# What's wrong, if anything, with community colleges? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 15, 2010, 9:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225 "2010-10-15T09:46:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/81 "2010-12-07T19:30:51Z")
> [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](#): > > … > It isn’t generally true though that calculus is calculus. It may be nice to have a smaller class, but not if the class is structured to move slower and be less rigorous than the equivalent course at a university. Did you or your husband study a field like engineering where calculus is a foundation for much more complicated math and quantitative courses, or was it just a requirement?.. I attended CC and completed an AA, and transferred to a major university to complete a Physics degree. The CC calculus and math classes, as well as the core physics classes, were in fact more rigorous and covered more topics than the direct university equivalents. This CC, and many others, had a standards agreement with the state and the universities that to be able to automatically transfer credits as equivalent, the classes had to meet all of the university level of content. This included the “engineering focused” math and science courses. That, and being in a class of fewer than 20 students instead of “weed out” lecture halls of 100s of students led by indecipherable unconfident TAs, is a huge plus for community colleges. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/82 "2010-12-07T21:35:42Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > If maturity is a function of experience and not just of age (in which case it doesn’t matter where you are) how is being in the same place you were for 17 years going to help? On a related note, I never understood the concept of a “skip year” where you wait a year between high school and college. To do what? Spend a year working in a restaurant in your home town while you go drinking every night with your high school buddies? ---
**Author:** ![kushiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbce88/32.png) [@kushiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kushiel)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/83 "2010-12-07T21:46:27Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > So did you ultimately go to a university or move to the city and kick ass? I went as big as I could get while still being close to home. 😃 Being close to my family is very important to me. Going somewhere like Toronto or Vancouver isn’t for me right now, but I work at a ‘small’ firm that does government contracts and some pretty big names around here, so I’m cool with it. > [@Voyager](#): > > Were you really not ready, or just scared? I could have stayed at home and gone to Cooper Union, free, but I chose to move away and I’m glad I did. Dorms are an excellent way of accelerating maturity, since they are kind of a halfway house - you get a lot of the annoying stuff done for you, but you still have to figure out how to study and relate to other people by yourself, and you are also thrown in with your peers far more than you would be at home. > > If maturity is a function of experience and not just of age (in which case it doesn’t matter where you are) how is being in the same place you were for 17 years going to help? I have clinically diagnosed anxiety and mood disorders since childhood. I had a mental breakdown that summer and knew I needed to stay at home and work with my psychiatrist. I still moved out at 20 which is a respectable age. But because I had problems so young I became very attached to my mom and matured much less quickly than my classmates. I eventually got ready and left the nest, just later than everyone else. Edit: I’ve lived on my own since I moved out. I’m not sure I could deal with having a roommate. I have to recharge my social batteries way more often and I don’t think I could do that while having to deal with another person around. > [@msmith537](#): > > On a related note, I never understood the concept of a “skip year” where you wait a year between high school and college. To do what? Spend a year working in a restaurant in your home town while you go drinking every night with your high school buddies? Usually it’s so you can think about what you want to do a little more and save up some money. Yeah, you’re not declaring a major in your first year, but if you still don’t have any idea what you want to do, then making some money so you don’t have to take out as many loans is okay. My friends actually chose to ‘upgrade’, which is basically staying in high school another year. This might come in handy if you tanked your science and math classes and wanted to retake them, but they just didn’t want to admit it was time to move on with their lives. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/84 "2010-12-08T02:55:30Z")
Base on my experiences, I firmly believe there is an intangible value of going to a “prestigeous college”. Sure, they may be full of rich spoiled douches. But those are the people you will be in contact with your entire career is you plan to have any success in life. It helps to know how to deal with them on equal terms. ---
