# What's the difference between a "rock opera" and a "concept album"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [April 7, 2025, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740 "2025-04-07T15:16:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/1 "2025-04-07T15:16:05Z")
To me a “concept album” is an album that has a unifying theme or story. But it seems like the same could be said for a “rock opera”. So what’s the difference? I suppose by definition a concept album needs to encompass an entire album, but not necessarily so for a rock opera. Would something like “2112” by Rush or “Supper’s Ready” by Genesis be considered rock operas? Also, a concept album may not be restricted to rock (for example is John Coltrane’s “A Love Supreme” a concept album?) where again by definition a rock opera pretty much has to be rock. So where do you draw the line? Is there even a line? Or more like a Venn diagram where the two overlap? ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/2 "2025-04-07T15:20:32Z")
A Rock Opera has to tell a story or have some semblance of a running narrative. A concept album just needs a theme. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/3 "2025-04-07T15:24:33Z")
I believe all Rock Operas are Concept Albums but most Concept Albums are not Rock Operas. The first Concept album was probably [Frank Sinatra “In the Wee Small Hours” from 1955](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5J8MYyM85U8&list=PLsoD4eYuzH2U4NOhyNrLc8LoB4iiPLdrE&index=2). So absolutely not a Rock Opera. Floyd had several concept albums and they are common to Prog Rock groups. So the only thing that I think clearly distinguishes a Rock Opera, is the album has a storyline about a character or small groups of characters. Tommy is clearly one. [Jesus Christ Superstar](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_Christ_Superstar) must count. Bowie’s [The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rise_and_Fall_of_Ziggy_Stardust_and_the_Spiders_from_Mars). Zappa’s Joe’s Garage **The Wall** counts, though I never think of it as one. ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/4 "2025-04-07T15:37:13Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Floyd had several concept albums and they are common to Prog Rock groups. Pink Floyd is who I immediately thought of when I read the post title, as well. _Dark Side of the Moon_ is a concept album, but I wouldn’t call it a ‘rock opera’. > [@What\_Exit](#): > > **The Wall** counts, though I never think of it as one. _The Wall_ is a concept album with a more clearly defined narrative structure, so I agree it might be considered a ‘rock opera’ as well as a concept album. Or not. There’s probably some subjectivity there. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/5 "2025-04-07T16:00:55Z")
> [@solost](#): > > _The Wall_ is a concept album with a more clearly defined narrative structure, so I agree it might be considered a ‘rock opera’ as well as a concept album. Or not. There’s probably some subjectivity there. Never heard The Wall labeled as a Rock Opera and I’ve been listening to it since it came out. But it does pretty much fit the definition laid out here. I think this may be because The Who may have overdone the Rock Opera thing in the 70’s with Tommy and Quadrophinia. Pink floyd had been mainly known for their concept albums during the same time period, and by the time The Wall came out the Rock Opera was an older term that fell out of use. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/6 "2025-04-07T16:30:59Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > I believe all Rock Operas are Concept Albums What about a rock opera that is performed live but never recorded? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/7 "2025-04-07T16:32:22Z")
Are there any? I guess that can’t be a concept album. ---
**Author:** ![mixdenny](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mixdenny/32/2962_2.png) [@mixdenny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mixdenny)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/8 "2025-04-07T16:32:51Z")
“Hair” is a rock musical while “Jesus Christ Superstar” is a rock opera. A rock opera can indeed become the entire dialogue for a real opera where every word is sung. A musical has both spoken and sung dialogue. Trust me - I was there. On the Cecil Adams Usenet group one of us was in Hair along with Mr Loaf. Her posting name was Boron and I have a playbill from when I saw her perform in Detroit. I have her picture also. She was beautiful in that role and looking at the photo makes me tear up thinking about lost youth. ---
**Author:** ![Lucas\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lucas_jackson/32/303_2.png) [@Lucas\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucas_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/9 "2025-04-07T16:38:00Z")
Dean Martin’s 1959 [A Winter Romance album](https://deanmartin.com/products/a-winter-romance-lp?srsltid=AfmBOopWEMDCJssOmaljtX09UscKVvRNKNWdrffWZ2T-u-8Thf5OQu1V) is a concept album (winter themed) but is certainly not an opera. Speaking of which, wouldn’t Christmas albums qualify as ‘concept’ albums? ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/10 "2025-04-07T16:40:08Z")
