# What's up with "The Family"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 13, 2009, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284 "2009-08-13T14:09:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2009, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/21 "2009-08-13T18:26:08Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > They keep their **membership** secret. The [CFR](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_on_Foreign_Relations) doesn’t, AFAIK. So does the ACLU. What’s wrong with not making your membership list public? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2009, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/22 "2009-08-13T18:35:06Z")
Please read [_NAACP v. Alabama._](http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/cgi-bin/getcase.pl?court=US&vol=377&invol=288) Organizations have the right to keep membership lists private. And oftentimes good reason. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2009, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/23 "2009-08-13T18:57:42Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > So does the ACLU. What’s wrong with not making your membership list public? Well, for one thing, in the case of the Federalist Society – or an analogous LW group such as the [National Lawyers Guild](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Lawyers_Guild) – I should think there’s a compelling public interest in knowing whether a judicial nominee has ever been associated with it. [This came up in 2005, in connection with John Roberts’ confirmation as Chief Justice.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Roberts_Supreme_Court_nomination_and_hearings#Federalist_Society) And in the case of the Family, I should think there’s a compelling public interest in knowing what politicians have been associated with it. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2009, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/24 "2009-08-13T19:02:12Z")
Do you actually have any comment on “The Family,” **Moto**? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2009, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/25 "2009-08-13T19:42:57Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > I see. The Family International wants sexual license, up to including pedophilia and incest, for everybody. The Family wants it, up to and including rape, only for the elite. Big difference. Dunno if this is sarcasm or not but in case not… Already gave my apology for this but you have it again. My bad. The Family of C-Street is still plenty creepy though. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2009, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/26 "2009-08-13T20:37:22Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Dunno if this is sarcasm or not but in case not… > > Already gave my apology for this but you have it again. > > My bad. > > The Family of C-Street is still plenty creepy though. Not sarcastic, it **is** a big difference – but it’s debatable on which organization the difference reflects worse. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2009, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/27 "2009-08-13T22:41:12Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Does that include Obama? I have seen nothing indicating he is a member. ---
**Author:** ![fuzzypickles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9d8465/32.png) [@fuzzypickles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fuzzypickles)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2009, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/28 "2009-08-13T23:16:40Z")
Jeff Sharlet was plugging his book on Bill Maher’s show last week. This organization almost sounds too extremist to be real; but if it’s real, it’s proof positive just how morally destructive religion can be. Throughout history, the rich and powerful have used religion as an excuse to justify their immoral sadistic behavior, from Akhenaten to Genghis Khan, and “The Family” is this pro-God logic taken to its utter extreme. As always, if you worship “God”, you are actually worshipping The Devil – or allowing yourself to be controlled by The Devil. Only by rejecting any notion of “God” can you find self-actualization and enlightenment. This “Family” cult is actually rather refreshing, because at least they’re up front about their genuine intentions. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2009, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/29 "2009-08-13T23:45:13Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > I have seen nothing indicating he is a member. No, but he is a person in power, therefore, by the Family’s world-view, presumptively chosen by God, so . . . ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2009, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/30 "2009-08-13T23:48:57Z")
> [@fuzzypickles](#): > > Jeff Sharlet was plugging his book on Bill Maher’s show last week. This organization almost sounds too extremist to be real; but if it’s real, it’s proof positive just how morally destructive religion can be. Throughout history, the rich and powerful have used religion as an excuse to justify their immoral sadistic behavior, from Akhenaten to Genghis Khan, and “The Family” is this pro-God logic taken to its utter extreme. > > As always, if you worship “God”, you are actually worshipping The Devil – or allowing yourself to be controlled by The Devil. Only by rejecting any notion of “God” can you find self-actualization and enlightenment. This “Family” cult is actually rather refreshing, because at least they’re up front about their genuine intentions. They are not up front to outsiders. They have been around for 50 years and have kept their message away from prying eyes . ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2009, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/31 "2009-08-14T00:53:46Z")
OK, just examine this a bit please- A super-secret fascistic fundamentalist cult has existed in the middle of DC for half a century. It not only has participation from the country’s conservative party (Republican), but also some members or associates (Hillary) from the country’s liberal party (Democrat). It excuses rape & pedophilia for the power-elite. Every President for the past three decades has participated in its public ceremonies (the National Presidential Prayer Breakfast). It is so deeply entrenched that no big-name politician dare denounce it, but a brave young journalist who actually entered the Belly of the Beast and lived to tell about it will tell us the truth about how evil it is! Oh! And while nothing has ever happened to him or no threats have ever been made, occasionally- he is still being followed! So what I want to know is- do they get together with the Bohemian Grove for their sacrifices to Moloch? Or trade mistresses with the Elders of Zion? It’s so cute when our liberal intelligensia play “Conspiracy Buff”. Quick note- the other group “The Family International” used to be known as “The Children of God”. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2009, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/32 "2009-08-14T01:54:22Z")
