What's with this Tsunami, why the hell were people just sitting there?!

[Shirley_Ujest]

Any links to footage or Computer Graphics ( like TomnDebs) are appreciated. This kind of stuff is horridly fascinating.

[Shirley_Ujest]

For Future Reference: Tsunami & Earthquake Linkies
Personal pictures

Really cool Earthquake monitor across the world.
Getty Images of the aftermath

[The_Chao_Goes_Mu]

Why did so many people just sit there and watch the giant waves roll in?

I don’t know. Why do those of us in the tornado belt run outside to have a look-see when the tornado sirens start wailing?

[Judith_Prietht]

I grew up in Hawaii and I don’t remember going through any sort of tsunami drill apart from all of us understanding that if we heard the Civil Defense sirens go off when it wasn’t the first day of the month, we were to stay put until our teachers told us what to do, and then we’d move to higher ground. Of course, I acknowledge that other schools might have had different protocols.

[jjimm]

@Shirley Ujest

Any links to footage or Computer Graphics ( like TomnDebs) are appreciated. This kind of stuff is horridly fascinating.

This is the most illustrative and scary film I’ve seen of the Tsunami so far (11Mb WMV file).

[Shirley_Ujest]

@The Chao Goes Mu

Why did so many people just sit there and watch the giant waves roll in?

I don’t know. Why do those of us in the tornado belt run outside to have a look-see when the tornado sirens start wailing?

People are inheritly curious and inheritly stupid.

[ShibbOleth]

@jjimm

This is the most illustrative and scary film I’ve seen of the Tsunami so far (11Mb WMV file).

Holy crap! That was scary. I wonder if those two older guys who were trying to get back up made it. I’m surprised that guy kept filming throughout, although I think at the end he was probably just holding the videocamera up to keep it out of the water. I’ll see if I can get Mrs Shibb to translate what he was saying, although from the middle on it was just “Shit… shit… shit…” It was probably his restaurant getting destroyed.

[tomndebb]

tomndebb, do you have a key for the meaning of the blue and red on that .gif?

Sorry, I don’t read Kanji. It was taken from the Active Fault Research Center website, which has several pages in English, but the overall site is in Japanese.

[rocking_chair]

www.digitalglobe.com has amazing satellite pictures. one picture of the wave in sri lanka shows the water receding 343 meters. 343 meters!!!

that cannot be mistaken for low tide. 343 meters!!!

[Carnac_the_Magnificent]

@Meurglys

Just because it was a massive undersea earthquake, was it inevitable that there be tsunamis following it?

There was (until this one) the world’s most powerful earthquake for four years just 3 days before (23rd December) at the other end of one of the tectonic plates involved down near the Macquarie Islands south of New Zealand.
But, according to this BBC report, because it was a horizontal shift, there were no tsunamis similar to the catastrophic one generated in the Indian Ocean.

IIRC, tsunami struck one of Indonesia’s lesser 20,000 islands several years ago–within the last 15 or so, killing several hundred villagers and wiping empty villages into the sea. Not much coverage at the time, but I remember this distinctly.

According to experts, tsunami typically empty the water from a bay only 50 percent of the time. The latest news accounts, from Western witnesses, say the Thailand tsunami (measuring about 10 feet from trough to crest) “sounded like a jet taking off.” Anyone who has been close to big waves (think Oahu’s north shore) knows that big waves are noisy SOBs. It’s also important to remember that the overwhelming majority of tsunami measure less than 10 feet in height.
>>> Anyone know the speed of a 30-foot tsunami, as it enters a beach area? I’m guessing about 50 mph max.

[Carnac_the_Magnificent]

@Carnac the Magnificent!

IIRC, tsunami struck one of Indonesia’s lesser 20,000 islands several years ago–within the last 15 or so, killing several hundred villagers and wiping empty villages into the sea. Not much coverage at the time, but I remember this distinctly.
.

CORRECTION: wiping ENTIRE villages into the sea.

[Carnac_the_Magnificent]

Quick research shows that Indonesia has been hit by a good half dozen tsunami in the last several decades, the December 1992 tsunami with one wave that measured about 80 feet in height.