_Ma Vlast_ by Smetana is perhaps the first concept album. Or was it Schumann’s _Kinderszenen_? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/11 "2025-04-07T16:43:38Z")
I think if it predates albums, it doesn’t qualify. Also anything written as an actually Opera or Broadway style show doesn’t count. Christmas Albums fit the definition of Concept Albums but aren’t. They’re an exception I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/12 "2025-04-07T16:47:52Z")
Is anyone still doing Rock Opera’s? I’m not up on the the newer stuff (2012 on up) so I’m not sure if its been a thing recently? When was the latest Rock Opera released? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/13 "2025-04-07T16:49:35Z")
**Smashing Pumpkins** released this recently: (May 2023) [Atum: A Rock Opera in Three Acts - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atum:_A_Rock_Opera_in_Three_Acts#:~:text=Atum:%20A%20Rock%20Opera%20in%20Three%20Acts,2023.%20*%20%22Empires%22%20Released:%20April%2013%2C%202023). ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/14 "2025-04-07T17:44:38Z")
One thing I notice about rock operas is repetition: themes, bits of songs, etc. Often associated with a character, a setting or a callback to an event. A common motif in regular operas. Not so common with concept albums, but of course there are always exceptions. E.g., _Sgt. Pepper_. (Which also had an orchestral warmup at the start.) ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/15 "2025-04-07T19:16:25Z")
I saw a rock ballet written by Michael Kamen before he became a soundtrack composer. He was backed by the Rochester Philharmonic Orchestra. Still the best combination of rock and classical I’ve ever heard. To my knowledge he never recorded a version. That wasn’t a commercial product, though. Knowing about the tortured creations of Pete Townshend I don’t understand why any group would create a rock opera and never bother to record it. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/16 "2025-04-07T19:38:45Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > A common motif in regular operas. A [leitmotif](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leitmotif), even. ---
**Author:** ![blondebear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blondebear/32/1022_2.png) [@blondebear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blondebear)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/17 "2025-04-07T20:01:42Z")
Not mentioned yet is _[S.F. Sorrow](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S._F._Sorrow)_ by the Pretty Things. It’s definitely a concept album, and according to the wiki article, “it is known as one of the first rock operas ever released”. YMMV of course. Some borderline albums that come to mind are _Arthur_, _Soap Opera_ and _Schoolboys In Disgrace_ by The Kinks, Frank Zappa’s _Joe’s Garage_ and _Consequences_ by Godley and Creme. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/18 "2025-04-07T20:16:17Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > Is anyone still doing Rock Opera’s? I’m not up on the the newer stuff (2012 on up) so I’m not sure if its been a thing recently? When was the latest Rock Opera released? It’s recent for me because I’m an old fart, thought it came out almost 25 years ago, but at least it fully qualifies because it has “Rock Opera” right in the title: > **[Southern Rock Opera](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Rock_Opera)** > > Southern Rock Opera is the third studio album by the American rock band Drive-By Truckers, released in 2001. A double album covering an ambitious range of subject matter from the politics of race to 1970s stadium rock, Southern Rock Opera either imagines, or filters, every topic through the context of legendary Southern band Lynyrd Skynyrd. The record was originally self-released on Soul Dump Records. The album was re-released on July 16, 2002 by Lost Highway Records. The album was financed by is... ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/19 "2025-04-07T20:19:46Z")
The most recent rock opera I can name is Green Day’s _American Idiot_ from 20 years ago. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2025, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740/20 "2025-04-07T20:35:39Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > A Rock Opera has to tell a story or have some semblance of a running narrative. A concept album just needs a theme. This would work with me, and I found the following correct as well: > [@What\_Exit](#): > > I believe all Rock Operas are Concept Albums but most Concept Albums are not Rock Operas. For me, it’s absolutely the continuity of story that elevates Rock Operas. I have a few I enjoy that explicitly label themselves as Rock Operas, but the first that came to mind was Styx and the album [Kilroy Was Here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilroy_Was_Here_(album)). > [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > Is anyone still doing Rock Opera’s? I know of one I enjoy, but I won’t say it has a wide following, “[Dreams in the Witch House: A Lovecraftian Rock Opera](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iv8uBVi0pIU&list=PLExeLmdgN1j4ylSEQEVUwx9RHNCwcXtHt)” from 2013. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-a-rock-opera-and-a-concept-album/1016740.md?page=2)