**Author:** ![ChrisBooth12](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@ChrisBooth12](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ChrisBooth12)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/85 "2010-12-08T03:21:39Z")
It helped me out a lot. My English class was $100 to take plus the book and it is transferable to a State College as well as meets graduation requirements for an A/S ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/86 "2010-12-08T03:39:14Z")
I went to a 4 year university and I often regret not doing the first two years at a CC. ---
**Author:** ![skylar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b487fb/32.png) [@skylar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/skylar)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/87 "2010-12-08T04:08:06Z")
Very interesting thread. I am a 22-yr-old female in California and I completed community college in March. I went to community college ON PURPOSE so I could become a court reporter. I knew I wanted to be a court reporter at age 15, so I took the path that would get me there. A generic English degree from an Ivy League school would look good on my resume, but it won’t really help me be a better stenographer, so I’m over the whole feeling of not being as good as other people my age who are attending “real college.” My younger sister is 18 and is attending community college because she doesn’t know what she “wants to do with her life” yet. Our older sister went straight to a 4-yr university after high school because she had a scholarship and had already decided on her major/career path. All three of us are doing just fine. Different strokes for different folks. ---
**Author:** ![MsRobyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/90ced4/32.png) [@MsRobyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsRobyn)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/88 "2010-12-08T12:47:31Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Base on my experiences, I firmly believe there is an intangible value of going to a “prestigeous college”. Sure, they may be full of rich spoiled douches. But those are the people you will be in contact with your entire career is you plan to have any success in life. It helps to know how to deal with them on equal terms. Depends on what you want to do with your life. If you want to go to professional school or work at a white-shoe firm, prestigious colleges are fine because you do make those connections. But if you want to go into something like teaching or nursing or some similar field, you may find that the people doing the hiring got their degrees from Outer Slobbovia State and aren’t impressed by your overpriced Hahvahd placemat. I also know several people who got their bachelor’s degrees at Outer Slobbovia State who were able to get into some fairly prestigious graduate and professional programs because they were able to do research as undergraduates, something that is fairly difficult to do at a larger university. ---
**Author:** ![Fair\_Rarity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fair_rarity/32/153_2.png) [@Fair\_Rarity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fair_Rarity)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2010, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/89 "2010-12-09T03:31:13Z")
I’m in a CC now. I was too smart, in my mind, to go to one when I was 18. I went to a prestigious college, but I didn’t know what I wanted to do and money was always very, very tight. I did not have helpful adults in my life to guide me or offer alternatives, so I thought traditional 4-year was the only way to go. I lasted 2 years and never went back because I never knew what I wanted to do (and still don’t know 100%). So I am finishing off an associate’s now and my credits and degree will automatically transfer to the state university system. Doing it this way, I will also be eligible for different financial aid and scholarships. Plus it’s much cheaper and I will end up with a “name” school when I transfer after graduating. And if I don’t complete my bachelor’s, I’ll at least have a 2-year degree, which is better than just a HS diploma. I’m finding the work to be easier, MUCH easier, but the school I went to was very hard and I didn’t try very hard. I’m studying a lot now, so it feels easier because I am putting the work in. So I can’t tell objectively about the quality of my education because of the other factors. This was the path I should have taken years ago, taken 2 years at a (presumably) easier school, saving lots of money, figuring out what I wanted to do, earning at least an associate’s, even if I couldn’t progress further. It’s hard not to be angry at the adults in my life for not helping me. The whole college thing is so overwhelming for an 18-year old. Actually, I turned 18 just before semester started, so I did all this work as a 17-year old. I was too young to know that I didn’t know what I was doing. I would completely recommend doing this to others. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/90 "2010-12-10T16:42:26Z")
