# What would it take for one of the four major American sports leagues to disappear? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [November 10, 2021, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082 "2021-11-10T00:49:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2021, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/41 "2021-11-14T00:58:28Z")
I think it is also fair to note that many otherwise intelligent people _become_ drooling cavemen drinking themselves into oblivion in the leadup to a game, especially ones where tailgating is involved. Early tailgating. Think Stealers fans. Yeah, you get it now. 😀 ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2021, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/43 "2021-11-14T12:49:04Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > Think Stealers fans. Steelers. I’ve been to Steelers tailgating parties where nobody really watched the game. A tv was on in the living room, but everyone was drinking, throwing darts, talking around the fire pit, etc. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2021, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/44 "2021-11-14T15:26:28Z")
> [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > Boxing probably is not in the list, but I always thought its problems were a failure to produce younger champions and loss of market and interest to things like MMA which were more violent, entertaining and with more technical skills. > [@kenobi\_65](#): > > I’ve also suspected that boxing declined in popularity when most of its top matches moved to pay-per-view, making it less visible to casual fans. IMHO the other contributing factor in boxing is that there isn’t one dominant organizing entity. Nobody disputes who the current champion is in football, baseball, or the various MMA weight classes. Boxing, with all the various organizing bodies, can’t say that. Even if one of the weight classes happens to have a unified belt, it probably won’t stay that way for long. If the champion retires, refuses to fight a particular fighter, pisses off the powers that be in one of the organizations, etc., the belts will go their separate ways again. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2021, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/45 "2021-11-14T16:06:33Z")
Those are all good points. You think it would be easier to organize individuals than teams, but my impression (wrong or no) is champion boxers often hold out for ridiculously high purses - that drive PPV and become too expensive to offer value to the sports fan. There is no “season” to develop interest, revenue and advertising dollars. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2021, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/46 "2021-11-14T22:56:23Z")
I contend as a Bengals fan that it is, indeed, _ **Stealers.** _ 😀 I have never met a Stealers fan that disinterested in the game while it’s on. In fact, those aren’t “real” Stealer fans, because they’re not overly inebriated and spouting Iron City spattered spit from their overheated mouths onto the television screen. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/48 "2021-11-15T00:17:56Z")
> [@PennTeller](#): > > MLS has the NFL problem that its teams only play once per week. Therefore, its revenue cannot compete with the NHL, where teams play 3 times per week. The NFL makes rather a shit-ton more money than the NHL, though, doesn’t it? Even more than MLB, which plays twice as many games as the NHL. The reason MLS has less money is it’s not as popular as the NHL. If it was, it wouldn’t matter much how often they played. They’d sell tickets at higher prices, supply and demand being what they are, and TV revenues would be far higher than they currently are. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/49 "2021-11-15T00:22:48Z")
The fans to wake up an realize that despite the fact that the fans paint their faces, attend every game, buy season tickets, wave banners, buy merchandise and all that- the team owners and thus the teams have _exactly zero loyalty_ to the fans and will desert them in a millisecond ones another city is fool enough to waste taxpayer money on bribing them with a new stadium, etc,. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/50 "2021-11-15T00:23:32Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > Boxing, with all the various organizing bodies, can’t say that I noted this upthread. It is effectively impossible to clearly know at any time who the world heavyweight champion is. It is not all that long ago, in historical terms, that the world heavyweight champion was probably the most famous athlete in the world. Even people who were not boxing fans would usually know who the champ was,but that’s made a hell of a lot easier when there is almost always general agreement as to WHO it was. The analagous situation would be if the NFL split into four competing leagues, all of them calling their championship game the Super Bowl. That would not make people four times as interested in watching Super Bowls; in fact, it would not split existing interest four ways. It would REDUCE overall interest. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/52 "2021-11-15T00:50:33Z")
> [@PennTeller](#): > > Even if MLS was as popular as the NHL, it still would generate less revenue because of the limited inventory available. How does the NFL make so much more money than the other three major sports leagues despite having such limited inventory? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/54 "2021-11-15T01:31:05Z")
So you’re saying that if MLS was more popular it would make more money? ---
**Author:** ![jaycat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jaycat/32/3015_2.png) [@jaycat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jaycat)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/56 "2021-11-15T02:36:14Z")
The MLS is the only one of the leagues mentioned here that isn’t really a major league. The caliber of play is far inferior by international standards. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/58 "2021-11-15T19:52:13Z")
