# What would your haka response be? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 13, 2015, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065 "2015-07-13T16:42:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/21 "2015-07-14T12:09:14Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > So basically your problem lies in two areas > > 1. You’re intimidated by the Haha > 2. I don’t have one so you’re not allowed it. > > The haka is a part of our culture. We’re proud of it. > And we’re not the only country to perform a pre match Haka so no, we’re not asking for special treatment Yeah, I don’t get the objection. It’s a spectacle. I bet most spectators would miss it if it was ever prohibited. So much more interesting than chest bumping, ass grabbing and strutting that we see in American sporting events. Definitely preferable to the flopping pratt-falls in FIFA soccer matches. Certainly more sportsmanlike than the childish behaviour exhibited by so many professional tennis players - seems few can hit the ball anymore without some sort of aural moan. And the way Djocavic ranted and attempted to rip his shirt mid way through the final match at Wimbeldon; I’d have fined him for that little tantrum. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/22 "2015-07-14T12:14:28Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > Either its purpose is intimidation and so must be done right before kick-off for maximum effect ( in which case of course it should be stopped) Or it isn’t for intimidation in which case there is no problem in doing it earlier. > > Which is it? It’s all part of the show. It’s entertainment. You can’t for a second think that the opposing teams are somehow intimidated by this bit of choreography. Has any opposing team ever complained? (I’m honestly asking because I don’t know.) ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/23 "2015-07-14T12:47:49Z")
Well then the other teams should employ their historic psychological warfare: France goes Napoleonic, filling the field with blinding gunpowder smoke, while drums thundering the passé de charge grow ever closer. USA: hueys, Wagner. Japan: “Hello brave New Zealand footballers. Your wives and girlfriends are back home, sleeping with fat war profiteers.” ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/24 "2015-07-14T12:56:06Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Yeah, I don’t get the objection. It’s a spectacle. I bet most spectators would miss it if it was ever prohibited. They probably would miss it, sure. But I don’t really see the problem with pointing out that the All Blacks are being indulged when it comes to the haka. They have something they want to do before the match, thats fine, but every other team is basically forced to stand there and take it, and that isn’t fine. I know full well that the IRB want it and allow it because of the spectacle it brings to the sport, but that doesn’t change the fact that there is an inequity there. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/25 "2015-07-14T12:59:42Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > I know full well that the IRB want it and allow it because of the spectacle it brings to the sport, but that doesn’t change the fact that there is an inequity there. Is there though? Have other pro teams objected to it? ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/26 "2015-07-14T13:21:31Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Is there though? Have other pro teams objected to it? Of course there is. People might disagree on how important it is but I know that when I was playing a match damn sure I wasn’t giving the opposition any edge at all. Theres plenty of gamesmanship going on in team sports, making one side stand and wait upon the others convenience is most definitely a factor. Have other pro teams objected to it? Can they even object to it, it is very much a poisoned well at this stage, how can a team object to it without being labelled as scared or intimidated? Without the objection being used as a motivation factor for the opposition? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/27 "2015-07-14T13:36:39Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > Of course there is. People might disagree on how important it is but I know that when I was playing a match damn sure I wasn’t giving the opposition any edge at all. Theres plenty of gamesmanship going on in team sports, making one side stand and wait upon the others convenience is most definitely a factor. > > Have other pro teams objected to it? Can they even object to it, it is very much a poisoned well at this stage, how can a team object to it without being labelled as scared or intimidated? Without the objection being used as a motivation factor for the opposition? Thing is, nobody is required to stand there, are they? The opposing team can go and have a huddle on the side line, simply ignore the haka. That would take the wind right out of AB’s sails, I imagine. But there is gamesmanship going on, you’re right about that. The stoney wall some teams choose to put up is a way of facing the challenge while showing they are not intimidated. On some level it’s also a show of respect to the tradition of the AB club. Seems to me everybody is ‘in’ on the joke at this point. Having said that, I’m just now learning about this tradition of this sport so I may not be seeing the big picture behind the controversy; if there is one, in fact. ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/28 "2015-07-14T14:56:00Z")
You also need to understand two things 1. The complaints mostly come from people that get their arsed handed to them by the All Blacks. 2. The complaints invariably intensify when either Australia or England think they have a chance. (Which they almost never do) ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/29 "2015-07-14T15:04:34Z")
One other thing…The Haka is more than “just” a pre match routine… Which is which I mentioned it’s performance in the Boer War… It is very much an integral part of New Zealand culture…just see when and where it is performed. Please don’t dismiss it as just a spectacle. Also…as has been mentioned, opposing teams are free to huddle behind the goal line if they like. I have also yet to hear any complaints about other Pacific Island nations performing the Haka, I guess that’s got nothing at all to do with the ABs’ domination of the sport and the jealousy of the detractors. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/30 "2015-07-14T16:15:57Z")
Personally, I think it would be hysterical if the Kiwis would be in the midst of their haka, and the other team would in unison, turn, drop trou and moon them, while shaking their asses at them. ---
