# What would you do if an angry mob demands you raise your fist in support? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 26, 2020, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071 "2020-08-26T14:49:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![urbanredneck2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/5f8ce5/32.png) [@urbanredneck2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/urbanredneck2)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/241 "2020-09-01T11:25:08Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > Yes, me too. I’d chant whatever the mob wanted, whether it was BLM or MAGA, and hope they left me alone. I also find these responses quite odd. Why escalate the situation when you are hopelessly outnumbered? Couple of possible reasons: Maybe your standing up to them might encourage others to do so? Giving in might embolden them to do much worse like demand money. I mean in a way she is a modern day version of Rosa Parks and others who refuse to bow down to the demands of a mob. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/242 "2020-09-01T11:32:39Z")
> [@urbanredneck2](#): > > I mean in a way she is a modern day version of Rosa Parks and others who refuse to bow down to the demands of a mob. Lol, I wouldn’t go that far. The woman in the video was braver than me, sure (or more foolish), but Rosa Parks had the whole legal system and power of the government against her, not a temporary mob. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/243 "2020-09-01T11:38:24Z")
> [@urbanredneck2](#): > > I mean in a way she is a modern day version of Rosa Parks and others who refuse to bow down to the demands of a mob. Oh for the love of god. No she isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/244 "2020-09-01T12:18:29Z")
I’m sorry, I’m not being fair. That’s me before coffee. I’d say this woman is more like Jesus. There she was, being persecuted by the social justice warriors just like Jesus was by the Romans, but she kept her faith in God i mean America. Then they crucified her, and three days later she _rose from her tomb_. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/245 "2020-09-01T13:43:11Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > Yes, me too. I’d chant whatever the mob wanted, whether it was BLM or MAGA, and hope they left me alone. I also find these responses quite odd. Why escalate the situation when you are hopelessly outnumbered? Speaking for myself, I don’t like it when people act like they can tell me what to do - even if it’s something I agree with. It just really, really pisses me off. There’s even a word for it in my culture: _Davka_, which is more or less untranslatable, but basically means, “Because fuck you, that’s why.” ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/246 "2020-09-01T14:06:12Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > There’s even a word for it in my culture: _Davka_ , which is more or less untranslatable, but basically means, “Because fuck you, that’s why.” The word may be untranslatable, but the concept comes through loud and clear! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/247 "2020-09-01T14:08:32Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > If the customer comes around to _your_ side of the sales counter and gets ten inches from your face to launch his tirade, I would think it reasonable to feel that there is a threat of imminent violence against you, even in the absence of an explicit verbal threat. Been there, done that. Didn’t escalate to violence, even though I could have rationalized a justification for slamming their head into the frosty machine. When I worked for the cable company, you should have seen how people would try to intimidate me out of not turning off their cable. Or even the screaming in my face when I showed up to _fix_ their cable. People do a whole lot of yelling. People get in other’s faces. People are assholes pretty regularly. It pretty rarely turns into violence. Feeling intimidated is not a justification to initiate violence. Unless, of course, you are a cop with qualified immunity. > [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > There are at least a couple of people in the front line of that mob who fit the latter description; their posture, vocal volume, and extreme physical proximity are all intended to intimidate the victim into compliance. I think it is reasonable to feel physically threatened under such circumstances. Let’s be pragmatic for a moment. There are a bunch of angry people yelling at you. You feel as though this justifies the use of violence against them, and let’s say for the sake of argument that legally and ethically it does. Is it still a good idea? They are a mob, you are one person. It seems the last thing that you want is escalation. If there is violence, then you are probably going to end up being hurt much more than any of the mob. Even if you have a gun and start killing people, you are going to be overwhelmed and the gun taken from you, and even if not used _on_ you, still be useless to prevent the mob from responding to your shooting at their members. I just don’t see the upside. You are on questionable grounds as far as legality, and you are on pretty shaky ground as far as good judgment goes, if you initiate violence against a mob. > [@urbanredneck2](#): > > Maybe your standing up to them might encourage others to do so? > > Giving in might embolden them to do much worse like demand money. Standing your ground is different from initiating violence. Were they a bunch of MAGA hat wearers, I would refuse to engage them, and simply ignore them. By even acknowledging them, you are increasing tensions. By initiating violence, you are escalating. > [@Alessan](#): > > Speaking for myself, I don’t like it when people act like they can tell me what to do - even if it’s something I agree with. It just really, really pisses me off. There’s even a word for it in my culture: _Davka_ , which is more or less untranslatable, but basically means, “Because fuck you, that’s why.” Pisses me off to. But being pissed off is _not_ a justification for violence. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/248 "2020-09-01T14:47:45Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Pisses me off to. But being pissed off is _not_ a justification for violence. Of course it isn’t. I like my resistance physically passive and verbally active. ---
