# What's a good metric for when to stop masking? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Quarantine Zone\ **Tags:** covid-quarantine\ **Created:** [June 26, 2023, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122 "2023-06-26T14:12:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2023, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/61 "2023-07-22T02:26:05Z")
> [@BigAppleBucky](#): > > I saw more than the usual number of mask wearers today. I’m not sure when I last saw someone wearing a mask. 5, 6 weeks ago? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2023, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/62 "2023-07-22T17:38:58Z")
I just went to my optician. We both wore masks. And she’s now “by appointment only”, I think because she wants to keep people wearing masks in her shop. ---
**Author:** ![tofor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tofor/32/13727_2.png) [@tofor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tofor)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/63 "2023-07-24T11:28:05Z")
I was invited to an outdoor sporting event on Saturday (a pickup-style come-and-play thing). Several people RSVP’d via reply-all, and one response was “I will not be there because I don’t knowingly interact with unvaccinated people.” That seemed…extreme at this point. There was a time when I was in that camp as well, and I hoped that vaccinated requirements would become the norm for public events. But we lost that battle, and there’s no going back. The point is, we all have different risk profiles and tolerances. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/64 "2023-07-24T12:07:24Z")
> [@tofor](#): > > That seemed…extreme at this point. That seems not at all evidence-based at this point. By now, pretty much everyone who ever gets out and around (not babies, and maybe not incapacitated people who live in confined circumstances) has been exposed to covid, via vaccine, infection, or both. I guess it could be a moral statement, but i don’t think it makes any sense in terms of that person protecting their own health. Anyway, i still wear masks a lot, and i consider myself fairly covid-shy, but i invited a bunch of people over yesterday to square dance and socialize in my back yard. I did not inquire about vaccines and people only donned masks to go into the main part of my house to play with our new kittens. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/65 "2023-07-24T12:22:35Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > It’s showing up lots. But not in a way that necessitates aggressive public health measures to prevent mass death. Yep, that was the key for me! Once I was vaccinated and boosted, and once a significant portion of the populace became the same, the necessity for public masking no longer existed for me. There are exceptions, though. Were I visiting an ill and vulnerable person, I would wear a mask to protect them. In fact, I keep a clean mask in my car just in case such a circumstance should arise. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/66 "2023-07-24T20:12:45Z")
> [@tofor](#): > > I was invited to an outdoor sporting event on Saturday (a pickup-style come-and-play thing). Several people RSVP’d via reply-all, and one response was “I will not be there because I don’t knowingly interact with unvaccinated people.” > > That seemed…extreme at this point. There was a time when I was in that camp as well, and I hoped that vaccinated requirements would become the norm for public events. But we lost that battle, and there’s no going back. > > The point is, we all have different risk profiles and tolerances. My response would have been more like: “Bring on those unvaccinated losers so I can kill them with my very breath.” Someone being unvaccinated is a threat to their own health, not to the health of anyone else. Perhaps your respondent was being extremely civic-minded to their own detriment. Not likely though. I rather think they were being extremely paranoid (or under-informed) to their own detriment. The only thing an unvaccinated person brings to the party is massive personal vulnerabliity _for themselves_. They aren’t Typhoid Marys any more than the fully vaxxed (like me) are. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/67 "2023-07-24T20:15:33Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > That seems not at all evidence-based at this point. Likely not, but I suspect that anyone who’s on either end of the COVID-avoidance spectrum was/is not really operating on an evidence-based decision-making process. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/68 "2023-07-24T21:05:22Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The only thing an unvaccinated person brings to the party is massive personal vulnerabliity _for themselves_. They aren’t Typhoid Marys any more than the fully vaxxed (like me) are. To be fair, they’re somewhat more likely to be infected than a vaccinated person. And some people are apparently infectious before they show symptoms. How much more likely they are to be infected, at this point, is another question. Unless the transmission rates are high in the area, I’m no longer worried about outdoor events – I went unmasked a couple of weeks ago to a party at my neighbors’ at which I strongly suspect some people were unvaccinated. I stayed outside almost the whole time, though. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/69 "2023-07-24T21:22:25Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Someone being unvaccinated is a threat to their own health, not to the health of anyone else. That’s not really true these days, as most unvaccinated adults and kids who’ve been to school have had covid, and have immunity from that. But i think the concern is a holdover from early in the pandemic, before the virus started mutating, and before vaccine immunity started to wane. There was a period when vaccinated people were (mostly) immune, as in, sterilizing immunity, and were much safer to spend time with than unvaccinated people, who mostly hadn’t yet recovered from an infection, but we’ll be harboring one. There were a few months when a vaccinated person hanging out with another vaccinated person was extraordinarily unlikely to catch covid, but any unactivated person was fairly likely to be infectious, and if you were unlucky enough to not have gotten full immunity from your own vaccine, you could trust the vaccinations of your friends. But that time has long passed. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/70 "2023-07-24T21:32:13Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > > [@puzzlegal](#): > > > > That seems not at all evidence-based at this point. > > Likely not, but I suspect that anyone who’s on either end of the COVID-avoidance spectrum was/is not really operating on an evidence-based decision-making process. I think that’s really the bottom line nowadays. Some overseas locale wanted me to wear a mask 4-6 weeks ago. I don’t now recall where or why. I had no objection to complying. Prior to that it had probably been a year since I wore one in any circumstance. I expect the same going forward. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2023, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/71 "2023-07-24T22:03:20Z")