> [@FriarTed](#): > > OK, just examine this a bit please- > > A super-secret fascistic fundamentalist cult has existed in the middle of DC for half a century. > > It not only has participation from the country’s conservative party (Republican), but also some members or associates (Hillary) from the country’s liberal party (Democrat). > > It excuses rape & pedophilia for the power-elite. > > Every President for the past three decades has participated in its public ceremonies (the National Presidential Prayer Breakfast). > > It is so deeply entrenched that no big-name politician dare denounce it, but a brave young journalist who actually entered the Belly of the Beast and lived to tell about it will tell us the truth about how evil it is! Oh! And while nothing has ever happened to him or no threats have ever been made, occasionally- he is still being followed! > > So what I want to know is- do they get together with the Bohemian Grove for their sacrifices to Moloch? Or trade mistresses with the Elders of Zion? > > It’s so cute when our liberal intelligensia play “Conspiracy Buff”. > > Quick note- the other group “The Family International” used to be known as “The Children of God”. OTOH, if Sharlet were wrong/lying about the Family, wouldn’t they at least have called a press conference by now to set the record straight? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2009, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/33 "2009-08-14T02:22:06Z")
Sharlet has not alleged they are criminal or violent or “evil.” ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2009, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/34 "2009-08-14T11:36:27Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > OTOH, if Sharlet were wrong/lying about the Family, wouldn’t they at least have called a press conference by now to set the record straight? You don’t haul out a howitzer to take care of a gnat. Every few months when something happens in the news that’s “Family-related” (right now the two adulterers who were members), Sharlet jumps up “Look at me! Buy my book! Please!” Dio, he may not use those terms but he doesn’t exactly portray them as harmless little fuzzballs either. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2009, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/35 "2009-08-14T12:52:04Z")
> [@FriarTed](#): > > You don’t haul out a howitzer to take care of a gnat. Every few months when something happens in the news that’s “Family-related” (right now the two adulterers who were members), Sharlet jumps up “Look at me! Buy my book! Please!” I dunno. I think most people would sue someone for slander/libel/defamation/whatever is applicable if the things Sharlet was saying were not true. You may call Sharlet a “gnat” but that gnat has a well selling book out and is on dozens of national media shows and newspapers alleging various awful things about The Family and people in it. To me a “gnat” would be Sharlet posting his allegations here and leaving it at that. I have not read Sharlet’s book but extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. I’d be surprised if his publisher let him make these allegations without something more to back it up than “I said so”. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2009, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/36 "2009-08-14T13:58:21Z")
Oh please. Publishers print countless books on numerous subjects. The Kennedy assassinations have spawned numerous books that have “implicated” countless public figures in concocted conspiracy theories. If the book will sell and make money, it will be printed. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2009, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/37 "2009-08-14T14:48:37Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > Oh please. Publishers print countless books on numerous subjects. The Kennedy assassinations have spawned numerous books that have “implicated” countless public figures in concocted conspiracy theories. Yes, but their authors are rarely invited on high-profile talk shows. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2009, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/38 "2009-08-14T15:33:26Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > If the book will sell and make money, it will be printed. Sure…people never sue publishers and publishers never try to assess the validity of a book before it is published. :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > Facing the mere threat of a lawsuit from Saudi billionaire Khalid bin Mahfouz, Cambridge University Press agreed to pulp all the unsold copies of “Alms of Jihad: Charity and Terrorism in the Islamic World,” issue a public apology to Mahfouz and pay his legal expenses and substantial undisclosed damages. > > The prestigious publisher - the world’s oldest publishing house - had carefully vetted the book before publishing it last year. Yet now it has asked more than 200 libraries worldwide to pull the work off their shelves. > > SOURCE: [http://www.nypost.com/seven/08082007/postopinion/opedcolumnists/saudis\_sue\_for\_secrecy\_opedcolumnists\_rachel\_ehrenfeld.htm](http://www.nypost.com/seven/08082007/postopinion/opedcolumnists/saudis_sue_for_secrecy_opedcolumnists_rachel_ehrenfeld.htm) > [@](#): > > Three New Jersey women whose photos were included in a book called “Hot Chicks With Douchebags” have sued the author and publisher, claiming that being included among the “hot chicks” has ruined their lives and caused them to undergo medical treatment and require psychological counseling. > > SOURCE: [http://exhibitanewsboston.com/blog/2009/01/20/hot-chicks-sue-publisher/](http://exhibitanewsboston.com/blog/2009/01/20/hot-chicks-sue-publisher/) > [@](#): > > CHICAGO - The top federal prosecutor in Chicago is threatening to sue publisher HarperCollins, calling a book about the war on terrorism that focuses in part on cases he was involved in “a deliberate lie masquerading as the truth.” > > If HarperCollins publishes the new edition of “Triple Cross” by Peter Lance this month “and it defames me or casts me in a false light, HarperCollins will be sued,” Patrick Fitzgerald said in a letter to the New York-based company. > > SOURCE: [http://archives.chicagotribune.com/2009/jun/08/books/chi-ap-il-fitzgerald-book](http://archives.chicagotribune.com/2009/jun/08/books/chi-ap-il-fitzgerald-book) ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2009, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284/39 "2009-08-14T18:55:30Z")
> [@FriarTed](#): > > You don’t haul out a howitzer to take care of a gnat. Every few months when something happens in the news that’s “Family-related” (right now the two adulterers who were members), Sharlet jumps up “Look at me! Buy my book! Please!” > > Dio, he may not use those terms but he doesn’t exactly portray them as harmless little fuzzballs either. That is exactly what you do. You go for huge overkill. You would nuke them with all kinds of bad press, and send spokesmen everywhere to refute. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-up-with-the-family/506284.md?page=1)