# What's the REAL deal with the The Matrix? - SPOILERS **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 9, 2005, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089 "2005-02-09T00:18:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/1 "2005-02-09T00:18:35Z")
Ok, I’ve seen the movies (including the Animatrix) upteen times and I know the story and everything. But there’s something that just doesn’t sit right with me. Backstory as I understand it is as follows: -Intelligent machines rise up and break free from their human masters. -They create this city which far surpasses anything humans could develop. -The stupid humans get mad and start a war (never mind that the EMP from a nuke should have ended the war since obviously the machines never found a countermeasure…but I digress). -Humans fuck up the environment to block the sun so the machines lose power -Machines go to town storing people in the Matrix to use as little batteries Ok, here’s the deal. I don’t buy it. Yes I know that’s what Morphous spells out to Neo but he’s just a stupid meatsack like the others. He really doesn’t know the machines motivations so he basically just assumes the robots are harvesting humans for energy. I think it should be pretty obvious that there are more efficient energy sources than people. Wind, geothermal, nuclear, hydroelectric, fusion, whatever. I don’t believe that we are to suspend our disbelief that much. The machines can obviously wipe out Zion anytime they choose. Why even go through the motions? When someone leaves the Matrix, fuckem. Let them wander the planet until they starve. There is no need for “The One” as far as I can tell. There is no need for the humans to even be comfortible in the Matrix. Their life can just as easily be a living hell of swooshing around in goo until they die of old age. What do the machines care? It’s the same amount of energy? Probably less since they don’t need to power the VR stuff. The Oracle is obviously the humans advocate. The Matrix v1.0 was designed to be a paradise Here is what I think: The Matrix is built to SERVE mankind, not the other way around as implied in the movies. From the perspective of the machines, people are like these viruses that fill whatever environment they occupy. Therefore, they are put in a virtual environment while their physical bodies are stored in the most efficient manner possible. The energy surplus is a nice-to-have but most likely not the primary power source. In fact, all the machine world needs is a relatively small mainfraime somewhere and that’s it. So why would the machines do this? Because that’s what machines do. They SERVE people. I think that the machines, IRobot style, figured that this was the best way of keeping humanity from destroying itself. People go on thinking they are in the real world. Machines do whatever they do. Everyone’s happy. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/2 "2005-02-09T02:11:34Z")
You are under the mistaken belief that the Matrix had the slightest bit of logical consistency. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/3 "2005-02-09T02:16:01Z")
> [@](#): > > I think it should be pretty obvious that there are more efficient energy sources than people. Wind, geothermal, nuclear, hydroelectric, fusion, whatever. I don’t believe that we are to suspend our disbelief that much. You’re right, we’re not. “… COMBINED WITH A FORM OF FUSION,” Morpheus says. But yeah, things don’t add up. If I ever have access to hundreds of millions of dollars, I’m going to buy the _Matrix_ license and remake the movies, this time with A: a sensical ending, and B: the humans are stored to use their brains as an array of massive parallel processors to run the Machine’s central mainframe. I think the “sensical ending” part will be the most difficult. Maybe I’ll just put more titties in. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/4 "2005-02-09T02:26:02Z")
> [@SPOOFE](#): > > Maybe I’ll just put more titties in. I liked Carrie Anne in the tight leather. I’m sure I’ll like her out of it, too. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/5 "2005-02-09T02:33:52Z")
Imagine those boobies jiggling around in bullet-time. It’d be a beautiful, beautiful thing. ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/6 "2005-02-09T02:56:50Z")
The way I really wanted _Revolutions_ to turn out: The Zion-universe is just a higher-level Matrix. There are higher levels above that, as well. At the highest level (?), we learn that humans have actually been extinct for centuries, and the human/machine war is the nothing but the result of layer upon layer of symbiotic delusions within the programming. ---
**Author:** ![SkipMagic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skipmagic/32/20706_2.png) [@SkipMagic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkipMagic)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/7 "2005-02-09T03:08:49Z")
> [@Sublight](#): > > The way I really wanted _Revolutions_ to turn out: > > The Zion-universe is just a higher-level Matrix. There are higher levels above that, as well. At the highest level (?), we learn that humans have actually been extinct for centuries, and the human/machine war is the nothing but the result of layer upon layer of symbiotic delusions within the programming. I didn’t care at all for the movies, but that actually has promise. At the very least it makes more sense than the flicks. ---