I’ve worn a mask a few times recently, when I was visiting with a friend who has some health issues. His doctors gave him detailed advice about what he can do unmasked, what he can do masked, and what he shouldn’t do at all. Including advice on how that is likely to change with time, because his condition is changing (e.g., in a couple of weeks, he’s expected to reach the point where small groups indoors, everyone vaccinated and asymptomatic, will be OK unmasked). ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2023, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/72 "2023-07-25T19:43:40Z")
**What’s a good metric for when to stop masking?** When you don’t believe it’s necessary anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2023, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/73 "2023-07-31T18:56:41Z")
Well, yeah, but most people’s risk assessment sucks, in my opinion. I strongly believe that most have/will stop wearing masks way earlier than is scientifically warranted. Framing this as a matter of personal judgment is therefore a bit misleading, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2023, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/74 "2023-07-31T19:15:42Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > I strongly believe that most have/will stop wearing masks way earlier than is scientifically warranted. > … You strongly beleive … > [@Leaper](#): > > … > Framing this as a matter of personal judgment is therefore a bit misleading, IMO. That it should, or should not be a matter of personal judgment? You can’t have it both ways. Your “strong belief” _is_ personal judgment. And given the tenses you chose, it appears your strongly held personal judgment is that (most?) everyone should still be masking now in late 2023. For me to call that a fringe position would be highly charitable. You do you. But at least acknowledge what you’re doing: asking all of us to substitute _your_ personal judgement for _our_ personal judgments. No thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/75 "2023-08-01T00:15:35Z")
My intent wasn’t to bring personal opinion into it. My hedging was because I wasn’t completely up to date on the latest scientific consensus, but I can’t imagine that any responsible epidemiologist approves of the current “let it rip” approach. If I’m wrong, then I’ll follow the scientific consensus (which people in general aren’t doing, and _that_ is the part that is my opinion, not what the science says) and ease off on masking, but I don’t expect to be. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/76 "2023-08-01T00:23:12Z")
Responsible epidemiologists mostly feel that the government shouldn’t step in unless there’s a risk of overwhelming general services. And that’s not where we are right now. Now, whether you want to take the risk of getting infected, or of infecting your fragile relative, are also important questions, but not ones that the US authorities care to give guidance on. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/77 "2023-08-01T00:25:27Z")
I think scientific opinion is that if everyone everywhere wore N95 masks, we’d stop a lot of flu, and COVID, and common colds, and all the rest. The question is how much actual public health we’d get for that hassle? And is it worth it? Those are not scientific questions amenable to scientific answers. If masks are nice, isolation is better. We’d have _far_ less communicable disease of all sorts in our world if none of us ever left our residences. But is it worth it? Those are social / economic / political questions requiring social / economic / political answers. Not scientific ones. Bio-science can inform one side of the tradeoff. Economics might inform another aspect of the tradeoff. Psychology and sociology might inform a third axis. But all those are inputs to a decision, not an actual decision. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Knig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@Typo\_Knig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Knig)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/78 "2023-08-01T01:27:05Z")
I just saw a news report that COVID cases are up in the DC metro area, as are flu and step. No increase in hospitalizations, yet. I think I’ll go back to masking for a while. Darn it! ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/79 "2023-08-01T02:07:09Z")
It’s a point that’s been made to me in threads before, but it’s still something I’ve not quite wrapped my head around. Here’s what I keep thinking: Politics in dealing with a pandemic are _bad_. Politics are why we’re in this mess so deep to begin with. If theres a scientific consensus to how to best end the pandemic, it should be followed without question. Anyone who objects for reasons like “aw, I’m not comfy when I have a mask on” or something ridiculous like that is just a MAGAt who can be rightfully derided and ignored, and their whining run roughshod over with official force. IOW, I want to treat the pandemic like we (should) treat climate change, and I don’t see why we can’t or shouldn’t. And I equally don’t see why the scientific establishment is so blasé about this that they’re willing to cede this to government; again, compare to climate change. Follow the science. I don’t see what’s so difficult about this, especially when the main actions being expected of the common citizen are so minor and harmless. To bring it back to the OP topic, my expectations are as follows: there is still a great deal of merit and good to be done with continuing to wear masks, but political pressures a’la the Trump administration are keeping scientists and governments alike from doing what _should_ be done to hasten the end of the pandemic. So my answer would be, everybody _should_ be wearing masks until science says we can stop, and I can’t see any indication that such time would be now or anytime soon. ---
**Author:** ![Jay\_Z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Jay\_Z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jay_Z)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122/80 "2023-08-01T02:34:58Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > Follow the science. I don’t see what’s so difficult about this, especially when the main actions being expected of the common citizen are so minor and harmless. To bring it back to the OP topic, my expectations are as follows: there is still a great deal of merit and good to be done with continuing to wear masks, but political pressures a’la the Trump administration are keeping scientists and governments alike from doing what _should_ be done to hasten the end of the pandemic. So my answer would be, everybody _should_ be wearing masks until science says we can stop, and I can’t see any indication that such time would be now or anytime soon. Is there some actual science you are following? Numbers, anything you’d like to share with us? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-a-good-metric-for-when-to-stop-masking/986122.md?page=5)