# What's the point of living a life free of vices? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 21, 2006, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095 "2006-12-21T18:06:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![mack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mack)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/21 "2006-12-21T20:07:55Z")
[QUOTE=msmith537] Not to single Christians out, but what’s the deal with people who completely abstain from all vices?: drugs alchohol sex gambling I’m not advocating becoming a heroine addict or indulging in completely irresponsible behavior, but what’s the deal? Do people think that only the dullest 1% get into heaven? Does suppressing every natural urge somehow make you a better person? [/QUOTE] While a little of the above here and there probably won’t hurt anybody beyond the individuals doing them, too much will. They’re not victimless activities if taken to excess, which they frequently are. So I guess there are those who figure it’s best not to even start. To whom I say “good luck with that”. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/22 "2006-12-21T20:12:29Z")
[QUOTE=Hampshire] **What’s the point of living a life free of vices?** No pinched fingers? [/QUOTE] Dude, get a grip. ---
**Author:** ![mack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mack)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/23 "2006-12-21T20:12:45Z")
[QUOTE=Hampshire] What’s the point of living a life free of vices? No pinched fingers? [/QUOTE] _ **Sex Vise** _ Let me pinch that for ya. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/24 "2006-12-21T20:15:11Z")
[QUOTE=Spiff] I’ll take ODing on sex for $500, Alex. Hell, I’d even do it for free! As long as it was a very long, drawn-out death… [/QUOTE] Death by Snoo-Snoo! ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/25 "2006-12-21T20:18:46Z")
[QUOTE=LionelHutz405] If your vices are the only thing keeping you from being a dull person, then you probably are already a dull person. People can be interesting for things that are not vices. Imagine that. [/QUOTE] I just think it’s odd for anyone to take an absolute stance on anything, whether that’s not drinking, not eating meat or not wearing orange. I mean how does someone decide they NEVER drink? An occassional beer with friends? A glass of wine with dinner? What do they think will happen? One drink and they’ll go off on this downward spiral? Certain things I can understand. Not smoking or shooting heroin because they are highly addictive. Not doing drugs because they are illegal. But you can have a few beers at a college keg party without turning into some reject from Animal House. ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/26 "2006-12-21T20:19:41Z")
I’ve never done drugs I dont’ gamble. I do drink, but in moderation. If asked the question “Have you engaged in pre-martital sex?” the honest answer would be “Yes”. But that was 10 years ago. Since then I’ve been engaged, married and divorced, with no sex outside of marriage. I must say that as far as I’m concerned now, I’d much rather “save myself” for my future wife. I find it more fulfilling and liberating. What you do is your descision, have some respect for mine. I find it amusing when friends say “Man, you just need to get laid.” Yeah, that’ll solve all my problems. It is also funny when people assume I’m lying. Like I go to secret trysts or something. I enjoy sex, but I can do without it until I’m married. I’ll be all right. ---
**Author:** ![Autumn\_Almanac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d26b3c/32.png) [@Autumn\_Almanac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autumn_Almanac)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/27 "2006-12-21T20:29:51Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] As for the few who do, I expect most are motivated by fear/hatred towards the opposite sex, or religious fanaticism. _That’s_ why I don’t respect them. [/QUOTE] Hmm… So in short, anyone who doesn’t agree with your sexual views and preferences is warped and unworthy of respect? Where oh where have I seen this attitude before… ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/28 "2006-12-21T20:39:48Z")
[QUOTE=Autumn Almanac] Hmm… So in short, anyone who doesn’t agree with your sexual views and preferences is warped and unworthy of respect? [/quote] Hardly. There are plenty of sexual behaviors that I have no interest in or find personally distasteful that are neither warped nor render the indulger unworthy of respect. For that matter, in this case it’s not so much that I think that absolute abstinence is warped; I just think that it’s _being_ warped that leads to absolute abstinence. ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/29 "2006-12-21T20:44:53Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] My point was that there aren’t many who _do_ choose to abstain, and most of the people who claim to do so are lying. As for the few who do, I expect most are motivated by fear/hatred towards the opposite sex, or religious fanaticism. _That’s_ why I don’t respect them. [/QUOTE] I considered abstinence right for me for basically one reason…that I couldn’t personally afford for birth control to fail. I had certain things I wanted to do with my life that I couldn’t if I had a baby, I didn’t want to have to go through giving a baby up for adoption, and I knew I could never have an abortion. I wasn’t willing to risk any of that, and that was my bottom line. > [@](#): > > Most of the remainder likely just have a low sex drive, which is arguably a defect ( but hardly their fault even if it is ). Even if it’s not, it’s hardly a moral triumph to not do something you aren’t tempted to do. > > Finally, I expect most of the people who really _do_ abstain from premarital sex won’t have much if any sex _after_ marriage. This made me laugh. If you think abstaining is easy for everyone who does it, you are dead wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Dumbguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2bfe46/32.png) [@Dumbguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dumbguy)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/30 "2006-12-21T21:01:54Z")
[QUOTE=Valgard] I have never used drugs and I don’t gamble. I am a social drinker but not drinking wouldn’t make much difference to me one way or the other. [/QUOTE] [QUOTE=BMalion] I’ve never done drugs I dont’ gamble. I do drink, but in moderation. [/QUOTE] Alcohol is a drug. A powerful one, at that. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/31 "2006-12-21T21:11:49Z")
