# What's the difference between uptown and downtown? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 24, 2006, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983 "2006-04-24T13:40:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Diamonds02](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@Diamonds02](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diamonds02)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/1 "2006-04-24T13:40:34Z")
Does it mean the same thing or not? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/2 "2006-04-24T13:48:58Z")
Yes. ---
**Author:** ![squeekster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/779978/32.png) [@squeekster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeekster)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/3 "2006-04-24T13:49:33Z")
Using the S.W.A.G. theory, I would have to say that they are the same thing. It probably just depends on the area of the country you are in. Kind of like people in New York say “upstate New York” when referring to the northern part of the state but if a person said “upstate Oregon” they would get a look like they just lost their last marble. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/4 "2006-04-24T14:02:50Z")
“Downtown” is the main business district of a city. “Uptown” is not used in all cities. In New York, “uptown” refers to streets of higher numbers. It is imprecise: if you’re at 12th Street, 24th Street is uptown; if you’re at 24th Street, 42nd Street is uptown. As a general term, it usually refers to addresses north of Central Park (but south of 110th Street). I don’t think there’s an “uptown” in many other cities; certainly not in places like Washington, Atlanta, or Boston. Though “uptown” in and of itself can mean “classy” (e.g., Billy Joel’s “Uptown Girl.”) The OED says it refers to the residential part of a city, and “uptown New York” is certainly residential, but I don’t see an area like Beacon Hill in Boston or Tenleytown in DC called “uptown.” ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/5 "2006-04-24T14:13:36Z")
I don’t know whether Manhattan is unique in this respect, but “uptown” and “downtown” have two meanings there: both as direction and location. Direction-wise, uptown is north and downtown is south. If you’re going uptown, it simply means that you’re going north, regardless of your location. Location-wise, downtown is the area in southern Manhattan, roughly below Canal Street; uptown is the area roughly above 59th Street; midtown is roughly between, say, 34th Street and 59th. These boundaries are approximate, and there are of course all sorts of neighborhoods within and between these areas. If you’re in one of the other burroughs, “downtown” usually (but not always) means “Manhattan.” ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/6 "2006-04-24T14:17:17Z")
I should have added that uptown and downtown also have another connotation. “Uptown” can mean more affluent or cultured or sophisticated; “Downtown” can mean the opposite. These meanings no longer reflect anything resembling reality. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/7 "2006-04-24T14:55:41Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > I should have added that uptown and downtown also have another connotation. “Uptown” can mean more affluent or cultured or sophisticated; “Downtown” can mean the opposite. These meanings no longer reflect anything resembling reality. Are you trying to say that Downtown Julie Brown wasn’t cultured and sophisticated? At least compared to the white Julie Brown? Of course, downtown brown was a slang term for heroin, but still… Anyway, for those of us of a Certain Age, downtown will always be the wonderful place associated with Petula Clark. > [@](#): > > When you’re alone and life is making you lonely > You can always go - downtown. > When you’ve got worries all the noise and the hurry > Seems to help > I know - downtown. Crosstown, immortalized in Jimi Hendrix’s “Crosstown Traffic” seems to be unique to NYC, though. I’d be curious to know if it’s used anywhere else. (Always meant to make that a thread.) About 99.9% of all terms relating to urban life in the U.S. are NYC references. They’ve passed into the general language but rarely have the same unique meanings elsewhere. ---
**Author:** ![aktep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f0a364/32.png) [@aktep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aktep)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/8 "2006-04-24T15:15:01Z")
> [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > Crosstown, immortalized in Jimi Hendrix’s “Crosstown Traffic” seems to be unique to NYC, though. I’d be curious to know if it’s used anywhere else. (Always meant to make that a thread.) We use “Crosstown” to mean east-west. See [http://www.capmetro.org/riding/schedulesandmaps.asp](http://www.capmetro.org/riding/schedulesandmaps.asp) (routes in the 300s). At one time, there was a plan to build a “Crosstown Expressway” (and occasionally still is). a quick google search shows Crosstown to have a similar meaning in reference to I-40 in Oklahoma city, but refers to a north-south highway in Corpus Christi. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/9 "2006-04-24T15:21:05Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > I don’t know whether Manhattan is unique in this respect, but “uptown” and “downtown” have two meanings there: both as direction and location. > > Direction-wise, uptown is north and downtown is south. If you’re going uptown, it simply means that you’re going north, regardless of your location. > > Location-wise, downtown is the area in southern Manhattan, roughly below Canal Street; uptown is the area roughly above 59th Street; midtown is roughly between, say, 34th Street and 59th. These boundaries are approximate, and there are of course all sorts of neighborhoods within and between these areas. > > If you’re in one of the other burroughs, “downtown” usually (but not always) means “Manhattan.” Exactly. When I was growing up in the Bronx, if we were going to Manhattan, we would say we were going “downtown,” even if we were going to Uptown. The Bronx doesn’t have a “Downtown” of it’s own; Brooklyn does. Billy Joel’s “Uptown Girl” would have lived in one of the wealthier neighborhoods in Upper Manhattan. Joel was writing from the perspective of someone living in one of the cheaper neighborhoods Downtown, such as the Lower East Side. To me in the Bronx, she would have been a downtown girl. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/10 "2006-04-24T15:26:22Z")
The town center of the village of [Oxford, Ohio,](http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?city=Oxford&state=oh) (officially a “city,” but it’s pretty small) is “uptown.” There is no downtown. ---
