# What's the largest religion that originated outside of Asia?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [September 21, 2015, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053 "2015-09-21T01:22:03Z")
**Posts on this page:** 10
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2015, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053/21 "2015-09-21T11:45:57Z")
Doesn’t all of this run into the birth-of-civilization problem?
1. Organized religion requires some form of civilization.
2. Civilization began in Asia
3. Therefore organized religion began in Asia.
This discounts animism and similar non-organized religion. I still think the chain of thought is correct, though.
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### Author:  [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2015, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053/22 "2015-09-21T12:41:16Z")
I think a lot of this comes down to if you are more of a lumper or a splitter.
To give an example, “Hinduism” is a rather constructed concept lumping together a range of beliefs and practices- from essentially monotheist to purely animist.
You could probably lump a range of interrelated African belief systems in a similar way, but we just haven’t done that.
I think a lot of what are discussing is the relatively wide range that evangelical religions tend to get, combined with a “lumping” of eastern non-evangelical religions and a general lack of knowledge of African, indigenous American and other systems.
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### Author:  [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2015, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053/23 "2015-09-21T12:44:01Z")
The modern definition of Europe includes the Volga River Basin, I think. The earliest evidence of [the prehistoric proto-Indo-European religion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proto-Indo-European_religion) appears in the middle of the Volga River Basin. This implies a “European” origin for the pagan religions of Greeks, Romans, Celts, Nordics, _and even Hinduism_.
If it’s fair to trace Protestantism back to Palestine, it may be fair to trace Hinduism back to the prehistoric religion near the Middle Volga.
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### Author:  [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053/24 "2015-09-21T14:35:03Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#):
>
> It’s admittedly on the border. Some people define it as a religion and others don’t.
What people define it as a religion? Admittedly, the NORKs treat their ruler as a deity, but I’ve never heard their government style referred to as a religion.
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### Author:  [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2015, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053/25 "2015-09-21T14:39:42Z")
> [@coremelt](#):
>
> Not really from neolithic to classical times the default for humanity was some kind of belief in animism or polytheism. Denying the existence of gods and spirits in the face of almost universal belief otherwise is in itself taking a religious stand. Theres a strong case that, if buddhism and Confucianism are counted as religions, then Atheism should be to.
That completely ignores what atheism is now, and why people become atheists in modern times: It’s isn’t a belief that there is no deity, it’s a lack of faith in any deity. It’s completely different from anything else you mentioned, all of which involve articles of faith in their traditional forms. (Yes, even Buddhism.) There are atheistic religions, but they’re religions without deities, and are therefore separate from atheism as modern atheists know it.
In short, modern atheism is a philosophy, like rule consequentialism or deontology or logical positivism, and trying to shoehorn it into the “religion” mold makes no more sense than to try to claim deontology is a religion.
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### Author:  [@xnylder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xnylder)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2015, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053/26 "2015-09-21T17:03:16Z")
> [@Claverhouse](#):
>
> Voodoo doesn’t count since that too was derived from Christianity.
No. Voodoo/Voudou is not derived from Christianity. It is a syncretic religion largely based on African beliefs that borrowed Christian symbolism. Faced with persecution (for example, in Haiti), practitioners adopted the names and identities of Christian saints for Vodou figures. For example, Damballah, the sky father and cosmic serpent, is identified with Saint Patrick, who legendarily drove the snakes out of Ireland. Even now, while vodou can be practiced openly in some parts of the world, Christian symbols such as prayer cards and saint candles are still used to represent the vodou loa (spirits).
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### Author:  [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2015, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053/27 "2015-09-21T19:19:22Z")
> [@Monty](#):
>
> What people define it as a religion? Admittedly, the NORKs treat their ruler as a deity, but I’ve never heard their government style referred to as a religion.
Well, [Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juche) is an obvious first source:
> [@](#):
>
> Some South Korean scholars categorize Juche as a national religion or compare its allegedly religious facets to those of other religions or religious movements. For instance, Juche has been compared to Christianity due to the observable familiarities in their doctrines, rituals and religious practices, and community organization. It has also been compared to pre-existing religions in Korea, notably neo-Confucianism and Korean shamanism. While the influence of East Asian and Western traditional religions on Juche is widely disputed, the ideology has been examined in several academic studies as a national and indigenous religious movement rather than solely a political philosophy for the following features: presence of a sacred leader, rituals, and familism.