**Author:** ![urbanredneck2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/5f8ce5/32.png) [@urbanredneck2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/urbanredneck2)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/249 "2020-09-01T15:29:48Z")
Do you all think any of the protesters realize just how BAD this makes the whole BLM movmeent look? I mean the “theme” is that was what you could call it was “White Silence is Violence” and they had the idea of marching thru and demanding white people raise their fists in support or they would demand they do it thru… not what sure what to call it. No actual “raise your fist or else” but their was at least some pretty strong “active discussion” with those who refused. They must have known that some would refuse AND those refusals would end up getting on camera. Didnt they realize no good would come out of this? What were they hoping would happen? Didn’t they see how this would hurt the BLM movement? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/250 "2020-09-01T15:37:19Z")
> [@urbanredneck2](#): > > Do you all think any of the protesters realize just how BAD this makes the whole BLM movmeent look? No, because it doesn’t, any more than Dylann Roof makes all gun owners look bad. It makes them look bad. And Fox News and their flunkies try to smear the entire movement, but you shouldn’t cooperate with such an underhanded propaganda tactic. You can do better than that. ---
**Author:** ![urbanredneck2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/5f8ce5/32.png) [@urbanredneck2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/urbanredneck2)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/251 "2020-09-01T15:42:57Z")
Actually the fact a “legitimate” news source who is accused of being for the left like CNN if they do NOT cover something like this makes them look bad also. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/252 "2020-09-01T15:52:44Z")
To you? What, are you not gonna vote for Biden now? Or are you still going to vote for Biden, but Black Lives Matter just lost your enthusiastic support? ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/253 "2020-09-01T15:55:38Z")
I strongly support BLM, but I would probably be pissed off if these assholes got in my face at a time of a raging pandemic and tried to bully me into pumping my fist. I hate bullies and mobs in general, regardless of political persuasion. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/254 "2020-09-01T16:25:39Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > My bolding. You may not be aware of this, but I’m pretty sure there is no such criminal charge as “whatever”. Feel free to describe what specific criminal charges should be brought against people yelling at diners, if you believe you are correct. Don’t be silly. Few or none of us are cops or lawyers. There’s almost certainly some law being potentially broken here- probably assault or trespass of some kind. So just because he may not know the exact charge doesn’t mean it’s not correct. Here’s the thing- just because they’re BLM people doesn’t mean that the Democrats/Left need to act like they don’t need to be checked by the law. This is NOT appropriate or acceptable behavior by anyone- it would be every bit as obnoxious and offensive if it was MAGA people, and would deserve the same response from law enforcement. Look at it this way- how would we feel if people roamed around in intimidating groups trying to get people to sign political petitions? TPTB would crack down on that so fast our heads would spin. And this should be the same exact thing- trying to compel someone to give a salute or say something in particular through intimidation (which it was, even if there were not actual threatening words) shouldn’t be tolerated in a civil society. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/255 "2020-09-01T16:44:06Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Let’s be pragmatic for a moment. There are a bunch of angry people yelling at you. You feel as though this justifies the use of violence against them, and let’s say for the sake of argument that legally and ethically it does. > > Is it still a good idea? They are a mob, you are one person. It seems the last thing that you want is escalation. If there is violence, then you are probably going to end up being hurt much more than any of the mob. > > Even if you have a gun and start killing people, you are going to be overwhelmed and the gun taken from you, and even if not used _on_ you, still be useless to prevent the mob from responding to your shooting at their members. You probably didn’t see my post upthread (not complaining, it’s an awfully long thread now) in which I said pretty much exactly that: > [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > I’d say the diner in the video handled it about as well as possible under the circumstances; she kept her cool, and refused to reward their brownshirt tactics. > > The one or two people coming to within a foot of her face and yelling are behaving in a threatening manner. I think administering pepper spray or a broken nose at that moment would be entirely justified from a legal and moral standpoint, but it would also be ill-advised: you would just transform an angry mob into a violent mob, and you’re greatly outnumbered. Taking out your cell phone to call the cops might also be risky, at least to your phone: it’s not hard to imagine someone swiping/slapping your phone out of your hand. > > If I saw this happening to another diner, I would probably try to dial 911 before the mob came to me. I would tell them there’s an angry mob working together to intimidate bystanders, and I’m very concerned about the situation escalating to physical violence. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/256 "2020-09-01T16:45:16Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I strongly support BLM, but I would probably be pissed off if these assholes got in my face at a time of a raging pandemic and tried to bully me into pumping my fist. I hate bullies and mobs in general, regardless of political persuasion. 100% agreed. These are assholes and bullies. I’m reminded of when I take kids on walking field trips, and we walk on an Interstate overpass. Inevitably I have a contingent of kids who make honking motions at the cars and trucks below, trying to cajole someone into honking, and cheering like lunatics whenever someone complies. This strikes me as a much less savory version of the same instinct: “Look what I made them do! It was me! Making them do something!” Not cool, not helpful. Performative activism through and through. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/257 "2020-09-01T17:24:15Z")
