# What's the deal with "training money"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 18, 2016, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071 "2016-05-18T10:01:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/1 "2016-05-18T10:01:34Z")
If you look up “training money” or “training banknotes” on [Ebay](http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=training+currency&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR1.TRC0.A0.H0.Xtraining+money.TRS0&_nkw=training+money&_sacat=0) you’ll get over 1000 auctions like [this](http://www.ebay.com/itm/A-bundle-of-100-Pcs-China-Bank-Staff-100-Dollars-Training-Banknotes-Paper-Money-/301957581062?hash=item464e130906:g:1vwAAOSwdU1W-6-9). The bills (mostly UDS but also Euros and other currencies) look pretty real except for some Chinese writing stamped on them. I’ve never seen one in person so I cannot say how the paper they’re printed on feels. What stands out to me is how much of it there is. If this is on the level and used for training bank tellers, what’s the purpose of selling it to the public? And what legitimate reasons would someone in the USA want it for? ---
**Author:** ![Crazyhorse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazyhorse/32/31_2.png) [@Crazyhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazyhorse)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/2 "2016-05-18T12:26:37Z")
The Bank of China presumably has many thousands of tellers in training on any given day, year round. They print up lots of training bills. Some portion of them eventually make their way out for sale as novelty items or curiosities. Being worth no more to the bank than the paper they’re printed on it’s probably more expensive to try to account for them all and collect them back from employees than it is to just print more whenever needed. As to why anyone puts them on ebay the only explanation is that they must sell there, at least occasionally. They are worth just barely more than the paper they’re printed on to someone, and that potential for a tiny bit of extra income is being exploited. What legitimate reason is there for buying any novelty item? ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/3 "2016-05-18T12:32:31Z")
As to legitimate use in the US, it could be used in a movie, perhaps when you want to show the briefcase full of cash. ---
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/4 "2016-05-18T19:32:19Z")
Legitimate reasons might include stage/film/photography props or as material for novelty items (e.g. “this paperweight contains $1 million in shredded money!”). Perhaps used Chinese training money is cheaper than new training money manufactured for the U.S. market, and it’s purchased by banks and business to train their own employees. You could use it to test and calibrate money-handling machinery such as bill counters or ATMs. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/5 "2016-05-18T19:37:45Z")
Let’s acknowledge the 800 pound gorilla in the room; some of this money is being bought by people who do not have legitimate uses in mind. They’re going to try to pass these notes off as real money. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/6 "2016-05-18T19:43:07Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Let’s acknowledge the 800 pound gorilla in the room; some of this money is being bought by people who do not have legitimate uses in mind. They’re going to try to pass these notes off as real money. [Here’s training money](http://banksupplies.com/740-money) that can’t (hopefully) be used as the real thing. ---
**Author:** ![Crazyhorse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazyhorse/32/31_2.png) [@Crazyhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazyhorse)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/7 "2016-05-18T20:21:04Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Let’s acknowledge the 800 pound gorilla in the room; some of this money is being bought by people who do not have legitimate uses in mind. They’re going to try to pass these notes off as real money. Do you know that as a fact? I’d think there would be a lot of coverage of that happening if it did.(even if only in the ‘dumbest criminals’ type stories) Besides the big, bright red lettering on both sides and diagonal lines printed across the corners, they are printed on regular paper, not currency stock. It is about as likely as trying to pass off Monopoly money or printing the photos directly on their own printers. I’m sure somewhere someone has tried, but that isn’t a realistic concern. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/8 "2016-05-18T20:32:55Z")
The auction linked in the OP says that the feel is “infinitely close” to a real banknote. Really, the whole thing seems to have a little “wink, wink” quality to it: _The Appearance, pattern, feel is infinitely close to real banknote. […] Not legal tender, This is not in circulation. Please Read the description as good before buying. Lest some misunderstanding occurred._ Reminds me of the old “Please be sure to never do this with your grape juice kit of else wine may result!” Prohibition gimmick. But, I’ll admit that I could be reading something into it that’s not there but I wouldn’t be surprised if people bought these (sometimes) with the intent of passing them as currency even if physical examination of the product leads them to believe that it’s not going to work. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/9 "2016-05-18T20:45:49Z")
> [@Crazyhorse](#): > > Do you know that as a fact? I’d think there would be a lot of coverage of that happening if it did.(even if only in the ‘dumbest criminals’ type stories) [Coverage](http://www.ramblingbeachcat.com/2012/11/weird-crime-its-all-about-abrahams.html) [like](http://ksfm.cbslocal.com/2015/02/27/dumb-guy-made-counterfeit-money-using-napkins-pics/) [this?](http://en.rocketnews24.com/2013/11/08/two-japanese-high-school-kids-arrested-in-really-bad-attempt-at-cash-fraud/) The reality is not all criminals are masterminds. Some are stupid. But surprisingly, they often succeed in their crimes because some victims are stupid too. ---
**Author:** ![Crazyhorse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazyhorse/32/31_2.png) [@Crazyhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazyhorse)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/10 "2016-05-18T21:14:05Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > [Coverage](http://www.ramblingbeachcat.com/2012/11/weird-crime-its-all-about-abrahams.html) [like](http://ksfm.cbslocal.com/2015/02/27/dumb-guy-made-counterfeit-money-using-napkins-pics/) [this?](http://en.rocketnews24.com/2013/11/08/two-japanese-high-school-kids-arrested-in-really-bad-attempt-at-cash-fraud/) > > The reality is not all criminals are masterminds. Some are stupid. But surprisingly, they often succeed in their crimes because some victims are stupid too. None of those are coverage about Bank of China training money being bought for the purpose of passing it off as real. I’m aware people do stupid things and surely someone has tried at some point, but you could make the same claim about any novelty money businesses that exist anywhere. The stupid criminal isn’t their intended customer. Despite the existence of stupid criminals the availability of these notes doesn’t provide them with anything more useful than a home printer or the wacky novelty money shown in the stories you linked to could provide. I can’t find one example of anyone passing these specific training notes off as real, but like I said, and your examples reinforce, only an idiot would try. But you stated as a fact that these are being used fraudulently and I was curious if you had a cite. People having tried foolishly to pass