# What's up with Guineas? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 8, 1999, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595 "1999-11-08T10:38:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c0e974/32.png) [@S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/S)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 1999, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/1 "1999-11-08T10:38:00Z")
From the UK: Why are Italian Americans referred to as ‘Guineas’ in films etc? ---
**Author:** ![funneefarmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9fc348/32.png) [@funneefarmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funneefarmer)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 1999, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/2 "1999-11-08T12:21:00Z")
You picked that question as your first post?.. Ouch. It’s slang. I don’t know the origin, but my guess is you’ll know soon. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 1999, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/3 "1999-11-08T15:28:00Z")
Don’t know either, but to add my 2¢, the first time I ever heard the term used (and I’m almost 40) it was in the Christian Slater/Patricia Arquette (“True Romance,” I think), which was only a couple of years ago. I assumed it meant “Eye-talians,” since that was whom they were referring to, and I thought it was funny–since it had no connection to the “guineas” that were familiar to me. Guineas are a type of domestic fowl, similar to chickens, but a lot uglier–and they can fly a **lot** better. If they get out of their coop, they’re gone. Also, when I was a kid,I also had an uncle that used a phrase “I’d trade a gold guinea for . . . .” I also thought _that_ was funny, because I wondered "OK, a guinea made of gold would be worth a lot–but why would someone make a _guinea_ out of gold. I learned some years later that “gold guineas” were once coins of the British Empire. ---
**Author:** ![Alphagene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Alphagene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alphagene)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 1999, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/4 "1999-11-08T17:15:00Z")
I’d honestly be surprised if “guinea” was a recent coinage. No luck on guinea, but “wop” has an interesting derivation, according to M-W: Italian dialect _guappo_ swaggerer, tough, from Spanish _guapo_, probably from Middle French dialect _vape, wape_ weak, insipid, from Latin _vappa_ wine gone flat * * * Back off, man. I’m a scientist. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 1999, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/5 "1999-11-08T17:23:00Z")
Alpha– Didn’t mean to imply that I thought it was of recent vintage–just that I live in an area where there are no _noticeable_ ethnic minority communities (other than Blacks); hence, there are no colorful ethnic slurs in common parlance–of course, with the exception of Blacks, and I think you’re probably already familiar with _those_ colorful ethnic terms. 🙂 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Cap\_n\_Crude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Cap\_n\_Crude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cap_n_Crude)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 1999, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/6 "1999-11-08T17:29:00Z")
FWIW – My tailor is an Italian-born woman (I refuse to call her a seamstress, that’s from another century) with the full-on accent and everything. She was telling me about her daughters one day. One wanted a nice, quiet wedding when the day came. The other told her dear sweet mom that she wanted a big loud Italian Catholic bash – a “guinea wedding” as she called it. It was so funny hearing this woman say “gheeny whedding” I almost peed myself. I know that, in _The Godfather_, the source of all Italian knowledge for most of us, Sonny (Santino) Corleone calls his Italian-born wife a guinea. The line is, I believe, “Now, you guinea bitch, I’m gonna kill ya.” He proceeds to beat her with his belt and probably whatever else is handy. Sonny was not a nice guy. I wonder if the term has anything to do with the place called Guinea, from which the island of New Guinea takes its name? * * * –Da Cap’n “Playin’ solitaire 'til dawn With a deck of fifty-one.” ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 1999, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/7 "1999-11-08T19:32:00Z")
Dave Wilton figured it got picked up by association. I find his explanation plausible, although I’d be interested in seeing some documentation: > [@](#): > > Guinea > > Like Dago, this derogatory term for Italians did not originally refer to that particular ethnic group. Guinea comes from Guinea Negro and originally referred to any black or any person of mixed ancestry. This sense dates to the 1740s. By the 1890s it was being applied to Italians–almost certainly > because they tend to have darker skin than Anglo-Saxons/Germans. By 1911 the term began being applied to Hispanics, although the reference to Italians is the most common. [http://www.wilton.net/wordorg.htm#Guinea](http://www.wilton.net/wordorg.htm#Guinea) * * * Tom~ ---
**Author:** ![funneefarmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9fc348/32.png) [@funneefarmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funneefarmer)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 1999, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/8 "1999-11-08T19:39:00Z")
Well I am sure that is older than any of those movies. I have relatives that occasionally use the term, most of the time joking around with a friend of theirs that is Italian. It does seem to have perjorative connotations. ---
**Author:** ![kknick34](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a698b9/32.png) [@kknick34](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kknick34)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 1999, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/9 "1999-11-08T20:16:00Z")
For an added insult there is “swamp guinea greaseball” that was used where I grew up. Godfather FYI: Santino Corleone didn’t beat up his wife, Carlo Rizzi beat up Connie Corleone who was his wife & Santino’s sister. ---
**Author:** ![S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c0e974/32.png) [@S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/S)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 1999, 8:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/10 "1999-11-09T08:43:00Z")
Thanks all…my first posting and look at all the attention I get. Love it… * * * “Heaven sends us good meat, but the devil sends us cooks” David Garrick (1717-1779) ---
**Author:** ![Fyodor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/958977/32.png) [@Fyodor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fyodor)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 1999, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/11 "1999-11-09T13:31:00Z")
“Guinea” has been used for centuries as a name for a portion of west Africa - “the Guinea coast”. Calling Italians “guineas” implies they are not white people. Remember in the movie “True Romance” Christopher Walken plays a Sicilean gangster who takes umbrage at Dennis Hopper’s character’s suggestion that Sicileans are actually African. As with so many vulgar oral traditions we will probably never know who coined this ethnic slur. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 1999, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-guineas/4595/12 "1999-11-09T15:59:00Z")
((“TRUE ROMANCE” spoiler aler!!!)) Going along with the previous post, when Dennis Hopper’s character is “whacked,” two of the other thugs are talking. The conversation goes something like this: 1st thug: “Why did he ‘whack’ him?” 2nd thug: “He said Italians are descended from Blacks.” 1st thur: “Oh, OK.”