**Author:** ![Tastes\_of\_Chocolate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tastes_of_chocolate/32/3232_2.png) [@Tastes\_of\_Chocolate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tastes_of_Chocolate)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/11 "2006-04-24T15:26:43Z")
I was wondering this just this weekend. Minneapolis has an uptown area, which is south of downtown, not on a hill, and to my inexperienced eye, wasn’t particularly affluent when it was build. Realitychuck’s possibility of a residential area with higher street numbers would fit though. ---
**Author:** ![elmwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmwood/32/3060_2.png) [@elmwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elmwood)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/12 "2006-04-24T15:40:46Z")
Among planners, “uptown” has a distinct meaning. “Downtown” is the historic heart of the city, where the first settlements took place. It’s usually where the main business district is. “Uptown” is a second major business district, still located in the central city, but removed from and distinct from “Downtown.” It shoudn’t be confused with an “edge city,” which tend to be located in suburban areas, and have more of a suburban auto-centric feel. Some uptowns, even though they’re not always called “uptown”: New City in Detroit, Country Club Plaza in Kansas City, Uptown NYC, Younge/Bloor in Toronto, Wilshire Boulevard in Los Angeles. Some downtowns are called “uptown”, but they’re not true uptowns. Charlotte, North Carolina comes to mind. ---
**Author:** ![Kozmik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8dc957/32.png) [@Kozmik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kozmik)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/13 "2006-04-24T17:33:08Z")
How do streets factor into the distiction? In some cities, there is literally a Main Street. Or there is a main street and a ‘secondary’ main street. Do you know of any city with streets that mark the division of uptown from downtown? In Ann Arbor, the downtown is located on Main Street and Liberty. There is a restaurant row on Main Street and a lot of botiques, diners, bars, and businesses. Then there is Liberty Street which intersects the 1st St, 4th St, 5th St. ect. All the nightclubs are off of Liberty Street. Five blocks from Main Street is State Street. Division Street, ironically, seems to separate Uptown from Downtown. Between Division and State there is a lot of cafes, bookstores, apartments, and theaters. The difference beween uptown Ann Arbor and downtown Ann Arbor is very noticable. The center of Ann Arbor is a rectangle marked by Main Street on the west, State Street on the east, and Huron Street on the north and Packard Street on the south. And Uptown and Downtown is divided by Division Street. ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/14 "2006-04-24T19:40:11Z")
Here we use the terms downtown and upcountry. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/15 "2006-04-24T19:43:54Z")
> [@elmwood](#): > > Among planners, “uptown” has a distinct meaning. > > “Downtown” is the historic heart of the city, where the first settlements took place. It’s usually where the main business district is. > > “Uptown” is a second major business district, still located in the central city, but removed from and distinct from “Downtown.” It shoudn’t be confused with an “edge city,” which tend to be located in suburban areas, and have more of a suburban auto-centric feel. > > Some uptowns, even though they’re not always called “uptown”: New City in Detroit, Country Club Plaza in Kansas City, Uptown NYC, Younge/Bloor in Toronto, Wilshire Boulevard in Los Angeles. > > Some downtowns are called “uptown”, but they’re not true uptowns. Charlotte, North Carolina comes to mind. So, in that sense of the word, somewhere like Buckhead in Atlanta is an uptown? ---
**Author:** ![Snickers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@Snickers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snickers)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/16 "2006-04-24T20:17:19Z")
> [@Tastes of Chocolate](#): > > I was wondering this just this weekend. > Minneapolis has an uptown area, which is south of downtown, not on a hill, and to my inexperienced eye, wasn’t particularly affluent when it was build. Realitychuck’s possibility of a residential area with higher street numbers would fit though. Ahh - but look! **elmwood** ’s excellent answer about a second business district would fit nicely for Minneapolis’s Uptown - it is separate from downtown, but isn’t particularly suburbanized and is nicely walkable for its residents. So that makes more sense now. It always made me wonder what else is goofy with Minnesotans when their Uptown is south of downtown. And we have a Crosstown too - in our case, it’s a traffic artery headed east-west across the southern metro area. ---
**Author:** ![Enola\_Straight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dec6dc/32.png) [@Enola\_Straight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enola_Straight)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/17 "2006-04-24T22:37:19Z")
In Philadelphia, the Schuykill Expresway has an off-ramp that leads Uptown and Downtown. Downtown is Center City, and Uptown leads to Drexel University and University of Penn. Why “Uptown”? Because you’re literally going uphill, cresting up around 40th st and Market Streets. ---
**Author:** ![medstar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f07891/32.png) [@medstar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/medstar)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2006, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/18 "2006-04-24T23:04:38Z")
I’ve heard the term, “mid-town” spoken by detectives on Law & Order. What would this refer to? ---
**Author:** ![elmwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmwood/32/3060_2.png) [@elmwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elmwood)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2006, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/19 "2006-04-25T00:51:41Z")
> [@Zsofia](#): > > So, in that sense of the word, somewhere like Buckhead in Atlanta is an uptown? Buckhead, yes. Something along the Perimeter, no. Manhattan’s “Midtown” is technically an uptown. There’s a few urban “uptowns” that never quite made it; the Depression hit, they were eclipsed by suburban areas after World War II; and they faded form prominence. They may still have high-rise apartments, some cultural institutions, and the like, but the business and retail presence found in most uptowns is now gone. They have a “seen better days” vibe, although they still remain important neighborhoods. Midtown in St. Louis and University Circle in Cleveland come to mind. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2006, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983/20 "2006-04-25T02:01:07Z")
> [@medstar](#): > > I’ve heard the term, “mid-town” spoken by detectives on Law & Order. What would this refer to? See **panache45’s** first post. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-difference-between-uptown-and-downtown/353983.md?page=2)