# What would REALLY happen if abortion was banned? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 19, 2005, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921 "2005-10-19T16:03:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/1 "2005-10-19T16:03:11Z")
I’m a 47 year old Maryland resident, and so far as I can recall abortion on demand had been available to women (in MD) for most of my adult life. Re the pending SCOTUS appointment of Miers (or someone conservative) to the court, if conservatives do get the majority needed to overturn Roe V Wade, and if it is then overturned what next? I know this sounds a bit basic, but available abortion has been a part of my cultural landscape, and I’m not sure how it’s being made illegal would be implemented. Personally, I think the political shit storm that would ensue would damage the Republican party behind anything they can imagine and would ensure the rise of the Democrats back to power. What do you think would happen on a practical political and cultural level if it was overturned? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/2 "2005-10-19T16:07:14Z")
Most states would allow abortion, but a few wouldn’t and the Democrats would reep huge poltical success based on that. Kind of like what would happen to the Republicans if the SCOTUS declared SSM to be a constitutional right. This exact thread has been done before, btw, so you might want to do some searching to find it. It wasn’t that long ago. ---
**Author:** ![CartesianDaemon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9a140/32.png) [@CartesianDaemon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CartesianDaemon)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/3 "2005-10-19T16:07:56Z")
I don’t know the details, but there’s societies/cultures where it is. I think still in Ireland? Certainly disapproved of. WAG: number of abortions drop, people who can go abroad for one, some people do it illegally and probably dangerously. ---
**Author:** ![elmwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmwood/32/3060_2.png) [@elmwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elmwood)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/4 "2005-10-19T16:15:06Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > Most states would allow abortion, but a few wouldn’t and the Democrats would reep huge poltical success based on that. I’m sure there would be some states where it would be made illegal. [South Dakota tried to ban abortion already](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=239164&highlight=%22south+dakota%22+abortion). I would expect that along with South Dakota, Utah, Kansas, South Carolina and Oklahoma would ban abortion if Roe v Wade were overturned. ---
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/5 "2005-10-19T16:16:48Z")
> [@CartesianDaemon](#): > > WAG: number of abortions drop, people who can go abroad for one, some people do it illegally and probably dangerously. Probably not dangerously… at least, no more so than legal abortions are. [That is, if Planned Parenthood’s claims are to be believed.](http://www.nrlc.org/abortion/facts/responseargument4.html) ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/6 "2005-10-19T16:25:45Z")
Quite a few women would die. If abortion is murder, many doctors/hospitals will refuse to help a pregnant woman, for fear of being accused of murder. That’s been the result of our financial blackmail of the Third World; “No money if you perform abortions” amounts to “let pregnant women die, then hose the blood off the hospital steps”. You’ll also see increased, widespread child abuse; unwanted children make great victims, and cultures/groups that ban abortion tend to be very brutal towards children. ---
**Author:** ![elmwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmwood/32/3060_2.png) [@elmwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elmwood)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/7 "2005-10-19T16:26:33Z")
Sorry for not incorporating these thoughts into the previous post. 1. [Germany bans abortion after the first trimester](http://www.germany-info.org/relaunch/info/facts/facts/questions_en/health/healthissues3.html). Germany was very reluctant to legalize abortion, because of its use in Nazi-era eugenics programs. Abortion is illegal in Ireland unless the mother’s life is at risk. According to Wikipedia, [Chile, El Salvador and Malta](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion#Abortion_law) ban abortion entirely. [Here’s an interesting map from Wikipedia](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/29/AbortionLawsMap.png) that shows the status of abortion laws around the world. 2. If abortion is banned in the US, crime would probably skyrocket in 14 to 18 years. [Read chapter 4 of _Freakonomics_ by Steven Levitt and Steven Dubner.](http://www.freakonomics.com/ch4.php) ---
**Author:** ![audiobottle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc8723/32.png) [@audiobottle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/audiobottle)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/8 "2005-10-19T16:29:58Z")
I believe there is a commonly prescribed drug right now that if taken in larger doses can induce abortion relatively safely. Not as safely as a doctor assisted abortion or a straight up abortion pill, but enough so that a return to the back alley abortions is unlikely. ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/9 "2005-10-19T16:36:29Z")
Aren’t the laws that forbade abortion before 1973 still on the books? Wouldn’t any laws that had previously banned abortion become valid again if Roe v. Wade were overturned? Where’s **Bricker**? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/10 "2005-10-19T16:44:01Z")
The Earth would open up, frogs would fall like rain, rivers of blood would wash through the Midwest. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/11 "2005-10-19T16:48:18Z")
> [@astro](#): > > Re the pending SCOTUS appointment of Miers (or someone conservative) to the court, if conservatives do get the majority needed to overturn Roe V Wade, and if it is then overturned what next? My understanding is that it would become a states issue instead of a Federally mandated issue…i.e. the individual states would decide. From what I gather, most states would simply go on as before…i.e. allow abortions. Some states would set limits, some would ban it all together. Why folks think people would have to go abroad or get illegal and dangerous abortions is beyond me…if your state didn’t allow it then you would simply go to a neighboring state. I doubt many states would be able to push through a total ban on abortion. So…not exactly the end of the world. Not that its likely to happen in any case of course but you have to give the paranoid SOMETHING to worry about. -XT ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/12 "2005-10-19T16:49:26Z")
