# What's the blackest substance I can get my hands on? (For a moderate price.) **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 20, 2004, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187 "2004-02-20T12:44:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![lisacurl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/41988e/32.png) [@lisacurl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisacurl)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2004, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/21 "2004-02-20T15:57:52Z")
> [@jovan](#): > > I need something black. I mean very black. Are you re-creating Hotblack Desiato’s stunt ship? ---
**Author:** ![gluteus\_maximus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f17d59/32.png) [@gluteus\_maximus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gluteus_maximus)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2004, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/22 "2004-02-20T15:59:04Z")
Adding sand to flat black paint **won’t** make it blacker or flatter, but it **will** make it a lot more difficult to paint with, and it **will** ruin your paintbrush, and it **will** produce a pretty good faux wrought iron finish to whatever you sludge it on to. I used it a lot when I was a scene painter, way back when. ---
**Author:** ![jovan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/0ea827/32.png) [@jovan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jovan)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2004, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/23 "2004-02-20T16:14:43Z")
Actually, I’ve used paint/sand mixtures a long, long time ago. The effect is very cheesy. Anyway, sand is too coarse, but I will try experimenting with other, finer stuff. ---
**Author:** ![gluteus\_maximus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f17d59/32.png) [@gluteus\_maximus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gluteus_maximus)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2004, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/24 "2004-02-20T16:17:23Z")
Oh, yeah, and adding sand to flat black acrylic or latex paint will make the finished coat a lot harder than the same paint without the sand. I used it on an exterior wooden gate that I wanted to look like wrought iron. That gate took a lot of punishment and never chipped. Seriously, **jovan** , if you want really dead black for really cheap, try the candle technique. If you get a big fat _rosoku_ from your local _butsudanyasan_, you should be able to cover 50 square cm in no time. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2004, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/25 "2004-02-20T16:28:35Z")
> [@gluteus maximus](#): > > …you should be able to cover 50 square cm in no time. He said 1/2 meter square, = 50 cm squared, = 250 square cm. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2004, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/26 "2004-02-20T16:29:54Z")
Arghhh! **2500** square cm. ---
**Author:** ![gluteus\_maximus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f17d59/32.png) [@gluteus\_maximus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gluteus_maximus)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2004, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/27 "2004-02-20T17:04:46Z")
Yeah, what you said, 😃 , sizewise. It’s late. I teach English. What’s your excuse? 😉 Anyway, it shouldn’t take long to cover a square that’s 50cm on each side with soot from a candle. ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2004, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/28 "2004-02-20T20:42:31Z")
> [@Bruce\_Daddy](#): > > Spinal Tap’s “Smell the Glove” album. You ask yourself, how much more black could it be and the answer is none, none more black. You beat me to it, hard. Damn you! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![bibliophage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bibliophage/32/7615_2.png) [@bibliophage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bibliophage)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2004, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/29 "2004-02-20T23:11:17Z")
Let’s refrain from cracking wise about politicians’ hearts in this thread. I expect the comments were made in good humor, but the potential for derailing this is too great. bibliophage moderator GQ ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2004, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/30 "2004-02-20T23:24:20Z")
> [@gluteus maximus](#): > > Take a big, fat candle … hold the object you desire to be as black as carbon just high enough over the flame as to not actually get scorched… Better than a candle for this is a length of ordinary masking tape, scrunched into a loose ball – when burned, it puts out an impressive amount of black soot. ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2004, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/31 "2004-02-21T00:31:43Z")
> [@bibliophage](#): > > Let’s refrain from cracking wise about politicians’ hearts in this thread. I expect the comments were made in good humor, but the potential for derailing this is too great. > > bibliophage > moderator GQ Quite right. Politicians’ hearts should be off limits. However, I’d pay to see someone separate Fred Phelps’s soul from his body–doesn’t get much cheaper than that! (Sorry) To get back on track, I second (tenth?) the flat black paint, with a layer of soot over it. ---
