# What would've been the easiest way to prevent scurvy? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 4, 2015, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816 "2015-02-04T17:23:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2015, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/1 "2015-02-04T17:23:03Z")
In the Age of Discovery? Assume the ships captain will listen to your advice on victuals, what would be the easiest and/or cheapest way to ensure the crew doesn’t become a bunch of scurvy dogs on voyages that lasted months? My best guess, make a load of [hagebuttenmark](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hagebuttenmark), rosehip preserve. Although the problem there is it needs sugar which might be a bit pricey. I’m sure there are better options though, whadya reckon? ---
**Author:** ![buddy431](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@buddy431](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddy431)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2015, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/2 "2015-02-04T17:36:22Z")
Captain Cook used Sauerkraut, which seems to be pretty cheap (cabbage and salt), and keeps well. There are a number of relatively cheap, preserved foods that will do the trick, the trouble is that they didn’t know what the cause was. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2015, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/3 "2015-02-04T18:52:29Z")
Sauerkraut is what I was going to come in and say. It’s made from something that is commonly grown in Europe, and lasts for a good long while, being fermented and all. Heck… they could probably take some sauerkraut just put into the barrels and let it do its thing as they sailed. Most other foods high in vitamin C are either tropical or not easily preserved. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2015, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/4 "2015-02-04T23:54:03Z")
Just put plenty of lime juice in the rum. ---
**Author:** ![GiantRat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@GiantRat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GiantRat)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2015, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/5 "2015-02-04T23:59:57Z")
Potatoes work. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/6 "2015-02-05T00:02:43Z")
I’d also go with sauerkraut. Not only are cabbages really cheap and a good source of C, they’re also full of a bunch of other vitamins. ---
**Author:** ![EdwinAmi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5fc32e/32.png) [@EdwinAmi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EdwinAmi)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/7 "2015-02-05T00:03:26Z")
I would think plain dried fruit, which was a relatively mature industry and common product ---
**Author:** ![EdwinAmi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5fc32e/32.png) [@EdwinAmi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EdwinAmi)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/8 "2015-02-05T00:04:52Z")
interesting fact, humans are one of the few organisms who can’t make their own vitamin C most animals and plants make it in their own bodies with their own metabolism. Humans are one of the few that can’t, along with guinea pigs. Which is why guinea pigs were so popular in nutrition and other studies, and where the terminology of “guinea pig” as a metaphor for test-subject came about ---
**Author:** ![buddy431](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@buddy431](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddy431)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/9 "2015-02-05T01:38:51Z")
> [@EdwinAmi](#): > > interesting fact, > humans are one of the few organisms who can’t make their own vitamin C > > most animals and plants make it in their own bodies with their own metabolism. > > Humans are one of the few that can’t, along with guinea pigs. Which is why guinea pigs were so popular in nutrition and other studies, and where the terminology of “guinea pig” as a metaphor for test-subject came about The other higher primates (apes, old and new world monkeys, and tarsier’s) also can’t make it, while the older lemurs and lorises can. ---
**Author:** ![kopek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kopek/32/337_2.png) [@kopek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kopek)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/10 "2015-02-05T01:47:11Z")
Gin mixed with say lime would be good but what about gin itself? ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/11 "2015-02-05T02:09:56Z")
> [@bob\_2](#): > > Just put plenty of lime juice in the rum. How long does the vit. c in lime juice stay potent without preservatives? The RDA is 50+mg, to prevent scurvy you just need 10mg. I’m not sure of the cheapest way to get that kind of ration w/o preservatives or modern farming. ---
**Author:** ![EdwinAmi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5fc32e/32.png) [@EdwinAmi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EdwinAmi)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/12 "2015-02-05T02:23:30Z")
> [@](#): > > I’m not sure of the cheapest way to get that kind of ration w/o preservatives or modern farming. the issue isn’t the cost, it’s the shelf life and dose-density a la how long the ship can expect to be at sea in worst case scenarios. That is, is the item dense enough in size per daily dose of vitamin C to supply fit enough in the storage to supply the whole crew for the whole trip? ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/13 "2015-02-05T04:13:28Z")