**Author:** ![eclectic\_wench](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ac91a4/32.png) [@eclectic\_wench](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eclectic_wench)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/31 "2015-07-14T16:30:32Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > The complaints mostly come from people that get their arsed handed to them by the All Blacks. Well, yeah. Because the All Blacks are fucking amazing. Can you name me a team that _doesn’t_ regularly get their arses handed to them by the All Blacks? That doesn’t mean that nobody should be able to call them on anything they do, or that any criticism of them is necessarily wrong. Ducking the issue by shrieking ‘You’re just saying that because you’re JELLOUS!!!’ is for thirteen-year-olds. I really like the haka and I’d never want to see it eliminated, but it’s clearly intended to intimidate the other team and shift the power balance before the game. Otherwise they’d do it in the dressing room. It’s ridiculous to try and deny that. I think if other countries feel like the haka is skewing the balance, they should come up with their own equivalents. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/32 "2015-07-14T16:37:41Z")
> [@eclectic\_wench](#): > > I really like the haka and I’d never want to see it eliminated, but it’s clearly intended to intimidate the other team and shift the power balance before the game. Otherwise they’d do it in the dressing room. It’s ridiculous to try and deny that. I think the point of the ritual is to try to antagonize and frighten the enemy. So doing it in the locker room defeats the purpose. And once again, does anyone really believe that the haka intimidates the opposing team to any extent? These are rugby players facing a team they’ve played before going through a ritual they’ve all seen before. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2015, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/33 "2015-07-14T17:47:05Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > One other thing…The Haka is more than “just” a pre match routine… > Which is which I mentioned it’s performance in the Boer War… > It is very much an integral part of New Zealand culture…just see when and where it is performed. > Please don’t dismiss it as just a spectacle. I’m not sure why you think that gives it any special privileges. > [@](#): > > I have also yet to hear any complaints about other Pacific Island nations performing the Haka, I guess that’s got nothing at all to do with the ABs’ domination of the sport and the jealousy of the detractors. I consider all of the haka’s to be equal. They should be part of the team’s warm-up, not an officially sanctioned part of the kick-off preliminaries. I’d appreciate if you could directly respond to the following questions I asked you. > [@](#): > > What is the problem with doing it at an earlier point in the proceedings? Either its purpose is intimidation and so must be done right before kick-off for maximum effect ( in which case of course it should be stopped) Or it isn’t for intimidation in which case there is no problem in doing it earlier. > > Which is it? ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2015, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/34 "2015-07-15T00:06:12Z")
I think your willfully ignoring the history and culture of the Haka, equating it to a motivational trick or parlour game. Rather than something that’s been part of the game for more than a century. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2015, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/35 "2015-07-15T01:50:17Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > Indulged? > > Do you have any idea of the history of the Haka? But it’s NEW ZEALAND’S history. Why should a team from another country bother to “face the challenge”? Don’t they do that by suiting up and playing the game? ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2015, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/36 "2015-07-15T03:37:12Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > But it’s NEW ZEALAND’S history. Why should a team from another country bother to “face the challenge”? Don’t they do that by suiting up and playing the game? Nobody is forcing them to “face the challenge” - they are perfectly free to have a goal line conference if they wish. In fact - many teams have done just that - had a huddle and ignored the Haka. And to be clear - the All Blacks are not asking for “special treatment” If anybody has any similar tradition - they are more than welcome to “bring it” - Just witness the way that it is handled when other Pacific Island nations are played ---
**Author:** ![Annoying\_Buzz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Annoying\_Buzz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annoying_Buzz)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2015, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/37 "2015-07-15T08:20:42Z")
The Scottish response: [![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAgNNPSMY1M) ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2015, 9:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/38 "2015-07-15T09:12:18Z")
> [@Annoying\_Buzz](#): > > The Scottish response: > > [http://youtu.be/EAgNNPSMY1M](http://youtu.be/EAgNNPSMY1M) Samew clip from 7:40… ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2015, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/39 "2015-07-15T10:49:14Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > And to be clear - the All Blacks are not asking for “special treatment” OK, I’ll try just one last time to get a response from you on my question, which is central to whether they are asking for “special treatment” or not > [@](#): > > What is the problem with doing it at an earlier point in the proceedings? Either its purpose is intimidation and so must be done right before kick-off for maximum effect ( in which case of course it should be stopped) Or it isn’t for intimidation in which case there is no problem in doing it earlier. > > Which is it? ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2015, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065/40 "2015-07-15T10:54:12Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > I think your willfully ignoring the history and culture of the Haka, equating it to a motivational trick or parlour game. Rather than something that’s been part of the game for more than a century. “Because we’ve always done it” isn’t blanket justification for anything. I look at those videos and all I see is a bunch of self-absorbed, grandstanding assholes. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-your-haka-response-be/725065.md?page=3)