# What's up with religious snake handlers? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 23, 2005, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169 "2005-01-23T00:25:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2005, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/1 "2005-01-23T00:25:57Z")
Watching an episode of _City Confidential_ on A&E I came to wonder, just how many people still handle snakes during religious worship? (I’m talking about hardcore fundamentalist Christians) Are they still around, and how wide-spread are they? Are they unique to certain pockets in the U.S. South, or are there some in Europe? (I know they originated somewhere in Tennessee). How many have been killed, and what about the children during the ceremony? [Cecil himself addressed the issue](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/000107.html), but he never really went into the details. (Oh, and if you provide links, PLEASE make sure there aren’t any pictures. I’m severely ophidiophobic-which is why I’m not about to google the term myself!) Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2005, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/2 "2005-01-23T00:34:57Z")
Sounds to me like they are testing their faith, or testing God. Isn’t there something in the Bible prohibiting that, though? ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2005, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/3 "2005-01-23T00:39:25Z")
It looks like the [Church of God with Signs Following](http://religiousmovements.lib.virginia.edu/nrms/Snakes.html) (overview, no pics) is still around in the US, with the 1,000 to 2,000 adherants mentioned by Cecil. There may also be a [group of them in Australia.](http://www.ministryblue.com/church-pentecostal.html) (also no pics) ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2005, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/4 "2005-01-23T01:19:37Z")
It’s a pretty fringe-y belief, even by the standards of YEC fundamentalists who are convinced that Spongebob is the Antichrist, or whatever. Foundation for the practice, FWIW, is in the Long Ending of the Gospel According to Mark: > [@](#): > > Then He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to the whole creation. Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. And these signs will accompany those who believe: In My name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new languages; they will pick up snakes; if they should drink anything deadly, it will never harm them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will get well.” (Mark 16:15-18) I.e., handling venomous snakes without injury is a mark of the True Believer, along with a few other things like speaking in tongues, immunity to poison, and the gift of laying on hands for healing. Therefore, to prove themselves True Believers, they keep rattlers around to pick up and wave around. ---
**Author:** ![dwyr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwyr/32/363_2.png) [@dwyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dwyr)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2005, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/5 "2005-01-23T03:04:54Z")
There are still some of these believers in eastern Ky. Usually I’ll read about one or two snakebites a year in the local newspaper. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2005, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/6 "2005-01-23T21:44:19Z")
It’s also common for folks sitting watching the snake handlers to be sipping on jars of dilute strychine, as well. Confined mainly to the hills of West Viriginia (well, that state is all hills anyway) and neighboring states. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/7 "2005-01-24T00:45:25Z")
So basically, are these things adults-only? ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/8 "2005-01-24T01:33:45Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > So basically, are these things adults-only? Nope, there’s an age limit, but some churches _do_ allow individuals under the age of 18 to handle the snakes, and occassionally the kids get bitten. Why anyone would think this kind of a thing is a good idea is beyond me. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/9 "2005-01-24T02:20:03Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > Why anyone would think this kind of a thing is a good idea is beyond me. Call me Darwin, but I think this is a very good idea, for certain ulterior reasons… ---
**Author:** ![CaveMike](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cavemike/32/16379_2.png) [@CaveMike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaveMike)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/10 "2005-01-24T03:16:22Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > It’s a pretty fringe-y belief, even by the standards of YEC fundamentalists who are convinced that Spongebob is the Antichrist, or whatever. I am picturing a new Christian sect that engages in dangerous sponge-handling. Thanks **Poly**! ---
**Author:** ![Telperien](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/65b543/32.png) [@Telperien](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telperien)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 8:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/11 "2005-01-24T08:16:50Z")
> [@CaveMike](#): > > I am picturing a new Christian sect that engages in dangerous sponge-handling. Thanks **Poly**! Well, haven’t you seen those commercials about how germy a sponge can be? ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/12 "2005-01-24T08:27:58Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > It’s also common for folks sitting watching the snake handlers to be sipping on jars of dilute strychine, as well. > > Confined mainly to the hills of West Viriginia (well, that state is all hills anyway) and neighboring states. I’ve heard this before, but I’ve never figured out why they bother to dilute it. If they really have faith, wouldn’t Drano work just as well? How come no one ever tries that? I’m not just being flipant! Obviously, any group that uses anything stronger won’t last very long, but there still has to be some “thinking” behind only using a certain strength of poison. You would think someone would be tempted to try something stronger as a test, as a child, or whenever they happen to be out of strychnine. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/13 "2005-01-24T11:00:29Z")
