# What's the legal penalty if any for spitting on the president? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 8, 2006, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886 "2006-09-08T05:43:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/21 "2006-09-09T01:31:58Z")
[QUOTE=hajario] This example is ridiculously implausible. Cleveland already served two terms and would be inelegible for re-election. I guess that if you could suspend your disbelief enough for this to happen, you would be guilty of assault so pretty much the same as if you punched him. [/QUOTE] He served both those terms _before_ the 22d amendment went into effect. He’d still be eligible. ---
**Author:** ![oy\_vay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/258eb7/32.png) [@oy\_vay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oy_vay)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 8:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/22 "2006-09-09T08:02:38Z")
Cool thanks for the answers. Was wondering if the president had some special no spitting laws as no matter no good or bad a pres you are you’re gonna have people who wanna spit on you. Also good to know Zombie Cleveland is eligible for office. ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/23 "2006-09-09T08:25:27Z")
[QUOTE=alphaboi867] He served both those terms _before_ the 22d amendment went into effect. He’d still be eligible. [/QUOTE] > [@The Twenty-Second Amendment to the Constitution of the Constitution of the United States](#): > > No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice, and no person who has held the office of President, or acted as President, for more than two years of a term to which some other person was elected President shall be elected to the office of the President more than once. Not based strictly on the text. Are you suggesting that restricting him from running for president would somehow amount to an ex post facto law? Because I don’t think that’s the case. That would only be valid if we were discussing criminal law, not constitutional eligibility to the presidency. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/24 "2006-09-09T12:21:02Z")
[QUOTE=oy vay] Also good to know Zombie Cleveland is eligible for office. [/QUOTE] I for one welcome our new Zombie Cleveland overlord. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/25 "2006-09-09T15:16:34Z")
[QUOTE=alphaboi867] He served both those terms _before_ the 22d amendment went into effect. He’d still be eligible. [/QUOTE] Incorrect. As was discussed several posts ago, only Zombie Truman is still eligible. From A22 > [@](#): > > But this Article shall not apply to any person holding the office of President when this Article was proposed by the Congress, and shall not prevent any person who may be holding the office of President, or acting as President, during the term within which this Article becomes operative from holding the office of President or acting as President during the remainder of such term. ---
**Author:** ![KP](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a9adbd/32.png) [@KP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KP)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/26 "2006-09-09T21:42:09Z")
Well, in the first case, the crime clearly be “Assault on the Dead with Sputum”. (“Assault on a dead revivant”? “Assault on dead three-termer”? Dang, I can smell a AwaDW pun in there somewhere, but I can’t find it While Grover Cleveland may not be eligible to be _elected_ as president, I see nothing in the 22nd Amendment that prevents him from being elected Vice President, and entering the office by succession (or even possibly a resignation immediately after the election, but before inauguration – though that situation is unclear, no matter who is VP-elect) > [@The 22nd Amendment](#): > > Section 1. No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice, and no person who has held the office of President, or acted as President, for more than two years of a term to which some other person was elected President shall be elected to the office of the President more than once. But this Article shall not apply to any person holding the office of President when this Article was proposed by the Congress, and shall not prevent any person who may be holding the office of President, or acting as President, during the term within which this Article becomes operative from holding the office of President or acting as President during the remainder of such term. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/27 "2006-09-09T22:24:13Z")
If you are ineligible to be the Prez, you are ineligible to be the VP. ---
**Author:** ![Rucksinator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/898d66/32.png) [@Rucksinator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rucksinator)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/28 "2006-09-09T23:30:33Z")
[QUOTE=oy vay] To avoid a political argument lets say I wanted to reanimate Groover Cleveland, get him reelected, and spit on him. [/QUOTE] Well, that attempt to avert a hijacking certainly worked well. ---
**Author:** ![oy\_vay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/258eb7/32.png) [@oy\_vay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oy_vay)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2006, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/29 "2006-09-10T00:49:10Z")
[QUOTE=Rucksinator] Well, that attempt to avert a hijacking certainly worked well. [/QUOTE] Well the convo on the 22nd amendment was interesting too. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2006, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/30 "2006-09-10T02:11:55Z")
Was is Zombie Truman or Zombie Cleveland who promised a brain in every pot? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Scrivener](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@The\_Scrivener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Scrivener)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2006, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/31 "2006-09-10T03:05:18Z")
[inevitable zombie hijacking] Backing up to the “zombie” part, would a zombie Former President Cleveland really be considered a legal “person” or “alive” and thus eligible for office? Legally speaking, he’d have already been certified as dead (death certificate issued) and his legal and financial documents (outstanding licenses – including marriage license, bank accounts, etc.) would have been emptied out, nullified, etc. A modern-day zombie would have to get a Social Security number and a [revalidated?] birth certificate, right? And presumably he’d have to get that pesky death certificate nullified. Another legal complication would concern insurance monies paid out and the disposition of debts outstanding at the zombie’s previous death, not to mention the reclaiming of lost assets. Then there’s the medical definition of being alive; do zombies even have heartbeats and measurable brain activity (measured by brainwaves, and not by, say, incessant murmurings of “brains… braaaiiins…”)? Wouldn’t it be easy to get a zombie declared insane and institutionalized, at least in the short term? And wouldn’t any zombie 19th-C. president, even the fleet-footed ones who don’t chant “brains, brains” still fall critically short in the charisma department and come off as strikingly and persistently inarticulate and unpersuasive? And wouldn’t this prevent him from getting his party’s nod, let alone a popular mandate… oh, never mind.[/izh] ---
