# What would make you decide to buy the new Tesla Model 3? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 22, 2016, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862 "2016-03-22T15:06:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/261 "2016-04-09T14:07:12Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > God yes. I’m 6’4 and my Wife is 5’1". And it seems that now they are going away from adjustable peddles to a telescoping steering wheel. I guess that alleviates the air bag problem, > > > [@SpyOne](#): > > > > No, no it doesn’t. > > The airbag is in the steering wheel, and the issue is that short people sit too close to the steering wheel because the airbag was designed for people your height. > > For me it is my short legs that are the issue because A)I have long arms, and B) my overall height isn’t very short. I am 5’8" tall, but my inseam is 29", and that means if the pedals don’t adjust I have to sit as close to the wheel as your wife. > > Which means that, rather than inflating into a soft pillow before I move forward enough to hit it, the inflating airbag will hit me in the face and chest at several hundred miles an hour as it deploys, most likely killing me. > > > > That may have overstated it. The phrase used most often is that the airbag deploying is “more likely to kill me than to save my life”. I see what your saying. The intent of the telescoping steering wheel is so that as you move the seat forward to reach the peddles, you can move the steering wheel forward to get it out of your face. Doesn’t seem like it’s enough though. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/262 "2016-04-09T14:43:15Z")
> [@The\_Niply\_Elder](#): > > Because whenever Tesla rolls out a software update it gets marked as a negative in the legacy car-scoring system. I receive tons of app updates on my phone, and it does not mean that the phone has shitty quality/reliability. After the iOS 9.3.1 update I lost a ton of data from my iPhone, I’d say that’s pretty shitty quality. > [@](#): > > Also what do you mean mediocre car? What other car can you buy that has 762hp and 713lb-ft of torque all wheel drive for $130000, that does the 1/4 mile in 10.9s? Plus 5 star safety rating, autopilot, premium wheels and brakes, 8 year/infinity mile warranty, free supercharger juice and 90 MPGe? If these things qualify as “mediocre” in your world, then, I suspect that you are letting your current employment cloud your objective judgment. > **[Tesla Model 3 Loses CR Recommendation Over Reliability Issues - Consumer Reports](https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/car-reliability-owner-satisfaction/tesla-model-3-loses-cr-recommendation-over-reliability-issues-a2332354847/)** > > The Tesla Model 3 has lost its CR recommendation. Consumer Reports can no longer recommend the electric sedan because CR members say they’ve identified a number of reliability problems with their cars. The kinds of quality problems Model S owners are reporting would have any conventional car (especially one from Detroit) dismissed as a piece of junk. It’s the same as BMW; it’s kind of a meme in car circles that you don’t want to own a German car which doesn’t have a warranty. But people like the cars enough where they can overlook the downsides. And that’s fine, I’d just prefer they’d be honest about it. eta: and see, you’re doing exactly what I groused about a few posts up. You’ve picked a “team” and now you’re attacking anyone who isn’t on your team. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/263 "2016-04-09T15:48:35Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Golf carts preceeded the EV-1. Therefore, the Bolt was inspired by a golf cart. Since Golf carts aren’t cars your explanation of this bit of logic should be interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/264 "2016-04-09T16:22:13Z")
As Tesla [walks back](https://www.yahoo.com/tech/tesla-already-lowering-model-3-expectations-two-key-194258835.html) some of it’s initial standard options on the Model 3 and people realize they [won’t be getting the Federal rebate](http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/226031-tesla-model-3-buyers-you-think-youre-getting-a-7500-tax-credit-not-so-fast) because of the previous sales of other Tesla cars there’s going to be a greater cost gap between the Model 3 and most all other EV’s available. I wouldn’t be surprised if the tax credit is extended (unofficially because of the Model 3). So I’m officially predicting it now. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Niply\_Elder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8e8cbc/32.png) [@The\_Niply\_Elder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Niply_Elder)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/265 "2016-04-09T16:30:37Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > After the iOS 9.3.1 update I lost a ton of data from my iPhone, I’d say that’s pretty shitty quality. > > [Tesla Model 3 Loses CR Recommendation | Reliability - Consumer Reports](http://www.consumerreports.org/cars/tesla-reliability-doesnt-match-its-high-performance/) > The kinds of quality problems Model S owners are reporting would have any conventional car (especially one from Detroit) dismissed as a piece of junk. It’s the same as BMW; it’s kind of a meme in car circles that you don’t want to own a German car which doesn’t have a warranty. But people like the cars enough where they can overlook the downsides. And that’s fine, I’d just prefer they’d be honest about it. > > eta: and see, you’re doing exactly what I groused about a few posts up. You’ve picked a “team” and now you’re attacking anyone who isn’t on your team. The kind of problems reported concentrate on squeaks and rattles, which naturally become more pronounced in a quiet car. This hardly constitutes being dismissed as a piece of junk (especially one from Detroit). All other problems related to battery and drivetrain are all covered by warranty. Also cars mentioned as having lower than average reliability include the Corvette. If this is your definition of what constitutes “a piece of junk” then we’ll have to respectfully disagree. It’s not that “I’ve picked a team”. I’m not attacking any one, just lousy unfounded argumentations. Now can you back up your assertion obtectively that the Model S is a mediocre car? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Niply\_Elder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8e8cbc/32.png) [@The\_Niply\_Elder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Niply_Elder)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/266 "2016-04-09T16:40:37Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > As Tesla [walks back](https://www.yahoo.com/tech/tesla-already-lowering-model-3-expectations-two-key-194258835.html) some of it’s initial standard options on the Model 3 and people realize they [won’t be getting the Federal rebate](http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/226031-tesla-model-3-buyers-you-think-youre-getting-a-7500-tax-credit-not-so-fast) because of the previous sales of other Tesla cars there’s going to be a greater cost gap between the Model 3 and most all other EV’s available. > > I wouldn’t be surprised if the tax credit is extended (unofficially because of the Model 3). So I’m officially predicting it now. That Yahoo article is a bunch of nonsense. Free supercharging was never on the table for a midlevel sedan. Same with autopilot, it was always expected to be an option, same as with other cars that sport similar capable navigation systems. The majority of the cost of any autopilot system is in the software not the hardware. Hardware is cheap to produce. Making it do something intelligent is the expensive part. So you have the option of paying or not for the service, and probably subscribe to the system at a later date after purchasing. The safety rating section is pure speculation. The high safety ratings of the Model S come thanks to generous crumple zones all around the vehicle, which the Model 3 shares this architecture, so there is no real world indication that the case would be different. Jumping to conclusions because a word or two were changed on a webpage is nonsense. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/267 "2016-04-09T17:00:32Z")
> [@The\_Niply\_Elder](#): > > Now can you back up your assertion obtectively that the Model S is a mediocre car? There’s no way you can be objective about that. You tout the straight-line acceleration, and it’s true that the Model S P90D with Ludicrous Mode is mind-boggingly impressive at that. But when people take them to road courses, which is my preferred method of racing entertainment, they tend to lap slower than Miatas until they go into limp mode 3 minutes into a lapping session due to battery heat. As a comfortable, daily-driveable drag car, I would subjectively rate the Model S as “off the charts phenomenal.” As a performance car in general, I would rate it well below “mediocre;” I actually wouldn’t rate it at all because it’s inability to turn a decent hot lap without breaking renders it useless. It’s superb at being an electric car; it’s pretty bad at long trips. It’s superb at smartphone integration and internet connectivity; it’s pretty bad as a luxury car. Personally I think “mediocre” is a bit unfair, but it’s really hard to place it on the spectrum because it’s just so different. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Niply\_Elder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8e8cbc/32.png) [@The\_Niply\_Elder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Niply_Elder)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/268 "2016-04-09T17:51:34Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > There’s no way you can be objective about that. You tout the straight-line acceleration, and it’s true that the Model S P90D with Ludicrous Mode is mind-boggingly impressive at that. But when people take them to road courses, which is my preferred method of racing entertainment, they tend to lap slower than Miatas until they go into limp mode 3 minutes into a lapping session due to battery heat. As a comfortable, daily-driveable drag car, I would subjectively rate