> [@Crotalus](#): > > Aren’t the laws that forbade abortion before 1973 still on the books? Wouldn’t any laws that had previously banned abortion become valid again if Roe v. Wade were overturned? Where’s **Bricker**? Yes, they would. But it would start up the whole debate at the state level, and some states with those laws still on the books might legalize abortion now. It’s hard to tell. **Der Trihs** ’ predictions are, as usual, absurd. There is no indication that hospitals would refuse to treat pregnant women. Most women living in states that outlaw abortion would simply travel to another state where it’s legal if they wanted one. I’m not saying that this would be a good situation, just that most of the country favors legalized abortion in the 1st trimester, so I think it’s safe to say that most of the states would allow abortion. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Arky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/87869e/32.png) [@An\_Arky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Arky)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/13 "2005-10-19T17:03:01Z")
I almost wish they would overturn Roe v. Wade just to shut all those anti-choice people the hell up. While they’re at it, they could legalize school prayer and teaching intelligent design, too, just to shut those (same) people up. Then I’d sit back and absolutely revel in the backlash. So, I think it would be a boon for forward-thinking people. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/14 "2005-10-19T17:03:10Z")
**astro** , perhaps you missed this in another current Great Debates thread, but your take on public attitudes towards abortion is a bit off. In a national poll published in 2003 by the vociferously pro-choice Center for the Advancement of Women, headed by former Plannet Parenthood president Faye Wattleton, 1,000 American women were asked about abortion. 51 percent wanted to ban abortion altogether or to limit it to cases of rape, incest, and where the mother’s life is endangered. Another 17 percent said the procedure should be available under stricter limits than now apply. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/15 "2005-10-19T17:13:58Z")
You get different responses in different polls, but if you look at all of the ones [here](http://www.pollingreport.com/abortion.htm), it seems like most people in the US are at least mildly pro-choice and that they don’t want \*Roe \*overturned. > [@](#): > > “In 1973 the Roe versus Wade decision established a woman’s constitutional right to an abortion, at least in the first three months of pregnancy. Would you like to see the Supreme Court completely overturn its Roe versus Wade decision, or not?” > > Yes 29% > No 65% > Unsure 6% > > results from July '05 ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/16 "2005-10-19T17:23:45Z")
I’m betting it depends on how it gets “banned”. If Roe v. Wade is overturned, and states are allowed to regulate abortion, then some states would ban it outright, some states would allow it under practically any circumstance short of actual crowning. and many or most would allow it under the same circumstances as it is now. Then there will be a lot of interstate traffic for women who want abortions. And the pro-abortion types will go berserk. If the Supremes find that a fetus has a right to life, then all bets are off. But the pro-abortion types will still go berserk. Nobody will be able to get a Constitutional amendment passed allowing abortion, since no one will be able to agree on the wording. If the Court bans it, I expect some major efforts at packing the court with Justices. The Dems will filibuster anybody who doesn’t explicitly promise to overturn the banning. And the Republicans will filibuster anyone who does. In the meantime, people will make a lot of noise, and adjust. Black markets will spring up for RU-486, but most women will take high doses of the BC pill as a “morning after” drug. Those that are too stupid to do so will wind up with children they don’t want, much as they do now but in higher numbers. I wonder if the pro-choicers will react by calling for strict constructionism. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/17 "2005-10-19T17:24:52Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > There is no indication that hospitals would refuse to treat pregnant women . So a for-profit business is going to sacrifice itself for principle ? > [@John Mace](#): > > Most women living in states that outlaw abortion would simply travel to another state where it’s legal if they wanted one. I’m not saying that this would be a good situation, just that most of the country favors legalized abortion in the 1st trimester, so I think it’s safe to say that most of the states would allow abortion. That’s what waiting periods and so forth are for; they make abortion unaffordable to poor women, who can’t afford the repeated travel costs. Besides, no doubt the anti-abortion state will just arrest her when she returns home. Once some returning women are executed, the rest will get the message. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/18 "2005-10-19T17:34:49Z")
The fact that the poll by the Center for the Advancement of Women is more specific than the Pew poll cited shows perhaps that there is misunderstanding on what “completely overturn its Roe versus Wade decision” means. There may be a common misperception that overturning _Roe v. Wade_ means banning all abortions, when in fact it means returning the decision to the individual states. In general, polls that offer a larger selection of alternatives, as CAW’s does, offer a more accurate reflection of public opinion than polls that requre polarized yes/no answers, as the Pew one does. Look at the CBS News poll taken in July-August 2005, on [that same page](http://www.pollingreport.com/abortion.htm). The question: > [@](#): > > “What is your personal feeling about abortion? (1) It should be permitted in all cases. (2) It should be permitted, but subject to greater restrictions than it is now. (3) It should be permitted only in cases such as rape, incest and to save the woman’s life. OR, (4) It should only be permitted to save the woman’s life.” produced results very similar to the 2003 CAW poll. 53 percent wanted to ban abortion altogether or permit it only in cases such as rape, incest, or to save the woman’s life. An additional 15 percent want abortion available under greater restrictions than currently exist. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/19 "2005-10-19T17:38:53Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > Yes, they would. But it would start up the whole debate at the state level, and some states with those laws still on the books might legalize abortion now. It’s hard to tell. The debate will certainly be at the Federal level too. Abortion would clearly fall under its power by way of the commerce clause. Republicans control the government right now, would we see a law banning abortion? I suspect not becuase not only do they not have the votes to pass a fillibuster they would be committing political suicide by doing so. There sure would be a lot of pressure from their base to do so though. So on the bright side if Roe gets overturned it should make for some good political theatre. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2005, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921/20 "2005-10-19T17:40:43Z")
> [@Der Trihs](#): > > If abortion is murder, many doctors/hospitals will refuse to help a pregnant woman, for fear of being accused of murder. Abortion was illegal in many states in the 1960s. Do you have any evidence that during those years, hospitals refused to help pregnant women? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-really-happen-if-abortion-was-banned/326921.md?page=2)