The December 1992 Tsunami in Indonesia

On December 12, 1992, at 05:29 UT a 7.8 surface wave magnitude earthquake occurred in the Flores region of Indonesia (8° 31’S, 121° 54’ E). Flores Island is located about 1,800 km east of Jakarta. The death toll as a result of the combined earthquake and tsunami effects was more than two thousand. This includes 1,490 at Maumere and 700 on Babi Island. (About on-half of the deaths were attributed to the tsunami.) More than 500 people were seriously injured and 90,000 left homeless. In addition, 28,118 houses, 785 school buildings, 307 mosques, and 493 store and office buildings were destroyed or damaged. Nineteen people were killed and 130 houses were destroyed on Kalaotoa. Severe damage occurred on Sumba and Alor. Tsunami inundation of 300 meters with wave heights of 25 meters were reported on Flores Island along with landslides and ground cracks at several locations around the island.

The maximum tsunami runup height of 26.2 m was measured at Riangkroko where 163 people lost their lives. Severe coastal erosion occurred during the tsunami, exposing eroded coral complexes and lowering coastal land surfaces. Coastline areas were characterized by the deposition of extensive and continuous sediment sheets up to one meter in thickness. Wave reflection off Flores Island may have been partially responsible for the devastation on Babi Island.

This Flores event was catastrophic in terms of human casualties and property damage, resulting from the earthquake and the tsunamis. However, the event also provided much information about the geophysical, geological, and engineering aspects of tsunamis and has enhanced our overall knowledge of tsunamis and their effects.
http://www.iris.edu/gifs/slides/tsunamis/slideshow/tsunami2.htm

[SmackFu]

There’s a very long article in the NY Times tomorrow that covers this subject. I haven’t read the whole thing but it looks informative:
How Scientists and Victims Watched Helplessly

[ShibbOleth]

Had the officials in charge that morning been working with a clear-cut, well-rehearsed and properly communicated procedure, a tsunami warning would have been sounded. It shouldn’t have mattered to the experts in charge at the bureau on Sunday morning that such a warning might inconvenience hotel owners or tour operators in the South. They shouldn’t have even worried about possible negative feedback from certain quarters that the agency was overreacting or that it was too quick to push the panic button. They have a job to do, and a very important job it is too, one that concerns the safety of every citizen in the country. They are duty bound – professionally and ethically – to perform their task honourably. Potential public misunderstandings and undesirable political pressure are but some of the basic occupational hazards.

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra has promised to overhaul the entire disaster-protection system. He discovered just how deplorable the whole warning, rescue and emergency systems were when he went down South himself to supervise the rescue mission earlier this week. He said he learned first-hand that the country had no adequate warning system in place, no back-up communications, no emergency power supplies, no contingency plan to coordinate relief measures. What’s worse, he said that local officials hadn’t even gone on alert. The tsunami had already smashed six southern provinces when he discovered that these bureaucrats wouldn’t even start to respond to the crisis “until I ordered them to”. Why were they awaiting orders from the country’s chief executive? The simple answer, drawing from recent examples – bird flu, Sars, even Bangkok’s horrendous traffic jams – is: they just wanted to save their own butts. That’s how they’ve been trained to think and taught to act.

Highlighting is mine. The editorial was written by Suthichai Yoon for The Nation.

[Shirley_Ujest]

Does anyone know if the Seychelle Islands were affected?
I was reading about a guy named Robert Graf who has been treasure hunting there for 20 years for the buried loot from Nossa Senhora do Cabo

And I was really curious.

[Shirley_Ujest]

Found it
Robert Graf story. Velly Interesting.

[rfgdxm]

Well, yes, I believe the US is viewed with some suspicion. But more I think it’s a bit of human nature to take certain warnings with a bit of skepticism. Now, if the USA said, we have information that a big wave is going to wash over all of your tourist areas (and this before anyone alive had much of an experience with it), and the person being told this is not a scientist and maybe even not particularly clever (being a political appointee or recipient of some patronage), they might need to verify with the proper people what they should do. As an American you might find this tough to believe, but in some countries, and Thailand is one of them, things tend to work in a strict hierarchy. Yes, sometimes the hierarchy is not followed, but when the hierarchy breaks down the result is more often than not pure chaos. Someone will be worried about who will be to blame if a needless panic is caused in a tourist area that generates a lot of revenue. So a proper chain of command will be followed.

But even if the person in Thailand was suspicious about the US, if a US scientist called and said “tsunami is coming at you”, wouldn’t odds favor this was a legit warning? I can easily believe that bureaucracy might impede such a warning being dealt with effectively. However, not that the bureaucrats were thinking the US was lying about this with evil intent.

