# What's the most frustrating, soul-destroying bureacratic process? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 28, 2010, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636 "2010-04-28T16:07:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Valgard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/7feea3/32.png) [@Valgard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valgard)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/61 "2010-04-30T04:46:10Z")
For me it was getting the responsible party’s insurance company to pay up for a minor fender-bender. She took her eyes off the road and slammed into a line of stopped cars, in broad daylight, with a CHP motorcycle cop stopped immediately beside me. Net damage to my truck was a dented bumper and tailgate; both had to be replaced and some painting had to be done by the bodyshop as well. Grand total was about $3k. I had to go to the ER to get X-rayed and checked out to make sure I wasn’t in fact dead. That was a couple of hundred dollars. It took over a year to get paid. A year of arguing with their claims adjuster, her supervisor, multiple calls, emails and faxes, promises made by them only to be broken, I had the body shop threaten ME with small claims court because insurance companies wouldn’t pay what they had promised they would, even with estimates in writing up front…the stress was pretty amazing, I could see myself turning into one of those angry screaming customers you see in “World’s Bitchiest Complainers”. I had to shepherd the entire process along or nothing would have ever gotten resolved. After complaining in writing to the BBB and the chairman of the board of her insurance company, my case was reassigned to a new adjuster. One phone call, albeit an hour long with me standing my ground and refusing to budge an inch, and I finally got my damn check sent out, including compensation for my time and aggravation. Which led me to the realization that the other person’s insurance company is not out to make things right or pay for damages done, they are out to wear you down through means fair and foul (mostly foul) in the hopes that you will get so frustrated that you’ll just forget the whole thing. ---
**Author:** ![NinjaChick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@NinjaChick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinjaChick)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/62 "2010-04-30T06:30:56Z")
This past summer I had to get medical records from a minor outpatient surgery performed in 1987 at a small, specialized hospital which has since physically moved and been swallowed up into a department of Very Big Regional Teaching Hospital, which wasn’t really much fun. Also, the collective process of college financial aid and dealing with loan companies is pretty awful. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/63 "2010-05-27T20:21:53Z")
Applying for a visa or as said above doing anything immigration related. Its bloody amazing, 150 years ago travel was difficult, but getting in and out of a country was easy, now travel is easy, but getting in and out is difficult. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/64 "2010-05-27T20:38:33Z")
> [@Duke](#): > > Immigration, in general. Going to Lunar House in London was the most soul-crushing experience of my life, by far. > > It starts right from getting off the Tube. The place is in an area which has little but anonymous offices as far as the eye can see. There seem to be no restaurants or pubs, just plain blocks of offices which no signage other than tiny nameplates. Everything is under construction, and you have to duck under scaffolding to walk down the street. Fortunately, nobody else is around, because it’s 5 am. > > Yes, it’s 5 am. If you want to get anything done at Lunar House, you have to get there at 5 am. I got there at 7 am once. The queue had already been shut. Already, by 7 am, enough people had shown up that Immigration Services knew they could not handle them all in eight hours. Everyone who showed up afterward was told to go home. I was lucky, I’d only come in from Oxford. One poor soul came from Manchester, sent on a trip to nowhere. We all pitched in for enough for him to stay in a local hostel, and I gave him my lunch. I was going back home anyway. > > So after waiting until 9 am, you get in. Maybe. The place goes from everyone waiting in a queue to chaos. Nobody knows what is happening, or where to go. All announcements are in English, which maybe half of the attendees can’t understand. The other half can’t understand either, because the announcements come in over a scratchy PA system worse than the Tube’s. There is a mad rush. Inevitably someone drops all their important papers and has to pick them up, blocking everyone else. > > After the waiting, comes the wait. You get a number and wait your turn. Look around the room and you can see all the stages of grief. Some people are sitting and weeping: these are the people who know they will be rejected and are waiting for the hammer to drop. Others sit tense and near anger. Still others grip their papers with a sense of fear. But most sit blank and staring, helpless to their fate. The walls are a pale, sickly blue. The hours pass with nothing to do but watch the digital number tick slowly on. There is no reading material available, no TV to watch, absolutely nothing if you didn’t plan ahead, and most people didn’t. Isn’t this a first-world country? Can’t anything get done in a reasonable manner? > > Finally your number is called. Even if you are prepared, they are not. The last time I went to Lunar House, I was given the standard greeting: “Passport, please.” I am here to get my passport back. You have it. The bureaucrat looked at me as if I had told her there was no moon. She looked at the computer again, and frowned. The keyboard received a few jabs. Another frown. She walked away from her desk. Five minutes later she returned with the passport. She slid it through the window without a word. > > “What was the result of my appeal?” Another frown, followed by a headshake. My time in the UK was over. > > On my way out of Lunar House, I ran into a man, probably from India or Pakistan. His eyes were bloodshot and he was making a brave attempt not to cry. He looked over at me. “Me neither, mate,” I told him. “Good luck.” > > The sky grew grey and cold over Lunar House. Oooh, sounds interesting… what was your appeal about? Particularly if you were an asylum speaker you could do an excellent “ask the…” thread… ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/65 "2010-05-27T20:47:09Z")
And what country is Lunar House for? Surely not the moon? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2010, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/66 "2010-05-27T22:04:21Z")
