# Whats the deal in USA with 1 litre soda pop, is USA on metric? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 21, 2002, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825 "2002-08-21T01:23:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2017, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/141 "2017-07-30T22:49:35Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > People have been nailed for this in Britain, but I am not so sure it was meant as tyranny: even in the US you cannot make up your own scales and weights and units and label products however you see fit. The consistent standards are supposed to ensure fairness on behalf of the consumer. You can make up your own units, but you have to label them with standard units, and metric has been required in the US For that label for ever. Example in point, Starbux sizes: Short [8 fl. oz.], Tall [12 fl. oz.], Grande [16 fl. oz.], Venti® Hot [20 fl. oz.], Venti® Cold [24 fl. oz.] and Trenta®\* Cold [31 fl. oz.]. I don’t go there often but they give you flack if you ask for it in fl.oz. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2017, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/142 "2017-07-30T22:56:18Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **rat avatar** : > > Oh come on, unless your cook was Australian there are exactly two that you have to try. > > US and UK. > > By the way, the most likely reality is that it is in the UK customary units, as it is still in common use in baking in the UK. I did try both, and neither worked. But it’s not a binary choice, because there were multiple different units, each of which could be in different systems. It’s at least eight possibilities, more if there’s some other unit that differs between the systems that I don’t know of. > [@](#): > > Either way, in this case you are making bread, which primarily depends on the ratios of flour/water/yeast/sugar/fat/salt and not some arbitrary unit of measure. Which would be fine if the recipe were written in a system where everything was measured in the same, or easily-converted, units. But what’s the ratio of a tablespoon to a pint? I don’t know. > [@](#): > > Maybe you should try using a rational method? My point exactly, but unfortunately I’m not the one who wrote the recipe. > [@](#): > > Or maybe consider that most good bakers tend to make adjustments for the flower humidity etc…on the fly? If I already knew how to make Irish brown bread, I could do that. But if I already knew how to make Irish brown bread, I wouldn’t have needed the recipe from the B&B. > [@](#): > > Also consider that they may be keeping a yeast culture, and just like SF sour bread it just will never be the same. It’s not a yeast bread. People keep saying that the American system is just as good or better than the metric system. When proponents of metric point out advantages of metric, the American proponents just say “yeah, but how often is that relevant?”. When the proponents of metric point out examples where it really is relevant, they say “You should have tried harder”. When the proponents of American try to construct examples where the American system is easier, the metric proponents show that even those examples are easier in the metric system, too. There is literally no good argument here in favor of the American system. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2017, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/143 "2017-07-30T23:27:44Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > So what’s stopping you? Last time I checked you could get measuring devices in either system. So use metric tapes and measures. I’ve considered it. But the plans that I find in (US) magazines and such, are all in English units. And it would be a nontrivial outlay of money to replace all my measuring tools, drill bits, router bits, etc. with metric ones. Come to think of it, I’m not sure that metric router bits would fit my router, so I might have to replace that too. In miniature, this is the real reason people in the US don’t want to switch to metric – it’s a painful and expensive transition. I get that. Making up ridiculous justifications for why the US system is “better” than metric doesn’t help; it just makes Americans look silly and provincial. ---
**Author:** ![Civil\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d78d45/32.png) [@Civil\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Civil_Guy)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2017, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/144 "2017-07-30T23:53:50Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > Anyone (like me) can freely choose to use the metric system without serious Constitutional challenges. Anything else borders on tyranny (and I’m not being sarcastic). No, it’s not like there would be any plans to round up all the yard sticks or anything. The tying run will eternally be 90 feet from home plate, so there’s no worries there. If highway signs are changed to metric, then speed limit signs probably would be, as well. Currently, you could conceivably fight a speeding ticket by saying you were only going 95 kph in that 60 mph zone, and it’s your free speech right to use metric units – but that’s probably not the best strategy. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/145 "2017-07-31T00:59:50Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Not at all: The recipe very clearly indicated teaspoons, tablespoons, pints, and so on. I just don’t know _which_ teaspoons, tablespoons, and pints. You need to specify when you’re using those units. You never need to specify what kind of kilometers you mean. It actually really shouldn’t make a difference if you’re dealing with US or UK measures there. The ratio of US teaspoons to US pints and UK teaspoons to UK pints is the same. And if you’re getting a recipe with “pints” indicated, it’s almost certainly a UK recipe, in my experience, as American recipes will pretty much always (in modern times) write 2 cups. Also, while baking is more a science than cooking, there still is plenty of fudge factor that will yield a perfectly good end product. If the recipe didn’t work, it’s either your technique, or the innkeeper just completely screwed up the recipe. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/146 "2017-07-31T01:05:27Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > … “Only three countries in the world don’t officially use the metric system” claim seems false, there is no bar that anyone seems to be able to define based on it and as your link shows not all other countries have fully converted. > > So to me this seems to be a bigoted, or hateful claim, and because there is apparently zero ability to actually define what “officially accepting” the SI units is it leads to exchanges like this. > > So once again, in an effort to “fight ignorance” what would the US have to do to not be subjected to this disparaging claim? You already asked me for a cite and I provided you with the CIA World Factbook. If you had followed the footnoted citation at the link you would have found the fuller explanation that you were looking for: At this time, only three countries - Burma, Liberia, and the US - have not adopted the International System of Units (SI, or metric system) as their official system of weights and measures. Although use of the metric system has been sanctioned by law in the US since 1866, it has been slow in displacing the American adaptation of the British Imperial System known as the US Customary System. The US is the only industrialized nation that does not mainly use the metric system in its commercial and standards activities, but there is increasing acceptance in science, medicine, government, and many sectors