the Model S as “off the charts phenomenal.” As a performance car in general, I would rate it well below “mediocre;” I actually wouldn’t rate it at all because it’s inability to turn a decent hot lap without breaking renders it useless. > > It’s superb at being an electric car; it’s pretty bad at long trips. It’s superb at smartphone integration and internet connectivity; it’s pretty bad as a luxury car. > > Personally I think “mediocre” is a bit unfair, but it’s really hard to place it on the spectrum because it’s just so different. Ok I see what you are saying. To be fair though, people who take their cars to the track do so as a fairly serious hobby, with supporting equipment, spare parts, a whole kit of things for a racing weekend. Having a racing weekend in an electric car requires a different set of supporting equipment, which is still being hashed out (ie spare batteries with supercharging and cooling equipment, etc). I think at this point ICE and EV racing is kind of like comparing football and hockey: both sports require different sets of peripheral equipment, and EV racing being so new best practices and such are still getting determined. Now check this video [Tesla Model S P85D Laps Nurburgring In 8:50 – Video](http://insideevs.com/tesla-model-s-p85d-laps-nurburgring-850-video/) ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/269 "2016-04-09T17:51:39Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Since Golf carts aren’t cars your explanation of this bit of logic should be interesting. Why should all of my statements make as much sense as any of yours? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/270 "2016-04-09T17:57:18Z")
> [@The\_Niply\_Elder](#): > > That Yahoo article is a bunch of nonsense. Free supercharging was never on the table for a midlevel sedan. Same with autopilot, it was always expected to be an option, same as with other cars that sport similar capable navigation systems. The majority of the cost of any autopilot system is in the software not the hardware. Hardware is cheap to produce. Making it do something intelligent is the expensive part. So you have the option of paying or not for the service, and probably subscribe to the system at a later date after purchasing. The safety rating section is pure speculation. The high safety ratings of the Model S come thanks to generous crumple zones all around the vehicle, which the Model 3 shares this architecture, so there is no real world indication that the case would be different. Jumping to conclusions because a word or two were changed on a webpage is nonsense. The Yahoo article mirrored what was said after watching the announcement. > [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Just finished watching the webcast. Looks great! The nose could use maybe a bit of tweaking, but I like the overall body style. Almost like a combo of the Roadster and Model S. Nice looking body creases. > > 115,000 preorders in the past 24 hours. Pretty amazing. Glad I got in early! > > Autopilot standard, supercharging standard, 215 mile base range, \<6 s 0-60 mph. They’ll have faster models, too. They didn’t mention AWD (IIRC), but I’m guessing that’ll be an option. I’m sure a larger battery will also be a possibility. Very pleased overall. Tesla changed the wording on the website for a reason. It was misleading. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/271 "2016-04-09T18:20:36Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Why should all of my statements make as much sense as any of yours? Because I laid out a cogent argument and you posted something seriously stupid in retort. The EV1 was clearly built prior to Tesla cars. It was purpose built to gauge public opinion and received a great deal of publicity as such. None of the GM cars to follow were built to compete against Tesla cars which were specifically built as expensive sports cars. The Volt and Bolt are extensions of the EV-1 and cars like the Leaf and not the roadster. They were going to be built regardless of the Roadster. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/272 "2016-04-09T18:39:31Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > The EV1 was clearly built prior to Tesla cars. It was purpose built to gauge public opinion and received a great deal of publicity as such. **None of the GM cars to follow were built to compete against Tesla cars** which were specifically built as expensive sports cars. **The Volt and Bolt are extensions of the EV-1 and cars like the Leaf and not the roadster. They were going to be built regardless of the Roadster.** That’s not what the top GM vehicle designer at the time says, but I’m sure you know better than him. Right? Damn lying again executives, not agreeing with you! ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/273 "2016-04-09T19:11:26Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > That’s not what the top GM vehicle designer at the time says, but I’m sure you know better than him. Right? Damn lying again executives, not agreeing with you! And yet he didn’t build a competitor to anyTesla cars. And his opinion of Tesla is [dismal](http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/18/is-bob-lutz-wrong-about-tesla-motors.aspx)at [best](http://gas2.org/2016/02/08/bob-lutz-bashes-tesla-model-x-disses-electric-car-market/). His opinion of their financial situation makes mine look positively glowing. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/274 "2016-04-09T19:44:20Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > And yet he didn’t build a competitor to anyTesla cars. And his opinion of Tesla is [dismal](http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/18/is-bob-lutz-wrong-about-tesla-motors.aspx)at > > > [@](#): > > > > [best](http://gas2.org/2016/02/08/bob-lutz-bashes-tesla-model-x-disses-electric-car-market/). His opinion of their financial situation makes mine look positively glowing. But that isn’t the question. The issue is whether the Volt and Bolt sprang out of the EV-1, as you claim, or from other cars, as I claim. Here are some direct quotes from Bob Lutz: > [@](#): > > See, I wanted to do a 200-mile-range concept car, essentially what Tesla did, except mine was going to be a four-door sedan… At one point, I sat next to (then GM CEO) Rick Wagoner at a meeting and he put his hand on my arm and said, “Bob, we lost a billion dollars on EV1. How much do you suggest we lose the next time around?” So that shut me up for that meeting. As you can see, both Wagoner and Lutz thought EV-1 was a reason NOT to do the Volt. > [@](#): > > [On the announcement of the 200 mile Roadster] That tore it for me. If some Silicon Valley start-up can solve this equation, no one is going to tell me anymore that it’s unfeasible. So it was Tesla, not EV-1, that convinced Lutz that practical EVs were possible. > [@](#): > > In 2006 I could think of only one company that openly was planning to build an electric vehicle powered by lithium ion batteries and that was Tesla… I will tell you that they gave us the major impetus, and I am thankful to Tesla for furnishing us with the truth that was needed for us to champion the Volt to the corporation that other people believed in lithium ion technology as well. Speaks for itself, eh? But I’m sure there’s lots of quotes from him saying that the Volt exists because of EV-1. Tons. I’ll wait for you to post them. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/275 "2016-04-09T20:06:19Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > : > > As you can see, both Wagoner and Lutz thought EV-1 was a reason NOT to do the Volt. What is shows is that Lutz had the idea independent of Musk. And it shows because the Bolt will deliver at least a year ahead of the Model 3. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/276 "2016-04-09T20:24:27Z")
Neither of your statements make any sense. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Niply\_Elder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8e8cbc/32.png) [@The\_Niply\_Elder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Niply_Elder)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/277 "2016-04-09T20:24:45Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > What is shows is that Lutz had the idea independent of Musk. And it shows because the Bolt will deliver at least a year ahead of the Model 3. Suuuure just like Newton and Liebnitz :p:p You still haven’t provided a shred of evidence that the Bolt will be mass produced though. If Chevy delivers a single Bolt a year ahead of a Tesla Model 3, that proves nothing. Let’s see some actual planned production numbers. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/278 "2016-04-09T20:36:17Z")
> [@The\_Niply\_Elder](#): > > You still haven’t provided a shred of evidence that the Bolt will be mass produced though. Your question literally makes no sense. It’s going on sale this year. [They have the capacity of 50,000 cars](http://www.hybridcars.com/not-a-compliance-car-gm-says-2017-chevy-bolt-production-capacity-exceeds-50000-per-year/). You’ll be able to drive one to a Tesla store a year later to look at Model 3. Not that you’ll be able to drive a Model 3 home but hope springs eternal. By the time the Model 3 hits the streets GM will be on their 2nd or 3rd year of production. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/279 "2016-04-09T20:44:25Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Neither of your statements make any sense. See, I wanted to do a 200-mile-range concept car, essentially what Tesla did, except mine was going to be a four-door sedan… ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2016, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862/280 "2016-04-09T20:44:41Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Your question literally makes no sense. It’s going on sale this year. [They have the capacity of 50,000 cars](http://www.hybridcars.com/not-a-compliance-car-gm-says-2017-chevy-bolt-production-capacity-exceeds-50000-per-year/). 50,580 Model S sales in 2015 =\> niche Theoretical 50,000 Bolt sales per year =\> mass market [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-make-you-decide-to-buy-the-new-tesla-model-3/749862.md?page=15)