I think a significant factor here is that groups that practiced Drano-drinking probably died out rapidly. Likewise, they handle rattlesnakes which, while venomous, are not the most deadly snakes around. If they were _really_ serious, why not use two-step vipers or coral snakes? I mean, _many_ people bit on an extremity by a rattler survive, they are far from sudden death. (Though certainly there IS a risk of death involved) It’s not like there aren’t alternative snakes available - both water mocasins and cottonmouths are found in the areas where these practices exist, yet the snake of choice is a rattler. (whimps!) ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/14 "2005-01-24T12:46:24Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > It looks like the [Church of God with Signs Following](http://religiousmovements.lib.virginia.edu/nrms/Snakes.html) (overview, no pics) is still around in the US, with the 1,000 to 2,000 adherants mentioned by Cecil. There may also be a [group of them in Australia.](http://www.ministryblue.com/church-pentecostal.html) (also no pics) Given that every third living thing is Oz happens to be poisonous, perhaps they’ve just been misidentified, & they are ordinary churchgoers, merely picking the adders out of their scrambled eggs every Sunday before breakfast. ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/15 "2005-01-24T14:20:17Z")
> [@Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor](#): > > Given that every third living thing is Oz happens to be poisonous, perhaps they’ve just been misidentified, & they are ordinary churchgoers, merely picking the adders out of their scrambled eggs every Sunday before breakfast. Um, yeah, but reading posts written by poisonous Aussies is reportedly quite safe. I’m glad of that. ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/16 "2005-01-24T15:53:26Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > I think a significant factor here is that groups that practiced Drano-drinking probably died out rapidly. > > Likewise, they handle rattlesnakes which, while venomous, are not the most deadly snakes around. If they were _really_ serious, why not use two-step vipers or coral snakes? I mean, _many_ people bit on an extremity by a rattler survive, they are far from sudden death. (Though certainly there IS a risk of death involved) > > It’s not like there aren’t alternative snakes available - both water mocasins and cottonmouths are found in the areas where these practices exist, yet the snake of choice is a rattler. > > (whimps!) Right. I acknowledged as much. What I’m curious about is what keeps all of them from dying out. When they run out of strychnine one Sunday and someone says “Hey, there’s some Drano under the sink!” or when the rattler dies and someone says “You know, there’s a cottonmouth living under my shed I keep meaning to do something about!” what happens to keep them all alive? Either someone else objects (in which case what do they _say_?) or something they’ve been taught keeps most snake-handlers from ever making such a suggestion. But what? Someone’s got to raise the issue eventually in every congregation (Kids question everything!) so there must be a tradition among them to explain these things. What is it? (I’m also skeptical about the supposedly Darwinian origin of the rattler and strychnine tradition. Were there once thousands of snake-handling sects, most of which died out after a week?) ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/17 "2005-01-24T16:34:27Z")
A few years back, I read of a minister in one of these churches, who was convited of murdering his wife. It seems he needed to be rid of her, so he held her arm in a cage full of rattlesnakes (he kept the congregation’s snakes in his garage). She was bitten repeatedly, and died. He told the police that his wife had told him that “she wanted to test her faith”, The policeman investigating the death noted that she had wanted to leave the guy, and her body showed evidence of a struggle. Isn’t this blasphemous?The Bible states that one should not put God to the test. ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/18 "2005-01-24T16:56:14Z")
Right, but they’re not testing God because they **know** God will save them if they have enough faith; they’re testing their own level of faith. :dubious: Or something like that. ---
**Author:** ![HeyHomie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heyhomie/32/207_2.png) [@HeyHomie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HeyHomie)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/19 "2005-01-24T18:08:26Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > It’s a pretty fringe-y belief, even by the standards of YEC fundamentalists who are convinced that Spongebob is the Antichrist, or whatever. > > Foundation for the practice, FWIW, is in the Long Ending of the Gospel According to Mark: > > I.e., handling venomous snakes without injury is a mark of the True Believer, along with a few other things like speaking in tongues, immunity to poison, and the gift of laying on hands for healing. Therefore, to prove themselves True Believers, they keep rattlers around to pick up and wave around. [An old thread about this subject, which specifically addresses the Mark 16 passage.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=1207) ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2005, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169/20 "2005-01-24T21:57:17Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > A few years back, I read of a minister in one of these churches, who was convited of murdering his wife. It seems he needed to be rid of her, so he held her arm in a cage full of rattlesnakes (he kept the congregation’s snakes in his garage). She was bitten repeatedly, and died. He told the police that his wife had told him that “she wanted to test her faith”, > The policeman investigating the death noted that she had wanted to leave the guy, and her body showed evidence of a struggle. > Isn’t this blasphemous?The Bible states that one should not put God to the test. The case I mentioned in the OP was very similiar-he wanted to get rid of his wife, but couldn’t divorce her, so he shoved her hand into one of their rattlesnake containers. Only she lived, he went to jail, and no one in the congregation would talk to her again. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-religious-snake-handlers/286169.md?page=2)