**Author:** ![Odinoneeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/97f17d/32.png) [@Odinoneeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odinoneeye)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/8 "2005-02-09T03:33:55Z")
Another vote for more titties You can’t go wrong with more titties. ---
**Author:** ![BraheSilver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@BraheSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BraheSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/9 "2005-02-09T03:59:00Z")
> [@Sublight](#): > > The way I really wanted _Revolutions_ to turn out: > > The Zion-universe is just a higher-level Matrix. There are higher levels above that, as well. At the highest level (?), we learn that humans have actually been extinct for centuries, and the human/machine war is the nothing but the result of layer upon layer of symbiotic delusions within the programming. Almost exactly what I was thinking. If people resist the “Inner” Matrix (the city) enough to break free, the second layer would be enough to convince the humans that they had broken out into a world where mere survival would take most of their time, and utterly convinced that there was nothing to escape from. This would have explained how Neo had superpowers at the end of Reloaded, because he would have seen that he could have broken _those_ rules too. The movement to free humans from the City Matrix would have made no difference to the machines since all they’d have to do is remember which reality is being broadcasted into a particular head at the moment. ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/10 "2005-02-09T04:55:55Z")
> [@Sublight](#): > > The way I really wanted _Revolutions_ to turn out: > > The Zion-universe is just a higher-level Matrix. There are higher levels above that, as well. At the highest level (?), we learn that humans have actually been extinct for centuries, and the human/machine war is the nothing but the result of layer upon layer of symbiotic delusions within the programming. Oh, and I almost forgot: titties. Preferably belonging to [Monica Bellucci](http://us.imdb.com/name/nm0000899/) and [Nona Gaye](http://us.imdb.com/name/nm0310850/). ---
**Author:** ![Aankh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ebca7d/32.png) [@Aankh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aankh)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/11 "2005-02-09T05:10:12Z")
Now is probably a good time to ask. Could someone please summarise Movies 1, 2 and 3 for me? I’m extremely confused about the whole series, and can make head nor tail of it. Is the One actually the One? What is ‘the One’ anyway? Who’s the kid in the train? Who are the old lady and the anthropologist supposed to be? What was the big Medusa head thing? Why a key-maker and what keys is he making that he’s such a crucial character? What’s up with Agent Smith and why did he turn into such a megalomaniac? And the questions go on and on and on… 😕 Much gratitude in advance. ---
**Author:** ![KJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b2d939/32.png) [@KJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KJ)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/12 "2005-02-09T06:03:58Z")
> [@aankh](#): > > Now is probably a good time to ask. > > Could someone please summarise Movies 1, 2 and 3 for me? I’m extremely confused about the whole series, and can make head nor tail of it. I think I am too, but here’s what I think is going on. (Spoilers ahead) > [@](#): > > Is the One actually the One? What is ‘the One’ anyway? “The One” is supposed to be the messiah, i.e. some kind of allegory for Jesus. Notice how at the end of the third movie, when Neo “sacrifices” himself by fighting agent Smith, when he’s getting hooked into all the tubes coming out of the medusa head thing, he looks a bit like he’s being crucified? And then they flash the sort-of-subliminal crucifix when he actually defeats Smith? I think that’s what they were going for. > [@](#): > > Who’s the kid in the train? Who are the old lady and the anthropologist supposed to be? Anthropologist? Do you mean “Architect?” As far as I could tell, he was supposed to be Colonel Sanders. I got the impression that he was supposed to symbolize God, because he created the Matrix or something. I took the fact that there were supposedly six other matrices before the current matrix to be a symbol of the story of Genesis. Your interpretation may vary. I don’t know what the whole deal is with the Oracle, other than that she’s a mysterious character, and in the first movie her scene poses questions about whether or not free will exists. The kid at the train station might be symbolic of something else, but it seems like they just wanted to establish that not all of the AI programs were evil like Agent Smith. > [@](#): > > What was the big Medusa head thing? The big medusa head thing is basically supposed to be the personification of the entire