> [@urbanredneck2](#): > > Do you all think any of the protesters realize just how BAD this makes the whole BLM movmeent look? Maybe, but what a few people do is only reflective on what the majority does if people choose to disingenuously paint the majority by the actions of the minority. Unfortunately, you are correct that there are those who would do so, especially when encouraged to do so by disingenuous media outlets that repeat a few minute incident on a repeat loop until they have their audience quivering in fear of the other. > [@bump](#): > > Don’t be silly. Few or none of us are cops or lawyers. There’s almost certainly some law being potentially broken here- probably assault or trespass of some kind. So just because he may not know the exact charge doesn’t mean it’s not correct. But if you\* are going to accuse someone of breaking a law, then it is kinda on you to say what law it was that was broken. It wouldn’t be assault, as there was no assault, and it wouldn’t be trespass, as they were in a public area of a public accommodation. If the owners/managers asked them to leave, and they refused, then it would be trespass, but it doesn’t seem as though this incident lasted long enough for that to happen. And, really? We have gun owners here that say that if you call a clip a magazine, then you may have no opinion on gun control. We have Trump defenders here that will rules lawyer what exactly is bribery and corruption, demand to know exactly what law it was that Trump broke, how he broke it, when he broke it, and other details that aren’t even available to the public, much less some net denizens. In this case, we have people justifying violent acts, without being able to articulate the justification for it. Before you shoot someone, you should at least be able to tell why. And we aren’t even asking for people to come up with a reason in the heat of the moment, they have all the time in the world to sit, calm behind their keyboards, and articulate exactly what they thought would happen if they did _not_ resort to violence. And they can’t. Unless you are a cop, then you have qualified immunity, and then feeling afraid is a justification. > [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > I think administering pepper spray or a broken nose at that moment would be entirely justified from a legal and moral standpoint, but it would also be ill-advised: I had read that, but didn’t catch that it was you that posted it. I do disagree that breaking someone’s nose or pepper spraying them for yelling in your face is justified, morally or legally. Let me ask you this. If just one person comes up into your face and yells at you to do something that you have no desire to do, is that justification for violence, to break their nose or pepper spray them? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Bredin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@John\_Bredin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Bredin)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/258 "2020-09-01T17:56:04Z")
> [@urbanredneck2](#): > > Do you all think any of the protesters realize just how BAD this makes the whole BLM movmeent look? Did you worry about just how BAD crowds of marchers, cheek-by-jowl with no masks on and with rifles in their hands and waiving illiterate signs, going down the streets of state capitals to the capitol when the governor was there trying to deal with coronavirus, to rattle and smack on the doors and windows to be let in _en masse_, because the state was oppressing them by making them wear [del]a shirt and shoes[/del] masks during a [del]deadly pandemic[/del] hoax? Didn’t **they** realize no good would come of this? What were **they** hoping would happen? I’ll worry about the one time this happened with some BLM supporters after you do the same with the intimidating armed capitol marchers. I’m not worried that I’ll be worrying anytime soon. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ThisIsTheEnd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thisistheend/32/4713_2.png) [@ThisIsTheEnd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThisIsTheEnd)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/259 "2020-09-01T17:58:48Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > I’m reminded of when I take kids on walking field trips, and we walk on an Interstate overpass. Inevitably I have a contingent of kids who make honking motions at the cars and trucks below, trying to cajole someone into honking, and cheering like lunatics whenever someone complies. > > This strikes me as a much less savory version of the same instinct: “Look what I made them do! It was me! Making them do something!” OMG lol. ---
**Author:** ![urbanredneck2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/5f8ce5/32.png) [@urbanredneck2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/urbanredneck2)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2020, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071/260 "2020-09-01T18:05:42Z")
> [@John\_Bredin](#): > > > [@urbanredneck2](#): > > > > Do you all think any of the protesters realize just how BAD this makes the whole BLM movmeent look? > > Did you worry about just how BAD crowds of marchers, cheek-by-jowl with no masks on and with rifles in their hands and waiving illiterate signs, going down the streets of state capitals to the capitol when the governor was there trying to deal with coronavirus, to rattle and smack on the doors and windows to be let in _en masse_, because the state was oppressing them by making them wear [del]a shirt and shoes[/del] masks during a [del]deadly pandemic[/del] hoax? > Didn’t **they** realize no good would come of this? > What were **they** hoping would happen? > > I’ll worry about the one time this happened with some BLM supporters after you do the same with the intimidating armed capitol marchers. I’m not worried that I’ll be worrying anytime soon. 🙂 Why are you trying to turn this around with the typical “oh… but what about…why arent you angry about that…” response? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-you-do-if-an-angry-mob-demands-you-raise-your-fist-in-support/919071.md?page=14)