# What's the point of the Newton/apple story? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 13, 2017, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256 "2017-09-13T17:56:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/21 "2017-09-14T11:37:19Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > What’s brown and if it fell out of a tree, would have killed Isaac Newton? O.J. Simpson? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/22 "2017-09-14T11:42:45Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > It’s supposed to illustrate Newton’s breakthrough, which is that the force that pulls the apple to the ground is the same force that governs the motion of planets. > [@Quercus](#): > > Which is a huge, huge, giant step forward in science-- even the planets follow understandable rules of physics, the same rules that apples and cricket balls follow, and humans can figure them out. > [@Xema](#): > > [This is a strong candidate for the most significant insight in all of human history. Impressive. I wonder what other candidates would be for “most significant insight in all of human history”? Einstein’s general theory, I suppose. If we add a _“by a single person”_ qualifier then Darwin won’t qualify: there were too many others thinking along the same line. (For that matter, is it certain nobody else had Newton’s insight? Kepler, Descartes and Huygens were all thinking about gravitation.) The way I heard the apple story is that Newton got tired of questions and invented the story just as a brusque way to avoid conversation. _But I wonder if it’s true!_ Even very big creative insights can come in a sudden flash from the subconscious. Perhaps this insight was triggered by am apple falling. ---
**Author:** ![Ignotus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ecc23a/32.png) [@Ignotus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignotus)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/23 "2017-09-14T12:46:02Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Impressive. I wonder what other candidates would be for “most significant insight in all of human history”? [Eureka!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eureka_(word)#Archimedes) ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/24 "2017-09-14T13:24:58Z")
Just to add - It was Kepler IIRC who showed the motion of the bodies in the solar system obeyed the equal area law. Newton showed that simply assuming the same gravity that worked on apples if applied on the connection between the moon and the earth (and hence any celestial bodies) with proper momentums could explain orbits that fit Kepler’s rules. Before that, they knew the moon went around the earth, for example, but not what made that happen. He simply showed that the math worked out, that the same force pulling on apples must be pulling on the moon. (plus the inverse square law…) ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/25 "2017-09-14T13:27:24Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > I wonder what other candidates would be for “most significant insight in all of human history”? I think **Quercus** summarized why Newton’s insights into gravitation are the most significant: their implications went far beyond the phenomenon of gravity. From that moment forward, humans could confidently expect that simple laws, discoverable on Earth, would explain what happens throughout the universe. ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/26 "2017-09-14T13:47:28Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > Before that, they knew the moon went around the earth, for example, but not what made that happen. From Richard Feynman (highly paraphrased, from memory): From ancient times, people observed the planets moving against the background of the fixed stars and wondered how to explain this. One theory was that angels were pushing them - because if something’s moving, something has to be pushing it, right? Then Kepler studied careful observations and showed that the planets move in elliptical orbits around the Sun. Newton concluded that objects will move in a straight line without any need to be pushed, and that the motion of planets is precisely explained by a force of gravity (the same as operates on Earth) between them and the sun, bending their path from a straight line into an ellipse. But in all the time since, we haven’t found the mechanism of gravity. We know exactly what it does, but not how it does it. So it turns out we still believe in angels - the only change is that we now believe they are pushing at 90 degrees to what was formerly believed. ---
**Author:** ![Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mean_mr.mustard/32/3865_2.png) [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/27 "2017-09-14T14:16:27Z")
But who was the first person to notice that the apple don’t fall far from the tree? mmm ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/28 "2017-09-14T15:21:13Z")
I think his insight on the tastiness of a fig paste surrounded by a cookie far outweighs his insight on how gravity works. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/29 "2017-09-14T15:51:12Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > I think his insight on the tastiness of a fig paste surrounded by a cookie far outweighs his insight on how gravity works. Also, his invention of that clicky-balls toy. ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/30 "2017-09-14T16:04:50Z")
Actually, gravity is a myth. The Earth just sucks. ---
