# What would make Trumps base supporters turn on him? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 28, 2018, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963 "2018-05-28T13:19:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/121 "2018-06-26T03:32:20Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > This might get some attention. I’m guessing there are some Harley riders among thump supporters. I’ve edited the words in brackets to fit this situation: > [@Donnie](#): > > ‘\*f, during the course of a negotiation they want to hit the [American workers] because they think that hits me, I wouldn’t say that’s nice. But I tell you, our [American Workers] are great patriots… These are great patriots. They understand that they’re doing this for the country.’ So, yeah… They’ll blame anyone _but_ their Messiah. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/122 "2018-06-26T12:16:23Z")
That didn’t take long: > [@](#): > > President Donald Trump sharply criticized American motorbike manufacturer Harley-Davidson’s decision today to shift some of its production overseas, a move the company said it is making in order to avoid the president’s tariffs. > > “Surprised that Harley-Davidson, of all companies, would be the first to wave the White Flag,” Trump wrote on Twitter. > … > [Cite](https://www.politico.com/story/2018/06/25/donald-trump-harley-davidson-production-tariffs-670740) Somebody explain to me how Harley’s decision constitutes “waving the White Flag”? Is it cuz it’s a trade WAR and we’re s’posed to be FIGHTING each other instead of getting along? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/123 "2018-06-26T13:26:49Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > So, yeah… They’ll blame anyone _but_ their Messiah. Yep. Most of them I would say are unreachable. The few that are wondering about this will never admit that Trump was a bad choice. ---
**Author:** ![CelticKnot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/celticknot/32/3392_2.png) [@CelticKnot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CelticKnot)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/124 "2018-06-26T14:37:32Z")
I suspect many Trump supporters don’t love Trump as much as they hate being called POS deplorables, Nazis, mouth-breathers, racists, rubes, ignorant, deluded xenophobes (they even know what that word means), unreachable lost causes, angry, inhuman, judgmental, bitter clingers by people who don’t agree with them and refuse to even discuss differences. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/125 "2018-06-26T14:56:00Z")
Well, maybe they should stop supporting policies that put children into concentration camps. ---
**Author:** ![CelticKnot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/celticknot/32/3392_2.png) [@CelticKnot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CelticKnot)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/126 "2018-06-26T15:20:11Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Well, maybe they should stop supporting policies that put children into concentration camps. You mean the court-ordered policy? The one that has been practiced longer than the current administration? Maybe people dislike the constant projection and cognitive dissonance. ---
**Author:** ![DrForrester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8edcca/32.png) [@DrForrester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrForrester)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/127 "2018-06-26T15:28:37Z")
[Some Humans Ain’t Human](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByjghEZ7Xo8) - John Prine ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/128 "2018-06-26T15:38:32Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Well, maybe they should stop supporting policies that put children into concentration camps. > [@CelticKnot](#): > > You mean the court-ordered policy? The one that has been practiced longer than the current administration? > > Maybe people dislike the constant projection and cognitive dissonance. Wrong answer. Many of us don’t like child abuse. Many of us detest the idea of concentration camps here in the United States especially for children. Especially in my state, Texas. ---
**Author:** ![CelticKnot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/celticknot/32/3392_2.png) [@CelticKnot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CelticKnot)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/129 "2018-06-26T15:43:47Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Wrong answer. Many of us don’t like child abuse. Many of us detest the idea of concentration camps here in the United States especially for children. Especially in my state, Texas. Trump’s executive order isn’t good enough, I guess. I suppose Trump haters are hoping for some kind of political Stockholm Syndrome will kick in and all the voters they have abused will somehow side with them? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/130 "2018-06-26T15:50:58Z")
> [@CelticKnot](#): > > Trump’s executive order isn’t good enough, I guess. Trump enforced a non-mandatory policy of separating children from their parents _specifically_ as a terror tactic to frighten people seeking asylum or, yes, illegal entry. Then he blames Democrats for _his_ policy. Then he issues an executive order to stop separating children from their parents. (He could have just stopped enforcing _his_ policy.) And now you’re asking us to praise him for his dog-and-pony show of ‘solving’ a situation he himself created? It’s like an arsonist wanting praise for calling the Fire Department to report the fire he started. ---