A.I. It’s kind of like the borg from Star Trek, I guess. In the ending credits, when they mention the voice actor, the character is called “Deus Ex Machina” and I don’t think they could’ve possibly given it a better name. > [@](#): > > Why a key-maker and what keys is he making that he’s such a crucial character? As far as I can tell, he’s also a deux ex machina character of sorts, because what he mainly does is help the characters out during the action scenes. > [@](#): > > What’s up with Agent Smith and why did he turn into such a megalomaniac? Good question. I don’t really know. He sort of explains it in one of the movies, but I kind of forgot already. Basically, he’s a computer program that was supposed to be deleted from the AI, but he became self-aware and tried to protect his own existence, which is the same thing the Twins in part 2 are. I think he just wants to kill Neo because that was his original purpose. In part 2, he gets the ability to make copies of himself, which may or may not have something to do with Neo’s crazy super explodey super finishing move at the end of the first movie. Okay, you know, I just realized I didn’t really answer any of your questions, but that’s what I could figure out. ---
**Author:** ![Tracy\_Lord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@Tracy\_Lord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tracy_Lord)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/13 "2005-02-09T08:39:05Z")
I always thought that the Oracle (in the second and third movies) was sort of a Miltionian Satan. All of that smoke and red, symbolically speaking, and – the conversation at the end of the third (?) movie between her and the Architect. She was advocating free will, while the Architect was pushing for “keep 'em in line,” or at least, that’s how I read it before my brain gave up. 🙂 Did anyone else pick up on something similar? ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 9:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/14 "2005-02-09T09:23:02Z")
> [@SPOOFE](#): > > A: a sensical ending, and B: the humans are stored to use their brains as an array of massive parallel processors to run the Machine’s central mainframe. > > I think the “sensical ending” part will be the most difficult. Maybe I’ll just put more titties in. Exactly what I would do! BTW, did you ever read _Hyperion_? ---
**Author:** ![Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scoundrel_Swanswater)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/15 "2005-02-09T11:46:14Z")
I am a great fan of Hyperion. It made a lot more sense than the Matrix trilogy. There are a lot of thing in the second Matrix film, that just don’t add up with the rest of the story. Also the whole exposition-bit by The Architect was so convoluted, that you couldn’t make heads or tails of it. I do have some ideas, but I need to work them out first. ---
**Author:** ![Trunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/87869e/32.png) [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/16 "2005-02-09T13:22:06Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Ok, here’s the deal. I don’t buy it. Yes I know that’s what Morphous spells out to Neo but he’s just a stupid meatsack like the others. He really doesn’t know the machines motivations so he basically just assumes the robots are harvesting humans for energy. That’s what we’re told by the movie. Anything else, you’re just speculating for the fun of it. > [@](#): > > I think it should be pretty obvious that there are more efficient energy sources than people. Wind, geothermal, nuclear, hydroelectric, fusion, whatever. I don’t believe that we are to suspend our disbelief that much. The premise of the movie is that the aliens found humans to be a good energy source. Maybe we’re more stable than those other forms, easier to control. There’s problems with all sources of energy. They like to use us. > [@](#): > > There is no need for the humans to even be comfortible in the Matrix. Their life can just as easily be a living hell of swooshing around in goo until they die of old age. What do the machines care? It’s the same amount of energy? Probably less since they don’t need to power the VR stuff. I think this was explained. Morpheus, in the first one, told Neo that we stayed alive better and were more productive with a nice program running through our brains. Othwerwise, we just sort of shut down. > [@](#): > > Here is what I think: > The Matrix is built to SERVE mankind, not the other way around as implied in the movies. From the perspective of the machines, people are like these viruses that fill whatever environment they occupy. Therefore, they are put in a virtual environment while their physical bodies are stored in the most efficient manner possible. The energy surplus is a nice-to-have but most likely not the primary power source. In fact, all the machine world needs is a relatively small mainfraime somewhere and that’s it. So why would the machines do this? Because that’s what machines do. They SERVE people. I think that the machines, IRobot style, figured that this was the best way of keeping humanity from destroying itself. People go on thinking they are in the real world. Machines do whatever they do. Everyone’s happy. I don’t know if you’re being facetious or obtuse or just argumentative or some combination. The Matrix was built to keep our minds occupied while we were stored in pods. So, in a sense, the Matrix SERVES our needs, but only as an end to power the machines. Now, if the movies stopped after the first one, you have a nice little sci-fi story. A little stretchy, but no more so than a lot of other sci-fi stories. Anything brought up in the second or third ones, I just write off as nonsense while I wait for things to go BOOM. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/17 "2005-02-09T14:33:17Z")
> [@Trunk](#): > > That’s what we’re told by the movie. Anything else, you’re just speculating for the fun of it. Perhaps, but I feel that my speculation is logically consistant with what we are told in the story. How many times does the Oracle or the Frenchman or whoever talk about “doing what we are put here to do.” What were machines put here to do? Serve mankind. Now with all that their talk of “purpose” and “doing what they are supposed to do” we are to believe that the machines decided that their purpose is now to serve themselves? > [@Trunk](#): > > The Matrix was built to keep our minds occupied while we were stored in pods. So, in a sense, the Matrix SERVES our needs, but only as an end to power the machines. Yes yes, that’s what we are told…by Morpheus. The only time the machines make reference to using humans as a power source is during the conversation between the Architect and Neo. And it is quite clear that the machines can continue without the humans. > [@](#): > > I got the impression that he was supposed to symbolize God, because he created the Matrix or something. I took the fact that there were supposedly six other matrices before the current matrix to be a symbol of the story of Genesis. Your interpretation may vary. > > I don’t know what the whole deal is with the Oracle, other than that she’s a mysterious character, and in the first movie her scene poses questions about whether or not free will exists. Well I don’t know about symbolism but the Architect is the “creator” program of the Matrix. Basically we are told he basically runs the show. Problem is that he runs it like a highly logical machine - balancing equations and all that. The Oracle is essentially his counterpart. She “unbalances” the equations. She is the “soul” of the machine world. While the Architect’s job is to make sure everything works, the Oracle basically questions “why”. > [@vinryk](#): > > Also the whole exposition-bit by The Architect was so convoluted, that you couldn’t make heads or tails of it. I think it made more sense than refugee humans living in an underworld city with hovering ships. Basically I understand it a this - The perfectly Utopian Matrix didn’t work because people didn’t take to it. Therefore they created a new version with flaws. The problem was that because of the flaws, every so often, a human would reject it. The machines created a Zion where all the rejects would live. I guess Zion would be destroyed every so often whenever it got to the point where it could threaten the machines. Still doesn’t explain why even rebuild it (unless it was part of some perverse machine logic to preserve humanity). Why not just say “fuckit” and let the rejects quicky starve in the wastelands? ---
**Author:** ![Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hey_It_s_That_Guy)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/18 "2005-02-09T14:47:08Z")
I still say the third one should have ended like this, after Neo’s battle with Agent Smith: > [@](#): > > NEO (Keanu Reeves) wakes up, reclined in a high-tech chair in a room full of computer equipment. He has a virtual reality helmet over his head, which he lifts off. He is drenched with sweat and looks disoriented. But his clothes are representative of the present-day (or perhaps only a very near future), and he sees several people rushing around in normal clothes and lab coats. > > NEO: Whoaaaa… > > Another man sits up in a chair next to him, and regards NEO with a big grin on his face. This man is played by Arnold Schwarzenegger, and his name is DOUGLAS QUADE. > > QUADE: You think that’s something? I just went to _Mars_! > > FADE OUT. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/19 "2005-02-09T14:58:12Z")
No, before the fade out, Jennifer Jason Leigh and Jude Law burst through the door, scream “DEATH TO YEVGENY NOURISH!” and shoot everyone. ---
**Author:** ![ArrMatey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/arrmatey/32/3522_2.png) [@ArrMatey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArrMatey)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089/20 "2005-02-09T15:48:28Z")
> [@Sublight](#): > > the human/machine war is the nothing but the result of layer upon layer of symbiotic delusions within the programming. Cold. And it would probably mean the series wouldn’t be sold because it isn’t a mainstream happy ending, but… I really like the idea. Get back to me after I win the lottery. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-the-real-deal-with-the-the-matrix-spoilers/289089.md?page=2)