preserved in a drum of brine. I think that is how cannibals preserved meat before refrigeration. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/32 "2022-07-16T13:36:01Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Bad science there. Bad writing, too. Man, that sentence is just trying too hard. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/33 "2022-07-16T13:42:19Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > Except if you read the details, for the big experiment, they used sulfuric acid, not hydrofluoric acid, which is completely wrong. Yeah, regardless of what the actual answer is to the question, they didn’t answer it. If they tested whether sulfuric acid will destroy a body, then they didn’t answer whether hydrofluoric acid will do it. Now, I totally get why Mythbusters wouldn’t want to do that experiment, because no sane chemist wants to work with bathtub-sized quantities of HF (especially not in an open container like a bathtub). Heck, even most insane chemists don’t. But they could have done a small-scale experiment with actual HF and a chicken drumstick, or something. That’d have had more relevance to the question than a bathtub of sulfuric. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/34 "2022-07-16T19:50:32Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Yeah, regardless of what the actual answer is to the question, they didn’t answer it. If they tested whether sulfuric acid will destroy a body, then they didn’t answer whether hydrofluoric acid will do it. Sulfuric acid is a strong acid, HF is considered a weak acid. > **[What Are Strong Acids? Which Is The World's Strongest Acid?](https://www.scienceabc.com/eyeopeners/what-are-strong-acids-which-is-the-worlds-strongest-acid.html)** > > While a strong acid is the one that is always on its toes and is highly efficient when it comes to donating protons. So, the larger the concentration of H+ ions in a solution the more acidic is the acid dispersed. _Is hydrofluoric acid strong or weak?_ _weak acid_ _3 Hydrofluoric Acid. Hydrofluoric acid (38%, azeotropic mixture with water) is considered as a **weak acid** but it is considered an important chemical reagent in wet digestion procedures due to complexing ability of fluoride ion. Hydrofluoric acid is very effective for decomposition of silicate matrices._ [https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemical-engineering/hydrofluoric-acid](https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/chemical-engineering/hydrofluoric-acid) HF will dissolve gold, if given enough time. But that isn’t the issue with the human body. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/35 "2022-07-16T20:48:00Z")
Yes, we know that HF is a weak acid. How is that relevant? pH isn’t the only thing that determines how nasty an acid is, or what it’ll eat through. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2022, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/36 "2022-07-17T15:14:43Z")
I tried this and all I can say is, Worst. Manhattan. Ever. 'Cause I keep seeing this as _cocktail of ~~lye~~ rye and sulfuric acid_. ---
**Author:** ![Francis\_Vaughan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/francis_vaughan/32/3093_2.png) [@Francis\_Vaughan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Francis_Vaughan)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2022, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/37 "2022-07-17T16:02:12Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > But they could have done a small-scale experiment with actual HF and a chicken drumstick, or something. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/oipksRhISfM/maxresdefault.jpg "Flesh-Eating Hydrofluoric Acid - Periodic Table of Videos") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oipksRhISfM) ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2022, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/38 "2022-07-17T16:24:53Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Yes, we know that HF is a weak acid. How is that relevant? pH isn’t the only thing that determines how nasty an acid is, or what it’ll eat through. Not pH, it’s pKa. The pKa constant is pretty much the defining factor of how strong an acid is. Of course “nasty” could mean anything, so that’s hard to define. HF is extremely toxic if it contacts the skin, and very corrosive to silicates. But that’s not due to acidity, that’s because of the behavior of fluoride ions. Acids aren’t really a great choice for dissolving tissue anyhow. The best way is to boil it in a hot bath of concentrated sodium hydroxide. This will break down all the soft tissue in half of a workday, leaving the bones. The bones are then added into a vessel containing strong hydrochloric acid and left to stand overnight under ventilation. Both solutions can then be mixed together to produce a neutralized waste product that can be safely & responsibly discharged into the sewage system. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2022, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/39 "2022-07-17T18:17:02Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > Not pH, it’s pKa. The pKa constant is pretty much the defining factor of how strong an acid is. Not exactly. Two solutions with the same pH but comprising acids with different pKas can react similarly if the counterion isn’t doing much for the reaction in question. And with HF it’s often all about that fluoride, as discussed by alleged dandelion Martyn Poliakoff in the above video. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2022, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980/40 "2022-07-17T19:30:36Z")
The point is, HF will eat through some things that other acids won’t, even much stronger acids. So you can’t just a priori say that “Sulfuric acid didn’t eat away the body, therefore hydrofluoric acid won’t, either”. If you want to know what HF will do, you need to experiment with HF, because, until you do the experiment, it might turn out that those fluoride ions are significant after all. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-be-the-result-cocktail-of-lye-and-sulfuric-acid/967980.md?page=3)