**Author:** ![DrForrester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8edcca/32.png) [@DrForrester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrForrester)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/131 "2018-06-26T16:20:11Z")
I recently spoke with a lawyer who has worked within the State Dept for approximately 15 years. His biggest complaint wasn’t any specific policy; it was the fact that policy is made in a spontaneous way. No time is given for reflection or planning or discussion. No allies or team members are consulted. The decision is made - deal with it. People in politics make the assumption that there is some deep planning or strategy. For example: The assumption is made that separating children from their parents was designed to: 1. be cruel to children 2. reveal that Trump is a racist through his deeds rather than through words 3. act as a bargaining chip to attempt to get funding for The Wall 4. to correct Obama’s flawed law enforcement policies 5. be cruel to parents 6. act as a deterrent - to keep immigrants from attempting to cross However, this lawyer saw it all differently. His view was that someone (Bolton) informed Trump that there are immigration laws on the books that weren’t being enforced - and wouldn’t that be a good thing if we enforced all of the laws? Not a thought to strategy, not a thought about the people, not a thought about consequences. Just - Wouldn’t it be great if we enforced the laws? Done. ---
**Author:** ![CelticKnot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/celticknot/32/3392_2.png) [@CelticKnot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CelticKnot)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/132 "2018-06-26T16:22:48Z")
Trump haters have no logical arguments with which to persuade Trump supporters to change their minds, and so believe Trump supporters as too stupid to understand Trump haters’ reasons for hating him. They therefore are exponentially smarter than Trump supporters and are certain that maliciously insulting Trump voters will make these people want to change their votes to the Trump haters. Sheesh. And they think Trump is a megalomaniac. ---
**Author:** ![CelticKnot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/celticknot/32/3392_2.png) [@CelticKnot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CelticKnot)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/133 "2018-06-26T16:26:24Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Trump enforced a non-mandatory policy of separating children from their parents _specifically_ as a terror tactic to frighten people seeking asylum or, yes, illegal entry. > > Then he blames Democrats for _his_ policy. > > Then he issues an executive order to stop separating children from their parents. (He could have just stopped enforcing _his_ policy.) > > And now you’re asking us to praise him for his dog-and-pony show of ‘solving’ a situation he himself created? It’s like an arsonist wanting praise for calling the Fire Department to report the fire he started. So you support open borders with no restrictions on who enters the country? You want your tax money to pay for welfare for half-a-million new arrivals every year? You like the current state of opioids flooding the nation from Mexico? All of that is acceptable as long as no one is detained for entering illegally? ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/134 "2018-06-26T16:50:16Z")
> [@CelticKnot](#): > > So you support open borders with no restrictions on who enters the country? You want your tax money to pay for welfare for half-a-million new arrivals every year? You like the current state of opioids flooding the nation from Mexico? All of that is acceptable as long as no one is detained for entering illegally? _Reductio ad absurdum_ doesn’t fly here. (Speaking of no logic.) And while you’re looking it up, get clear on the definition of Stockholm Syndrome. You’re a little fuzzy on that one. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/135 "2018-06-26T17:23:57Z")
> [@CelticKnot](#): > > So you support open borders with no restrictions on who enters the country? I don’t understand why you guys think it’s an either/or situation. You either don’t understand the ‘excluded middle’ fallacy, or you are deliberately attempting to build a straw man. > [@CelticKnot](#): > > You want your tax money to pay for welfare for half-a-million new arrivals every year? I know Hannity, Loser Donnie, and their ilk tell you that illegal immigrants are stealing our welfare. I don’t know how many times it’s been explained to you lot that illegal immigrants are not eligible for welfare, and illegal immigrants pay more into the system than they will ever receive. But don’t let facts get in the way of your party loyalty. Your Messiah _counts_ on his flock to hate facts. > [@CelticKnot](#): > > You like the current state of opioids flooding the nation from Mexico? Guess what? Mexico does a _lot_ to interdict drugs coming in to the U.S. But since your Messiah has picked a fight with them, they’re thinking maybe they shouldn’t be helping us so much. If more drugs come into the country, it’s _your_ fault. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/136 "2018-06-26T17:44:05Z")