If you can’t think of **anything** worthwhile in life other than drugs, alchohol, sex, or gambling, I pity you. (Not that there’s anything wrong with any of those four diversions, when pursued with prudence and moderation, but the implication that they are the be-all and end-all of life is just ridiculous.) ---
**Author:** ![Autumn\_Almanac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d26b3c/32.png) [@Autumn\_Almanac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autumn_Almanac)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/32 "2006-12-21T21:22:10Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] I just think that it’s _being_ warped that leads to absolute abstinence. [/QUOTE] Just so I’m clear: Do you acknowledge _any_ valid, non-pathological reason(s) an unmarried person might choose to abstain from sex (even if many or most people make that choice for invalid reasons)? ---
**Author:** ![Valgard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/7feea3/32.png) [@Valgard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valgard)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/33 "2006-12-21T21:23:37Z")
[QUOTE=Dumbguy] Alcohol is a drug. A powerful one, at that. [/QUOTE] Quite true, however as phrased in the OP they’re distinct so I’m answering in the same vein. Plenty of medicines are drugs too…the fact that I was about 30% by weight Demerol when they took my wisdom teeth out doesn’t make me a “drug user” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/34 "2006-12-21T21:29:08Z")
[QUOTE=Dumbguy] Alcohol is a drug. A powerful one, at that. [/QUOTE] Hence the moderation. It was the OP that seperated the 2. He could just as easily have said “Drugs, and smoking.” ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/35 "2006-12-21T21:35:39Z")
[QUOTE=BMalion] Hence the moderation. It was the OP that seperated the 2. He could just as easily have said “Drugs, and smoking.” [/QUOTE] Why distinguish between tobacco and other drugs? Why not just “drugs?” 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/36 "2006-12-21T21:38:01Z")
[QUOTE=msmith537] I just think it’s odd for anyone to take an absolute stance on anything, whether that’s not drinking, not eating meat or not wearing orange. I mean how does someone decide they NEVER drink? An occassional beer with friends? A glass of wine with dinner? What do they think will happen? One drink and they’ll go off on this downward spiral? Certain things I can understand. Not smoking or shooting heroin because they are highly addictive. Not doing drugs because they are illegal. But you can have a few beers at a college keg party without turning into some reject from Animal House. [/QUOTE] Folks who have rampant (and not so rampant) alcoholism in their family sometimes abstain from any drinking for fear they’ll end up in the same boat as those who have made others’ lives miserable. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/37 "2006-12-21T21:58:09Z")
[QUOTE=BMalion] If asked the question “Have you engaged in pre-martital sex?” the honest answer would be “Yes”. But that was 10 years ago. Since then I’ve been engaged, married and divorced, with no sex outside of marriage. I must say that as far as I’m concerned now, I’d much rather “save myself” for my future wife. I find it more fulfilling and liberating. What you do is your descision, have some respect for mine. [/QUOTE] Are you waiting until marriage or until you meet someone with who you would consider marriage? IOW, I can understand not having one night stands to avoid potential drama or health concerns, however I don’t understand not having sex with someone you are in a serious relationship with, even if it doesn’t end up in marriage. > [@Steve MB](#): > > If you can’t think of anything worthwhile in life other than drugs, alchohol, sex, or gambling, I pity you. (Not that there’s anything wrong with any of those four diversions, when pursued with prudence and moderation, but the implication that they are the be-all and end-all of life is just ridiculous.) Ok, well if you have something more important to do than getting laid, I’m interested in hearing about it. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/38 "2006-12-21T22:09:39Z")
So it’ll seem longer. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/39 "2006-12-21T22:10:59Z")
[QUOTE=msmith537] I just think it’s odd for anyone to take an absolute stance on anything, whether that’s not drinking, not eating meat or not wearing orange. I mean how does someone decide they NEVER drink? An occassional beer with friends? A glass of wine with dinner? What do they think will happen? One drink and they’ll go off on this downward spiral? Certain things I can understand. Not smoking or shooting heroin because they are highly addictive. Not doing drugs because they are illegal. But you can have a few beers at a college keg party without turning into some reject from Animal House. [/QUOTE] Recovering alcoholics, for one. Also, there are some people who can’t drink for medical reasons. Or else they simply don’t want to. Quite frankly, if you can’t imagine having fun without booze, then maybe you’re the one with the problem. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2006, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095/40 "2006-12-21T22:11:08Z")
[QUOTE=Sarahfeenah] This made me laugh. If you think abstaining is easy for everyone who does it, you are dead wrong. [/QUOTE] I _dont_ think it’s easy; in fact in most cases I consider that to be the point. Guilt and suffering, like I said in my first post. [QUOTE=Autumn Almanac] Just so I’m clear: Do you acknowledge _any_ valid, non-pathological reason(s) an unmarried person might choose to abstain from sex (even if many or most people make that choice for invalid reasons)? [/QUOTE] Does a lack of interest in sex qualify as pathological ? Or **Sarahfeenah** ’s example, where she felt it was necessary. Not, you’ll note, moral or edifying or anything like that; her example is more a critique of unreliable birth control than a reason to admire abstinence. Quite likely there _are_ non-pathological reasons for abstaining, but if so they are very rare - if for no reason other than abstaining in the first place is rare. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-living-a-life-free-of-vices/385095.md?page=3)