So we can argue about whether or not Juche is a religion. But the fact that some people are saying it’s a religion is objectively true.
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### Author:  [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2015, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053/28 "2015-09-21T19:26:17Z")
> [@coremelt](#):
>
> I would argue its “Secular Humanism / Atheism” based on the list here:
> [List of religious populations - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religious_populations)
>
> I’m going to claim that Diagoras of Melos is the founder of Athiesm, which puts it in Greece and thus in Europe.
> [Diagoras of Melos - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diagoras_of_Melos)
> [@Derleth](#):
>
> Atheism is a religion to the extent that not collecting stamps is a hobby. It’s lumped in with religions for statistical purposes, but calling it one in this context is idiotic.
> [@coremelt](#):
>
> Not really from neolithic to classical times the default for humanity was some kind of belief in animism or polytheism. Denying the existence of gods and spirits in the face of almost universal belief otherwise is in itself taking a religious stand. Theres a strong case that, if buddhism and Confucianism are counted as religions, then Atheism should be to.
> [@Derleth](#):
>
> That completely ignores what atheism is now, and why people become atheists in modern times: It’s isn’t a belief that there is no deity, it’s a lack of faith in any deity. It’s completely different from anything else you mentioned, all of which involve articles of faith in their traditional forms. (Yes, even Buddhism.) There are atheistic religions, but they’re religions without deities, and are therefore separate from atheism as modern atheists know it.
>
> In short, modern atheism is a philosophy, like rule consequentialism or deontology or logical positivism, and trying to shoehorn it into the “religion” mold makes no more sense than to try to claim deontology is a religion.
**Moderating**
Let’s not sidetrack this into a discussion of whether or not atheism is a religion. We have plenty of threads on this. For the purposes of this thread, let’s exclude it.
Colibri
General Questions Moderator
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### Author:  [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2015, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053/29 "2015-09-21T20:18:37Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#):
>
> …Rastafarianism,… (Rasta has [sects](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mansions_of_Rastafari) and _some_ Jewish influence but still unique and North American with claims to Africa)… 🙂
Rastafarianism is quite interesting. It is clearly inspired by Judaism and Semitic religion in general, but it reached its current form in a West African diaspora milieu. One could make arguments either way - that it is an offshoot of Judaism that has been modified to fit an African context, or that it is an African religion that has adopted elements of Judaism.
> [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](#):
>
> There’s an argument to say Judaism started in Africa. And it can trace it’s evolutionary routes back to Ancient Egyptian religion.
That’s a good point. Even if you accept the origin story of the Jewish people as written in the Bible, it is not clear at what point the first Jewish person came about. Some might say it was Abraham, who is generally understood to have lived in Sumeria or Babylonia (which are in the Asian portion of the Middle East), while others would say that there were no Judaism per se until Moses organized his kinsmen in Egypt (which is in Africa) to rebel and form their own country outside of Africa. Then you have the potential question as to whether Judaism coalesced before they reached the Africa/Asia line or afterward. “Yeah, we have to finish writing down our scriptures now, before we reach the border tomorrow. Otherwise, people will claim that we aren’t really an African religion! Hurry up and write!”
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### Author:  [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2015, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-largest-religion-that-originated-outside-of-asia/732053/30 "2015-09-21T21:46:50Z")
Thinking about this more…
The “East” is a pretty big chunk of the planet, and obviously everything with an origin in the East has an origin in the East.
What isn’t in the East? We’ve got Europe, the Americas, and Africa.
European religions enjoyed a good run, but were pretty systematically replaced by Christianity. No mystery there.
African religions faced often violent opposition from Islam and Christianity for nearly a couple thousand years. They’ve stayed the strongest in more remote and inaccessible areas- which means they’ve probably had more opportunities to grow apart than grow together.
North America was cataclysmically depopulated, and South American religions faced targeted, systematic destruction. Again, they have survived in remote areas, or when incorporated into Christianity.
I don’t think we are seeing a phenomenon based on any particular quality of east and west, but rather an accident of history based on who got colonized for what purpose.
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