off other things as currency still isn’t a cite that any have tried with these, much less that it’s the intended use the sellers are marketing to. ---
**Author:** ![Isilder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@Isilder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isilder)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2016, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/11 "2016-05-18T22:45:11Z")
Bank of Canada warns not to make or pass these, although they didn’t quite get around to saying “the overstamp /defacing in no way makes these more legal than the same thing without overstamp !” But thats what they meant, the overstamp is no more avoiding the laws about counterfeiting than making a minor change to a photocopy of a $100 you make yourself. You wouldn’t think that putting horns on the portrait or putting a spelling mistake or leaving out the security features provides protection. Even changing the value to $22.50 doesn’t. > **[anti\_counterfeiting\_summer\_2013.pdf](https://www.bankofcanada.ca/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/anti_counterfeiting_summer_2013.pdf)** ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2016, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/12 "2016-05-19T00:09:08Z")
> [@cwthree](#): > > Legitimate reasons might include stage/film/photography props or as material for novelty items (e.g. “this paperweight contains $1 million in shredded money!”). It’d be one heck of a paperweight! Even using the largest note in common circulation ($100), it’d be about 225 pounds (~ 100kg), and would be larger than most suitcases. Just how big are your papers? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![glowacks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/glowacks/32/5548_2.png) [@glowacks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glowacks)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2016, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/13 "2016-05-19T04:06:49Z")
I like the link to play money where they are selling 100 plastic pennies for $4. I think you can get real pennies at a much better rate. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2016, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/14 "2016-05-19T04:48:04Z")
> [@Crazyhorse](#): > > None of those are coverage about Bank of China training money being bought for the purpose of passing it off as real. So your argument is that while you acknowledge plenty of people pass off novelty money as the real thing, for some reason you feel this particular brand of novelty money would never be used for that purpose. And that the Bank of China has never imagined that anyone would use their fake money as the real thing even though fake money printed by other organizations is often used this way. And that none of the customers who are looking for novelty money to use fraudulently have ever purchased Bank of China money for this purpose, despite it being sold, no questions asked, on eBay. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2016, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/15 "2016-05-19T04:58:35Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Let’s acknowledge the 800 pound gorilla in the room; some of this money is being bought by people who do not have legitimate uses in mind. They’re going to try to pass these notes off as real money. And the Gorilla’s 1000lb husband in the room is the fact that the United States Dollar is a currency heavily overseas, often by parties with no link to the US. While an American may pause at the look and feel of it, a foreigner will probably not. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2016, 10:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/16 "2016-05-19T10:35:17Z")
You burn them to pay your American ancestors’ way out of Hell. ---
**Author:** ![Crazyhorse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazyhorse/32/31_2.png) [@Crazyhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazyhorse)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2016, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/17 "2016-05-19T12:19:50Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > So your argument is that while you acknowledge plenty of people pass off novelty money as the real thing, for some reason you feel this particular brand of novelty money would never be used for that purpose. And that the Bank of China has never imagined that anyone would use their fake money as the real thing even though fake money printed by other organizations is often used this way. And that none of the customers who are looking for novelty money to use fraudulently have ever purchased Bank of China money for this purpose, despite it being sold, no questions asked, on eBay. I had a simple question; do you have a cite to back up your claim these are being used fraudulently? You said so as a factual answer. But clearly you don’t. It doesn’t matter if we think they might be, could be, probably are, or if other similar things have happened before. None of those make your statement anything more than your personal opinion. I don’t acknowledge ‘plenty of people pass off novelty money as the real thing’. Some, a few, very stupid people have tried to. That isn’t an indicator of anything. Some very stupid people might do anything. That isn’t a valid basis to assume anything at all about the sellers intentions, much less make it an ‘800 lb gorilla in the room’. > [@AK84](#): > > And the Gorilla’s 1000lb husband in the room is the fact that the United States Dollar is a currency heavily overseas, often by parties with no link to the US. While an American may pause at the look and feel of it, a foreigner will probably not. And, in your humble opinion, that makes these fraudulent? We have a forum for that. This isn’t it. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2016, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/18 "2016-05-19T13:27:53Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > And what legitimate reasons would someone in the USA want it for? There was play money at my primary school. I loved playing with it, and so did other kids. So, giving it to your children would be a perfectly good reason to want it. I used to organize live-action role-playing games. We typically needed money. If set in the contemporary world, play money could be useful. I guess people could want to use it in table games. That’s three examples just out of my mind. ---
**Author:** ![Patch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a183cd/32.png) [@Patch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patch)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2016, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/19 "2016-05-19T18:43:35Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > It’d be one heck of a paperweight! > Even using the largest note in common circulation ($100), it’d be about 225 pounds (~ 100kg), and would be larger than most suitcases. > > Just how big are your papers? 🙂 Nope, you’re off by an order of magnitude. $1,000,000 in $100s weights a shade over 22 lbs. Interestingly, [there’s actually a web page for this.](http://1000000-euro.de/how-much-does-a-million-dollars-weigh/index.php#weigh-dollar) ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2016, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071/20 "2016-05-19T19:09:09Z")
> [@cwthree](#): > > Legitimate reasons might include stage/film/photography props or as material for novelty items (e.g. “this paperweight contains $1 million in shredded money!”). At one point, the US Treasury sold real shredded money for those novelty paperweights. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-deal-with-training-money/755071.md?page=2)