You can’t reason Trump supporters out of support for Trump policies on the basis that they have the same priorities as you (“you” general.) Saying that “Why don’t Trump supporters turn on him because of his separation of kids from parents” is like pro-lifers saying, “Partial-birth abortion is beyond the pale, why hasn’t it made Democrats turn on Planned Parenthood yet?” ---
**Author:** ![rbroome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/838e76/32.png) [@rbroome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rbroome)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/137 "2018-06-26T20:07:22Z")
> [@CelticKnot](#): > > I suspect many Trump supporters don’t love Trump as much as they hate being called POS deplorables, Nazis, mouth-breathers, racists, rubes, ignorant, deluded xenophobes (they even know what that word means), unreachable lost causes, angry, inhuman, judgmental, bitter clingers by people who don’t agree with them and refuse to even discuss differences. I am glad CelticKnot posted this here. This has been going on for a long time-many years certainly-really decades. This projection of stereotypes has succeeded in dividing the nation more completely than it has in a long time. And Trump is adept at strengthening that projection precisely because he believes it helps him. And given that it enabled him to win the Presidency as his first public office, it looks like it does. Which isn’t the critical issue. BTW, do you know who the second most popular President at the 500 day mark is within his own party? Trump. Beaten only by Bush Jr because 500 days was soon after 911. Within his party, no democratic or republican President (again save Bush) has been as popular as Trump. And his popularity as a whole has remained steady throughout his term and he will soon join all the previous Presidents in popularity (the usual trend is for popularity to fall over time, it hasn’t for Trump). The critical issue is projecting stereotypes divides the country and entrenches the existing power structures. As long as the public on both sides allows themselves to be played, the existing political structures and their policies will continue. While that may be good for the factions, it is harming the country and the world. The problem I am concerned about is the projection. As long as democrats continue to treat fellow Americans with distain the divide will strengthen. As long as republicans continue to criticize democrats personally, the divide will strengthen. Both sides can and should argue about the policies, but when the discussion moves to personal attacks, or comments that are perceived to be personal attacks, the power structures win and the public loses. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/138 "2018-06-26T20:28:09Z")
> [@rbroome](#): > > The critical issue is projecting stereotypes divides the country and entrenches the existing power structures. Stereotype: ‘a widely held but fixed and oversimplified image or idea of a particular type of person or thing.’ Individuals of the Tea Party extraction tend to behave a certain way. And they continually demonstrate that behaviour. If people object to being associated with the stereotype, they should stop associating with the people who do these things. They should stop trying to legislate whom people can love. They should stop advocating the ideals that 420,000 Americans died defeating 70 years ago. They should stop giving money away to the people who least need it. They should practice the ideals put forth by their professed religion. They should let others practice _their_ religions in the manner they choose, as stipulated by the Constitution they claim to adore. In other words: If you don’t like the stereotype, stop perpetuating the stereotype. If you’re not personally perpetuating the stereotype, distance yourself from and condemn the people who do. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/139 "2018-06-26T20:49:11Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > If you don’t like the stereotype, stop perpetuating the stereotype. Are black people to blame for the “black people are criminals” stereotype? Are Asian people to blame for the “Asians are good at math” stereotype? Are Arab Muslim people to blame for the “Arab Muslims are terrorists” stereotype? Are Hispanic people to blame for the “Hispanics are illegal border-crossers” stereotype? Are Jewish people to blame for the “Jews are bankers” stereotype? ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963/140 "2018-06-26T20:59:43Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Are black people to blame for the “black people are criminals” stereotype? > > Are Asian people to blame for the “Asians are good at math” stereotype? > > Are Arab Muslim people to blame for the “Arab Muslims are terrorists” stereotype? > > Are Hispanic people to blame for the “Hispanics are illegal border-crossers” stereotype? > > Are Jewish people to blame for the “Jews are bankers” stereotype? There is a vast difference between _choosing_ to belong to a group and naturally _being_ in a group (by birth, way raised, etc.). A _vast_ difference. If you _choose_ to be someone who is thrilled that the most infamous crooked, numbskull businessman in America is President, you deserve the blowback you get. Your argument is notoriously specious. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-trumps-base-supporters-turn-on-him/814963.md?page=8)