[Scurvy: How a Surgeon, a Mariner, and a Gentlemen Solved the Greatest Medical Mystery of the Age of Sail](http://www.amazon.com/Scurvy-Surgeon-Mariner-Gentlemen-Greatest/dp/0312313926/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1423109572&sr=8-1&keywords=scurvy) ---
**Author:** ![purplehearingaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@purplehearingaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehearingaid)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/14 "2015-02-05T04:25:30Z")
> [@buddy431](#): > > Captain Cook used Sauerkraut, which seems to be pretty cheap (cabbage and salt), and keeps well. There are a number of relatively cheap, preserved foods that will do the trick, the trouble is that they didn’t know what the cause was. pickle herring will help too . ---
**Author:** ![Polar\_Iceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Polar\_Iceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polar_Iceman)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/15 "2015-02-05T06:12:37Z")
I recall reading a long time ago (no cite) that the Vikings always carried barrels of sauerkraut in their boats for the specific purpose of preventing scurvy. While they didn’t know the mechanism leading to scurvy, they did know how to prevent it on their voyages. My question is: in that the Vikings knew this, why didn’t the British and other navies? They didn’t need to know the mechanism of action to use a preventative; so why didn’t they? ---
**Author:** ![Obtenebrate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/9f8e36/32.png) [@Obtenebrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Obtenebrate)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/16 "2015-02-05T10:57:05Z")
Pine needles would have been almost free in many places, and they contain significant amount of vitamin C. The question would then be storage life, and I’m not certain that’s ever been studied. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/17 "2015-02-05T13:39:06Z")
> [@Obtenebrate](#): > > Pine needles would have been almost free in many places, and they contain significant amount of vitamin C. The question would then be storage life, and I’m not certain that’s ever been studied. Was wondering about pine (or other conifer) needles, or perhaps a needle infusion in their rum. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/18 "2015-02-05T14:42:10Z")
The insidious thing is that apparently citrus juices lose vitamin C over time\*, so when they tried to take the juice with them to prevent scurvy, it lost its effectiveness. It also undermined faith in the theory of vitamin C being needed to prevent scurvy – an idea that had apparently been proposed and shot down multiple times before it was finally accepted. You can see someone trying the Scientific Method, with controls and all, trying to prove that vitamin C in juice prevented scurvy, and then finding that it didn’t do anything, because the vitamin C content had deteriorated before it got used. No wonder the history of using Vitamin C – in whatever form – has a checkered history. The inability of the human body to produce its own vitamin C is apparently due to a genetic mutation 'way back. It wasn’t lethal, because our simian ancestors had plenty of access to vitamin C sources, but it eventually came back to bite us when we moved out in the world. It’s a profound counter-argument to those who claim the human body is perfection of design. And it’s particularly galling that, while sailors suffered from scurvy, the rats on board didn’t. \*The deterioration of Vitamin C with time, exposure to air, and heat is mentioned in books on the history of scurvy, as well as lots of websites. See here, for instance: > **[How to preserve vitamin C](https://www.botanical-online.com/en/diet/how-to-preserve-vitamin-c)** > > Vitamin C is water soluble, That's to say, it dissolves in water, so it is interesting not to clean your vegetables or fruit for too long or to leave them into water. > **[Vitamin C Deterioration in Orange Juice](https://www.ukessays.com/essays/biology/vitamin-c-deterioration-in-orange-juice-biology-essay.php)** > > This experimental investigation was designed to examine the deterioration of vitamin c (ascorbic acid) content when placed in conditions with different oxidization and temperature exposure. Home brand > **[The Effect of Storage Method on the Vitamin C Content in Some Tropical Fruit...](https://scialert.net/fulltext/?doi=tasr.2009.79.84)** > > The Effect of Storage Method on the Vitamin C Content in Some Tropical Fruit Juices You can’t just juice your limes and take it on a long sea voyage – you have to keep it cool and sealed, and maybe add preservatives. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/19 "2015-02-05T15:14:33Z")
So, OK I know this is horrid, but . . . The rats. they made their own, right? And Vitamin “C” comes out in the urine doesn’t it? Soooo, yeah. A cage of rats and lemonade for breakfast? ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816/20 "2015-02-05T16:13:34Z")
Excess vitamin C is excreted in urine, if you \*consume \*more than your body can use, but animals that synthesize their own don’t produce excess – I believe when something is internally produced the body makes only as much as it needs/can use at that moment. ETA: I have no idea what happens when vit. C-producing animals go on to consume additional vitamin C as well. Do their bodies use the ingested ascorbic acid and shut off the synthesization mechanism? That, I do not know. Circling back to the OP: The best method I can think of that hasn’t already been mentioned is keeping a few live, potted plants on board that produce vit. C-rich fruit. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-wouldve-been-the-easiest-way-to-prevent-scurvy/711816.md?page=2)