The NHL is not “one of” the top hockey leagues, it’s the top hockey league by a hundred miles. No European league compares. Almost all the elite European players are in the NHL. Professional hockey is extremely Canada/USA focused to an extent soccer is not anywhere. The KHL is a good league, with quality players, but the KHL champion would be the worst team in the NHL. MLS _might_ be in the Top 10 soccer leagues but it’d be ninth or tenth at best. Most formal ranking systems place it below top ten, around 12-15. Even to my uneducated eyes, it’s visibly not equal to the top flight European leagues like the EPL, Serie A, or Bundesliga. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/59 "2021-11-15T20:06:35Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > MLS _might_ be in the Top 10 soccer leagues but it’d be ninth or tenth at best. Most formal ranking systems place it below top ten, around 12-15. Even to my uneducated eyes, it’s visibly not equal to the top flight European leagues like the EPL, Serie A, or Bundesliga. But it is one of the most fun leagues, and it’s growing by leaps and bounds. The last decade has seen immense growth and the last 5 years have added incredibly successful franchises: Atlanta (probably one of the biggest surprises), Minnesota, LAFC, Cincinnati, Austin, etc. It probably won’t reach NHL super soon, but in a couple decades it might. We’ll see what the next TV deal in 2022 brings. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/60 "2021-11-15T21:01:32Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > We’ll see what the next TV deal in 2022 brings. MLS might have an opportunity if all the European leagues get stuck on streaming channels. We’ve gone from having every Premier League game available on cable to the majority now on Peacock. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/61 "2021-11-15T21:06:17Z")
Where do you think most MLS games are on currently? 😉 Yeah, we have a game of the week on ESPN or FS1, with about 10 games this year on ABC or FOX, or Univision, but the rest of the games are on ESPN+ or your local regional sports network. Though rumors are MLS is offering local and national rights combined up to bidders, which would be a relief. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/62 "2021-11-15T21:21:11Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > Yeah, we have a game of the week on ESPN or FS1, with about 10 games this year on ABC or FOX, or Univision, but the rest of the games are on ESPN+ or your local regional sports network. Some of the Chicago Fire games are on WGN. ESPN + is a at least better than something like Peacock, as a sports fan, at least you’re getting all sports related content with that subscription. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/63 "2021-11-15T21:27:45Z")
> [@dalej42](#): > > ESPN + is a at least better than something like Peacock Depends on what you like. If you don’t care for anything else on ESPN+, then it’s just $7 a month for out of region MLS games. Peacock Premium is a bit cheaper ($5 a month) and you can get some shows out of it as well as WWE if one is a fan. Reminds me that now that the MLS regular season is over I should cancel my ESPN+ membership. ---
**Author:** ![Thing.Fish](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thing.fish/32/9168_2.png) [@Thing.Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing.Fish)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2021, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/65 "2021-11-16T06:17:38Z")
[This](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_professional_sports_leagues_by_revenue) fascinating Wikipedia page suggests that, at least measured by revenue, MLS is comparable to March Madness, SEC or Big Ten football or Japanese pro baseball. That’s better than I would have guessed, but still only a quarter as big as the NHL and one-fourteenth as big as the NFL. It’s actually the seventh-richest soccer league in the world, though, more than half as rich as Ligue 1 and only a bit behind Brazil. Oh, I could totally disappear into this. Would you have guessed that the Mexican baseball, Russian volleyball, and Israeli basketball leagues all generate approximately the same revenue? Add them all together and they’re comparable to the Chinese basketball, Indian cricket, or Dutch soccer leagues. Add all those together and you’re in the neighborhood of Formula E auto racing…what the hell is that? Apparently it’s about as popular as English third division soccer, whatever it is. The two of those put together command about as many eyeballs as Mexican or Belgian soccer, and if those two were to join forces they would approximately equal the income of MLS. So if my calculations are correct, one NFL equals approximately 356 Israeli basketball leagues. I’ll show myself out. ---
**Author:** ![Thing.Fish](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thing.fish/32/9168_2.png) [@Thing.Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing.Fish)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2021, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/66 "2021-11-16T06:34:20Z")
Ha, I lied. Countries where the most popular league isn’t soccer: USA (gridiron), Canada (I assume hockey, though I can’t tell for sure from this chart; not soccer, though), Japan (baseball), Australia (Aussie football), India (cricket), South Korea (baseball), New Zealand (rugby), Sweden (hockey), Finland (hockey), Bangladesh (cricket). Also, Belarus, Slovakia, Croatia, Kazakhstan, and Latvia have KHL teams but only tiny domestic soccer leagues, so maybe hockey there too? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2021, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082/67 "2021-11-16T15:06:54Z")
> [@Thing.Fish](#): > > Countries where the most popular league isn’t soccer: USA (gridiron), Canada (I assume hockey, though I can’t tell for sure from this chart; not soccer, though) Oh yeah. It’s hockey. That would be something of an understatement, if anything. Hockey is much more important to Canadians than any one sport is to Americans. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-it-take-for-one-of-the-four-major-american-sports-leagues-to-disappear/954082.md?page=4)