**Author:** ![Cillasi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@Cillasi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cillasi)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2004, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/32 "2004-02-21T02:14:39Z")
Upon reading the article about using nitric acid, I was reminded of an excerpt from a Chemistry textbook quoting a scientist’s experiment with the stuff. I don’t have it in front of me and can’t tell you who the scientist was, but it went something like this: The scientist read that “nitric acid reacts with copper.” He put a copper penny in a test tube with nitric acid. It started to bubble and produced a green gas. He picked up the penny only to discover that “nitric acid reacts with fingers.” As he wiped his burning fingers on his trousers he discovered that “nitric acid reacts with pants.” Get the idea? If you’re going to attempt to use nitric acid for anything, be very careful. It is extremely corrosive. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2004, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/33 "2004-02-21T03:57:37Z")
You might try Duvetyne. It’s a matte black cloth used in the film biz any time the crew needs to block out all the light from a source that can’t be turned off, like daylight coming through a window. Works really well too when you’re shooting nights and sleeping days. Blocks out all the light from your bedroom windows so you can really get some rest. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2004, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/34 "2004-02-21T05:38:44Z")
> [@gluteus maximus](#): > > Carbon black/lamp black is the blackest pigment you can get without going out and grinding up some anthracite. At the risk of being pedantic - well, OK, I am being horribly pedantic, but if I don’t post on this then I won’t be worthy of my “coal goddess” title - you most likely mean something along the lines of “American Pennsylvanian anthracite” or “English/Ural mountain” anthracite. Korean and Spanish anthracites (of which I have a small pile of each…hmm…yes, within 6 feet of my keyboard, in fact) is actually a bit lighter coloured due to the high levels of ash and minerals in it. Similar to Wyoming or Montana sub-bituminous coloured. I have some here to compare with in fact…wow, that’s Queen Bitch pedantic, I suppose. I will leave now, to help someone else in the “Rhode Island coal mine” thread. Shame about me not having a life… ---
**Author:** ![whatami](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/85f322/32.png) [@whatami](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whatami)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2004, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/35 "2004-02-21T06:15:18Z")
> [@Una Persson](#): > > At the risk of being pedantic - well, OK, I am being horribly pedantic, but if I don’t post on this then I won’t be worthy of my “coal goddess” title - you most likely mean something along the lines of “American Pennsylvanian anthracite” or “English/Ural mountain” anthracite. Korean and Spanish anthracites (of which I have a small pile of each…hmm…yes, within 6 feet of my keyboard, in fact) is actually a bit lighter coloured due to the high levels of ash and minerals in it. Similar to Wyoming or Montana sub-bituminous coloured. I have some here to compare with in fact…wow, that’s Queen Bitch pedantic, I suppose. > > I will leave now, to help someone else in the “Rhode Island coal mine” thread. Shame about me not having a life… I swear, only on the dope… 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Napier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce73a5/32.png) [@Napier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Napier)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2004, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/36 "2004-02-21T12:47:16Z")
1. It’s really tough to get blacker than lamp black or carbon black or carbon soot. Also, I’m interested to hear those terms aren’t necessarily equal. 2. Just hoping that “painting” one’s ceiling with soot from a lit candle or wad of masking tape doesn’t become a big fad. Aren’t buildings combustible? 3. Optics people need and use especially black products, like the telescope makers referred to above. You can get these things from Thorlabs, Oriel, Edmund Scientific, maybe Newport - look for optical supply companies. For example I use black rubberized black nylon cloth, and it’s amazingly lightproof (stops light coming through), though it’s not the blackest thing I’ve seen (stopping light reflecting back). Your interest ought to depend on your convenience to blackness ratio, so to speak. 4. Black felt from a crafts or fabrics store is awful damn black, too. 5. The emissivity of electrical tape isn’t relevant. How much electromagnetic radiation it reflects at 3 or 8 um is a bad predictor of how much it reflects at 0.3 or 0.8 um. Just look at human skin - no matter how pale, it has pretty nearly a perfect emissivity of 1 (it’s “black” in the thermal infrared). ---
**Author:** ![gluteus\_maximus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f17d59/32.png) [@gluteus\_maximus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gluteus_maximus)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2004, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187/37 "2004-02-21T16:18:34Z")
> [@Una Persson](#): > > At the risk of being pedantic - well, OK, I am being horribly pedantic, but if I don’t post on this then I won’t be worthy of my “coal goddess” title - you most likely mean something along the lines of “American Pennsylvanian anthracite” … Well, :rolleyes: _yeah_ … (as in ‘doh!’)… 😉 I’m from Cambria County, Pennsylvania… although I think most of the antracite in Pennsylvania was found up around Scranton… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-blackest-substance-i-can-get-my-hands-on-for-a-moderate-price/230187.md?page=1)