**Author:** ![vtxrider](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d26b3c/32.png) [@vtxrider](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vtxrider)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/31 "2017-09-14T16:06:38Z")
I thought when the apple hit him on the head, it knocked him out and then he had his dream about the flux capacitor. But as he did not know how to build a car or how to generate 1.21 gigawatts, he decided to formulate the theory of gravity instead. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/32 "2017-09-14T16:14:51Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Also, his invention of that clicky-balls toy. Okay as far as the obscure trivia goes, but, as all schoolchildren learn, Isaac Newton is most renowned for the invention of the milled-edge coin and the cat flap. ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/33 "2017-09-14T16:56:33Z")
> [@Xema](#): > > But in all the time since, we haven’t found the mechanism of gravity. We know exactly what it does, but not how it does it. So it turns out we still believe in angels - the only change is that we now believe they are pushing at 90 degrees to what was formerly believed. > [/indent] Probably the most important insight of the whole situation is that “moving in a circle at constant speed” is really “accelerating towards the centre of the circle”. It is non-obvious without calculus, but once you realize that fact, theories of the form “the sun is pulling on the planets somehow” become much more obvious. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/34 "2017-09-14T17:15:44Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > Okay as far as the obscure trivia goes, but, as all schoolchildren learn, Isaac Newton is most renowned for the invention of the milled-edge coin and the cat flap. If Isaac Newton invented the cat flap, Newsaac Iston must have invented the flat cap. And Musak. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/35 "2017-09-14T18:02:43Z")
> [@leahcim](#): > > Probably the most important insight of the whole situation is that “moving in a circle at constant speed” is really “accelerating towards the centre of the circle”. It is non-obvious without calculus, but once you realize that fact, theories of the form “the sun is pulling on the planets somehow” become much more obvious. Doesn’t this follow from the Second Law ? **→[SUB]F[/SUB] = [SUB]m[/SUB] →[SUB]a[/SUB]** Some earlier mathematical physicists, if only Galileo himself, were aware of this relationship, no? Maybe? But I agree. While Newton had perhaps a dozen discoveries any of which would make him immortal, it was the combination of Motion, _and_ Gravitation, _and_ Fluxions that dictate the highest superlative for his work. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/36 "2017-09-14T18:28:33Z")
Great cites, **bonzer**. [This small article](https://thonyc.wordpress.com/2016/05/12/isaac-and-the-apple-the-story-and-the-myth/) is from _The Renaissance Mathematicus_, a history of science blog by Thony Christie. > [@](#): > > Westfall tells us that the story is in fact from Newton and he told to on at least four different occasions to four different people. The article establishes a chronology of Newton’s work on the topic. At 24 he could not get the math to work and concluded that gravity might interact with the vortex that Descartes had hypothesized. Many years later he came back to the problem with better data and got the math to work. In a different article at the same website (which I’m too lazy to dig up) Mr. Christie speculates that Newton may have told the story partly to emphasize his priority. By the time he got the math properly aligned, there were others working on the problem. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/37 "2017-09-14T20:19:31Z")
> [@vtxrider](#): > > I thought when the apple hit him on the head, it knocked him out and then he had his dream about the flux capacitor. But as he did not know how to build a car or how to generate 1.21 gigawatts, he decided to formulate the theory of gravity instead. _Jiga_watts… The other really big breakthrough was figuring out the force of gravity varied with the inverse-square law. Using that made the calculations for Kepler’s ellipses work. The logic for inverse square is pretty simple once the “aha” moment happens. Before that, the acceleration due to gravity at the surface of the earth did not correspond with the acceleration obviously working on keeping the moon in orbit… hence the perceived difference between earth real and celestial real… ---
**Author:** ![vtxrider](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d26b3c/32.png) [@vtxrider](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vtxrider)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/38 "2017-09-14T21:05:20Z")
So are you suggesting that he did know how to produce 1.21 gigawatts? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/39 "2017-09-14T21:30:16Z")
> [@vtxrider](#): > > So are you suggesting that he did know how to produce 1.21 gigawatts? Amber balls in a feather pillow. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256/40 "2017-09-14T21:33:59Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > O.J. Simpson? Not likely – Isaac Newton would never had made eyes at Nicole Brown Simpson (or any other female, for that matter). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-point-of-the-newton-apple-story/796256.md?page=3)