Heck, let’s look at it from a personal point of view. Let’s say a friend called with urgent news that a meteor was about to strike Lansing. We’ll even say it’s your most trustworthy friend, someone who would never yank your chain. Would you drop the phone and barrell out of town at full speed. Or would you stop, think about what you need to do, maybe flick on CNN really quick to verify what’s really happening, call your family and friends and alert them, grab your dog, etc? All of those things are human nature you’d have to fight against. When the chain of information is longer, and the information less certain than “Fire!”, it’s probable that there will be delays. Don’t you remember some personal disbelief and slowness to react on 9/11? This is how we process information that is incredulous and threatening.

But there is nothing incredulous about a warning “tsunami coming”. At least not if the person on the phone receiving the warning has half a clue. Tsunamis happen. It isn’t a matter of if, but when. And let’s change your hypothetical warning about a meteor strike to something more like what happened in Thailand. Assume I am on a beach in Thailand talking to my most trustworthy friend on a satellite phone. Let’s also assume that this friend is an expert seismologist. I notice the water receding rapidly, and mention this to my seismologist friend. Before this disaster happened, I was ignorant about what water rapidly receding on an ocean coast meant. This seismologist friend then yells on the phone to me “That means a tsunami is coming! THIS IS AN ORDER! RUN INLAND AS FAST AS YOU CAN!!!” I’d just do as he said, and run inland as fast as I could. Rather than argue with a close friend who was an expert seismologist.

Whether the USA is in the habit of contacting other countries with “bullshit warnings” is really beside the point. Maybe they’re not in the habit of receiving any emergency warnings from the USA. Is there a process in place to get the information to the right people quickly? Thailand (nor Indonesia, nor Malaysia, nor Sri Lanka, nor Somalia) are vital enough to US interests that we have a direct line from our halls of power to theirs. Sure, we have the phone number. And if GWB or Colin Powell or somebody called them and told them to evacuate Phuket the Thais would have probably taken it very seriously. But it still would have been some time, and most likely too late, before it wound back down through the proper channels.

Up until now, apparently there hasn’t been a direct line for such emergency warnings. Hopefully, after this disaster this will change. People in those countries aren’t stupid, and know the US has the technology to spot tsunamis. I’m hoping here that the US wouldn’t be so petty as to not cooperate with these countries if they requested setting up a direct 24/7 line to communicate warnings about impending natural disasters. And that these countries don’t distrust the US THAT much they would think the US would lie about something like a tsunami.

[rfgdxm]

@ShibbOleth

Highlighting is mine. The editorial was written by Suthichai Yoon for The Nation.

Pathetic.

[tomndebb]

Pathetic.

Sadly human, perhaps.

We killed off the crew of the shuttle Challenger in much the same way. Technical people brought word of a probably lethal problem and the people who had the authority to call off the launch could not bring themselves to consider the enormity of the situation. They had years of experience in not making waves, in not being alarmists. That a shuttle would actually fail was simply not in their imagination. That they would stop a launch tied to a major political event just to be cautious was scarier to them than the unimagined possibility. (I don’t want to hear about any conspiracies, here. This was simply a matter of known fears–embarrassment, demotions, or job loss–overcoming “possible” consequences.)

Look at the dozen or so threads around the SDMB on the tsunami. Over and over posters express their amazement at the damage and their inability to imagine how bad things were–and these are people reading the reports and watching the photos and tapes after the damage has occurred. How much more difficult for a person to imagine that something could be this bad when they have never encountered it? If one’s entire life is devoted to keeping one’s head down so as to continue to earn a living, it is unlikely that that person would suddenly become brave in the face of an unimaginable event.

(And, as I noted earlier, Thailand had only 35 minutes to respond and India and Sri Lanka fewer than two hours. I don’t care how brave a bureaucrat might be, without the infrastructure already in place, few people were going to receive an adequate warning in any event.)

Much of the commentary in the Thai press and from the Thai president (reactions that I am sure are being echoed in the other nine affected nations) is going to be driven by horror, shock, and frustration resulting in anger. If it results in a change to those societies in terms of how people are expected to carry out their jobs, that will be a good thing. I don’t see much point in castigating people for doing what all their training and experience has instilled in them simply because they encountered an event that they could never have expected.

[Ryan_Liam]

I always imagined that a tsunami wave would be like 3000 metres or so in the air, how high was the actual one that struck in so many places, and if it was so small how come it was so powerful?