of industry. [https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/appendix/appendix-g.html](https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/appendix/appendix-g.html) If you believe that this is “bigoted” and “hateful” against the US, take it up with the CIA. Whether the claim is “disparaging” obviously depends on one’s position on metrification. The obvious answer to your question as to what circumstances would curtail the criticisms that the US is not actually metric in any meaningful way is: maybe if metric became commonplace in everyday life, as it is everywhere else. For example: [ul] [li]weather records and forecast temperatures in Celsius degrees[/li][li]foods and food ingredients primarily packaged in metric sizes and labeled accordingly[/li][li]foods and any other commodities sold by measured weight priced in grams or kilograms[/li][li]highway signage in kilometers or meters, speed limits in km/h[/li][li]car instrumentation in km/h and kilometers driven[/li][li]gasoline metered and priced in litres[/li][li]car mileage stated in litres/100 km[/li][/ul] I’m not saying all of these are immediately essential, what I’m saying is that practically none of them are currently true here, whereas most of them if not all of them are true in most other countries that have a legitimate claim to being metric. Incidentally, we had a discussion in a different thread about the L/100km number versus MPG. A big problem with MPG, aside from the archaic units, is that it isn’t a linear scale. A given MPG difference when comparing low-mileage cars is far more significant than the same difference when comparing high-mileage cars. L/100km much more closely reflects real-life concerns and more accurately tracks differences between cars across a wide range of efficiencies. ---
**Author:** ![AWB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bb73d2/32.png) [@AWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AWB)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/147 "2017-07-31T01:07:46Z")
> [@Reeder](#): > > Coke has come back out with 16.9 oz plastic bottles in twelve packs just recently. Which is the same as 1/2 litre. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/148 "2017-07-31T11:57:59Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > I’m surprised you never got an answer because I would think the answer is fairly obvious. The government already regulates weights and measures in the interest of facilitating commerce, standardization, and the general public good. And there are very good reasons for that. You can’t go around selling an alleged five-pound roast or a ten-pound sack of potatoes with your own unique definition of what a “pound” is (six ounces!) and use “free speech” as a defense. I’ve never suggested that weights and measures would be used fraudulently; I’m addressing which weights and measures can be printed or spoken about. And besides, your answer is _not_ an answer, though, and if it _were_ an answer, you’d only be addressing a very, very small part of a transition. Product packaging is _already_ largely metric, and likely the government could compel speech requiring metric units on packages that don’t already include it. My assertion is that the government cannot compel companies to _omit_ customary units, meaning that people are still going to buy eight ounces of yellow cheese-like product. > [@](#): > > You can’t “freely choose” to use metric on your own – that doesn’t even mean anything, since the underlying concept of a “standard” is that it is, well, standard – everybody uses it. Sure I can, because enough other people use it that it makes sense in my life. If someone doesn’t understand what I’m talking about, then I can switch to customary units easily, because you know what? It’s not that damned hard. Generations of Canadians already do it when they talk to their grandparents. I’m not anti-metric; it’s a better system, after all, and I use it myself primarily. But you weirdos who think the country suffers because we’re not metric don’t realize we’re already metric where it matters, and what you really want to do is convince everyday people to abandon their customary units and adopt metric ones. The only way you can do that is through despotism. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/149 "2017-07-31T12:23:28Z")
> [@Cub\_Mistress](#): > > Medical stuff is the US is usually metric, except when it is not… > meds are mostly in mg, liquids in ml (not cc!) height in cm, weight in kg. I and other pathologists routinely measure in grams, ml and cm. Then I go home and it’s pounds, ounces and feet. It’s only natural. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/150 "2017-07-31T12:50:06Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **pulykamell** : > > It actually really shouldn’t make a difference if you’re dealing with US or UK measures there. The ratio of US teaspoons to US pints and UK teaspoons to UK pints is the same. But those aren’t the only units used, either. An imperial egg is the same as an American egg, and the two ounces are close enough to not worry about the difference in a recipe. So there will still be some ratios which are off. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/151 "2017-07-31T13:00:08Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Well that’s the rub, the imperial system is based on human life experiences. Metric is not. Imperial will always be a more natural unit of measurement than metric, though if born under metric rule one can adapt and live a perfectly normal life. What a load of nonsense. There’s nothing natural about either system - they’re both made up systems, invented by people. One of them was made up so as to be straightforward to use. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/152 "2017-07-31T15:02:17Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > But those aren’t the only units used, either. An imperial egg is the same as an American egg, and the two ounces are close enough to not worry about the difference in a recipe. So there will still be some ratios which are off. Well, eggs actually do vary quite a bit in size, imperial or not, which is why, as I believe you agreed before, recipes by weight for baking are easier to deal with for consistent results. That said, I don’t think the difference in the US vs UK ratios should be big enough to make a difference, and I would assume UK units anyhow. I suspect something else is off with the recipe. But this is really drifting from the thread topic. If there’s another thread I’d be happy to diagnose the recipe. There’s not a whole lot of variables in soda bread. The leavening could be off, or the flour amount could be off. You have to use a little judgement with these things if the final dough looks too heavy or too thin. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/153 "2017-07-31T15:14:47Z")
Actually, **Chronos** , I thought the soda bread sounded familiar, and I found [the other thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=20381654#post20381654) it was in, if you want to continue the side discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/154 "2017-07-31T15:21:25Z")
Weighing eggs is the way to go and proportion the recipe accordingly - it’s what large scale commercial bakery does, and it works at the smaller scale just fine. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2017, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825/155 "2017-07-31T18:15:22Z")
Eh, I lost the original recipe long ago, so if I were ever to try it again, it’d be from a recipe I looked up online and whose units I could be sure of. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-in-usa-with-1-litre-soda-pop-is-usa-on-metric/124825.md?page=7)