> [@Sigmagirl](#): > > I would have to think that in some of those things, **the correct answer** is “I don’t know.” You ever watch that movie _Green Card_? They foul up on Andie MacDowell’s brand of face cream, because Gerard Depardieu is trying so hard to remember all the shit he’s memorized. If he’d only shrugged and said “Who knows?” or “something with a pink lid on it,” they’d probably have been rubber-stamped. I know a former INS agent (I’m not certain what they are calling her department now) who has always said she would be suspicious of any husband that knew the specific names of his wife’s toiletries. Knowing he smell of the face cream or the price (especially if he complains about the price) would be indicative of a real of marriage, but the typical man realing off names like Estee Lauder, Clinique, etc. would seem too odd. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/67 "2010-05-29T18:14:42Z")
> [@kevlaw](#): > > Immigration into the US is awful. You have to go early before the numbers run out, then wait several hours for your number to be called. No problem, I thought, I’ll go out for a long lunch. No. They lock the doors. Another time I waited in a long line quite some time just to get a number, waited an hour or two for the number to be called, and all they did for me when I finally got to the counter was silently hand me a huge stack of forms. If you have a simple question for INS, call the Fraud hotline. They’ll probably hang up angrily when they find you have a question unrelated to fraud, but even if it takes ten calls, this will be _much_ faster than calling the regular number. These experiences are all prior to the 11th of September. Has it gotten worse? (On the other hand, I have an unbelievable story of speedy response relating to immigration in another country …) ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/68 "2010-05-29T21:43:51Z")
Man, my longtime field of endeavor rates number 2 AND 3! I’m so proud to be appreciated! ---
**Author:** ![SnapShawt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@SnapShawt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SnapShawt)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/69 "2010-05-29T22:07:51Z")
Dealing with workers compensation and disability has GOT to be at the top, if number one, on the list. Your soul is completely crushed in the process, and you wonder where they find people to work for them who have had their humanity completely sucked out and replaced by something purely evil. ---
**Author:** ![Desert\_Nomad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desert_nomad/32/177_2.png) [@Desert\_Nomad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desert_Nomad)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/70 "2010-05-29T22:10:22Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > You have to go early before the numbers run out, then wait several hours for your number to be called. That’s better than at the Czech Foreign Police (where foreigners go to do visa/residence paperwork). The Ukrainian mafia guys take all the numbers and then go around selling them. If you want a number that is coming up soon, it costs more than one with a 12 hour wait. The Czech police do nothing to stop this practice as they are in on it too. Most people hire someone to stand in line for them. And this is happening in an EU country. ---
**Author:** ![fisha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@fisha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fisha)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2010, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/71 "2010-05-30T01:17:34Z")
I vote for mortgage companies. I am a remodeling contractor that specializes in insurance claims. Mortgage companies are often named on the checks in addition to the homeowners. My best conversation so far is that I need to sign a mechanic’s lien waiver prior to the mortgage company releasing the funds. This means I am giving up all legal rights to get paid for the job. Before I get paid. This is their official policy. Fuckers. ---
**Author:** ![lynne-42](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lynne-42/32/3138_2.png) [@lynne-42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lynne-42)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2010, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/72 "2010-07-29T11:56:32Z")
> [@Desert\_Nomad](#): > > When my father died, it was quite simple to get control of a bank account with over $100K in it. Shutting off his DirectTV on the other hand took months. I was sure that my father was the first ever DirectTV customer to have died. Another vote for dealing with a loved one’s death. When my mother died, the banks were fine. The paper work for the government stuff was annoying but bearable. The PayTV contract and direct debit for charities were a nightmare to try and cancel. Magazine subscriptions on direct debit were almost impossible to cancel, and a few managed to get through the next year’s subscription by delaying a response. Not the companies’ fault, but my mother liked catalogs, especially from book sellers and knitting/sewing suppliers. Literally hundreds of them. It took a year to contact them all and convince them that I didn’t want them transferred to me. I still have thousands of books in boxes to deal with. But the worst by far was the company from whom she had leased the retirement unit. Tiny print, page 14 of the contract, was a clause that said you had to give notice, in writing, TWICE, within 14 days of the death. We - naively - thought one formal letter would be enough. Especially when they replied acknowledging the letter and saying nothing about needing a repeat! $14,000 lost in cold cash. And an appallingly poor valuation clause which meant a pitiful amount of the original price was recovered - the unit reselling immediately at double what they’d paid back. And we were only one of hundreds caught the same way. Those contracts are now outlawed. If I hear once more “What we have done is quite legal” as if that’s the same as “It’s ethical” then I will scream. ---
**Author:** ![dmatsch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3be4f8/32.png) [@dmatsch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dmatsch)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2010, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636/73 "2010-07-29T20:13:59Z")
Fighting a speeding ticket. The system is set up to make you pay. 1. no phone or address for the courthouse. Just the PO box where I can send my payment 2. no procedures listed anywhere for said fight 3. the case will automatically be decided against you if you don’t follow the unlisted procedures 4. excuses are like assholes. everyone has one. A judge won’t care that you couldn’t possibly slow down without the tailgater smashing into you, or that there were no posted speed limit signs on the 4-lane road in the middle of nowhere directly off an interstate. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-most-frustrating-soul-destroying-bureacratic-process/537636.md?page=3)