**Author:** ![Lamb\_Chop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/da6949/32.png) [@Lamb\_Chop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamb_Chop)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2006, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/32 "2006-09-10T03:27:49Z")
[QUOTE=Loach] Was is Zombie Truman or Zombie Cleveland who promised a brain in every pot? [/QUOTE] Sheesh, everyone knows that was Zombie Hoover. Right before he started cracking heads as part of the lurching, moaning Zombie Bonus Army. “Give us our bonus in braiinnnss . . .” ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2006, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/33 "2006-09-10T03:29:47Z")
[QUOTE=t-bonham@scc.net] If you happen to suffer from any type of deadly disease that can be transmitted by bodily fluids (for example, AIDS, Hepatitis, tuberculosis, etc.), you would probably be charged with the more serious crime of “assault with a deadly weapon”. (Or whatever the equivalent is in the statutes of the state where it occurs.) [/QUOTE] Just so you know, assualt of the President would be a federal crime, not a state one. From 18 US Code 1751(e) > [@](#): > > Whoever assaults [the President or Vice President] shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both. Whoever assaults [a member of the President’s or Vice President’s staff] shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned not more than one year, or both; and if the assault involved the use of a dangerous weapon, or personal injury results, shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both. ---
**Author:** ![Lamb\_Chop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/da6949/32.png) [@Lamb\_Chop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamb_Chop)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2006, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/34 "2006-09-10T03:43:27Z")
BTW, laugh at the OP’s premise if you want, but I’m pretty sure [this has been tried before](http://www.corkscrew-balloon.com/00/10/1thai/21a.html) ---
**Author:** ![Hoopy\_Frood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hoopy_frood/32/8452_2.png) [@Hoopy\_Frood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hoopy_Frood)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2006, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/35 "2006-09-13T15:08:36Z")
[QUOTE=hajario] If you are ineligible to be the Prez, you are ineligible to be the VP. [/QUOTE] True according to the 12th amendment. But the key point in contention is “What is the definition of ‘constitutional eligibility’?” Everyone agrees that base eligibility is determined by section II of COTUS. The issue is this: the 22nd amendment prohibits someone from being elected to president after serving two terms, but does it make them “ineligible” to be president under the constitution? Does the 22nd amendment increase the eligibility restrictions, or is it just limited to elections only? It’s a constitutional law question that has never been tested, and I’ve seen arguments for both sides and both are legitimate. If the letter of the law is to be taken, than, yes, a two-term vice president could be VP and become president again should the current Pres be unable to fulfill his duties. If the spirt of the law is to be taken, probably not. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2006, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/36 "2006-09-13T15:54:18Z")
[QUOTE=oy vay] To avoid a political argument lets say I wanted to reanimate Groover Cleveland, get him reelected, and spit on him. What’s the worst that could happen, based on past spittings what is likely to happen, and would any recent laws change the outcome? [/QUOTE] Sounds like a worthy mad science project. ---
**Author:** ![Hoopy\_Frood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hoopy_frood/32/8452_2.png) [@Hoopy\_Frood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hoopy_Frood)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2006, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/37 "2006-09-13T17:46:02Z")
[QUOTE=Hoopy Frood] a two-term vice president could be VP [/QUOTE] That should be “two-term president”. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Saltire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saltire/32/553_2.png) [@Saltire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saltire)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2006, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/38 "2006-09-13T20:45:34Z")
While you would most certainly be charged with some crime and forced to pay some penalty, be it a fine or a jail term, I think anyone contemplating spitting on a president should consider the more immediate consequence: Getting your ass thoroughly kicked by a platoon of guys with dark suits and sunglasses. The T-men wouldn’t be concerned about what statute was contravened, they’d just jump up and down on your skull until you stopped moving. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2006, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/39 "2006-09-13T22:58:29Z")
[QUOTE=Captain Amazing] Just so you know, assualt of the President would be a federal crime, not a state one. From 18 US Code 1751(e) [/QUOTE] Actually, it’s both. Pretty much every state has laws against assault, and there is this Federal law specifically against assault of the President or V.P. Presumably, the offender could be charged in state court by the local County Attorney, or in Federal Court by the Federal Attorney. (But not both, I think – double jeopardy would prohibit that.) ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886/40 "2006-09-14T00:31:06Z")
I know the penalty for throwing an egg at a Deputy Prime Minister is a solid left hook to the face. [http://www.unoriginal.co.uk/footage10\_6.html](http://www.unoriginal.co.uk/footage10_6.html). Prescott is an ex-boxer and still packs a mean punch. Try it with the President and the Secret Service will probably shoot you. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-legal-penalty-if-any-for-spitting-on-the-president/371886.md?page=3)