> [@MsRobyn](#): > > Depends on what you want to do with your life. If you want to go to professional school or work at a white-shoe firm, prestigious colleges are fine because you do make those connections. But if you want to go into something like teaching or nursing or some similar field, you may find that the people doing the hiring got their degrees from Outer Slobbovia State and aren’t impressed by your overpriced Hahvahd placemat. I also know several people who got their bachelor’s degrees at Outer Slobbovia State who were able to get into some fairly prestigious graduate and professional programs because they were able to do research as undergraduates, something that is fairly difficult to do at a larger university. I have a friend who went to Outer Slobbovia A&M! I think he used to play you guys in football. I would assume that someone who goes to Harvard typically has higher aspirations than being a schoolteacher or nurse. And really they probably should if they have that much academic ability. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/91 "2010-12-10T17:21:36Z")
I have two top-tier university degrees, have taken programming courses at CC, and know or have known CC instructors in the humanities and in technical areas. My experiences with CC have been very good. The instructors I know are extremely intelligent people who are good communicators, and I am sure they are great instructors. CC is nothing to sneeze at. Yes, I’m sure there is great variation as there is everywhere. When my sister and I were college age, I attended some classes with her at her well regarded private university, and was very UN-impressed. I think you can get a great education at CC, but as pointed out above, it provides a 2-year degree, so to progress further you would need to transfer to a 4-year college or university. For technical training you cannot beat it. Overall, CC is a great community resource and I think we should all be proud of the people who work and learn there. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/92 "2010-12-10T17:45:47Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I have a friend who went to Outer Slobbovia A&M! I think he used to play you guys in football. > > I would assume that someone who goes to Harvard typically has higher aspirations than being a schoolteacher or nurse. And really they probably should if they have that much academic ability. Harvard offers a very well respected (not surprisingly) Masters in Education (and I’m sure Doctorates as well). Lots of people DO go to Harvard to be teachers. I have the unfounded impression they are the sort of people who can blow a lot of money on a Masters Degree, teach underprivileged children in the Bronx, and still live off their trust funds before marrying very well. ---
**Author:** ![Agent\_Foxtrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc29f/32.png) [@Agent\_Foxtrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Foxtrot)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/93 "2010-12-10T17:48:18Z")
My community college was wonderful. It allowed me to turn my wreck of an academic career into a fairly impressive one (I went from a 1.01 GPA to a 3.2 in two years). I made friends who I hope will last a lifetime and the latent leadership abilities I never knew I had were drawn out of me. They even gave me a job while I worked there which I absolutely loved. For me, community college was a second chance. For others, it serves as a lower-cost opportunity to knock out core requirements before university. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/94 "2010-12-10T19:14:35Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I would assume that someone who goes to Harvard typically has higher aspirations than being a schoolteacher or nurse. And really they probably should if they have that much academic ability. I’m sure you’re not meaning to badmouth schoolteachers or nurses, but this is incredibly insulting. ---
**Author:** ![lorene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/65b543/32.png) [@lorene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorene)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/95 "2010-12-10T20:05:25Z")
> [@Captain\_Carrot](#): > > I’m sure you’re not meaning to badmouth schoolteachers or nurses, but this is incredibly insulting. Not to mention that RNs where I work make $65/hour. A nurse working full time grosses over $130,000 in other words. Not bad for a 2-year degree. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/96 "2010-12-10T21:40:16Z")
> [@Captain\_Carrot](#): > > I’m sure you’re not meaning to badmouth schoolteachers or nurses, but this is incredibly insulting. And I get it. But the reality is that if you can graduate with a degree from Harvard, I think you have a lot of opportunities to do more in the fields of education or health care than just teach social studies at some suburban middle school or be an RN. It’s like going to MIT to be an auto mechanic at the local garage. Sort of like Ben Afflecks speech at the end of Good Will Hunting. It’s a waste of your time and a bit of an insult to the other people working their who would love to cash in on your winning lottery ticket. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/97 "2010-12-10T21:47:17Z")
Let’s not deify people with Harvard degrees. Believe me, I have known legacy students at Harvard. ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/98 "2010-12-10T21:48:38Z")
> [@ratatoskK](#): > > Let’s not deify people with Harvard degrees. Ah, c’mon, I NEVER get deified! \ 😉 ---
**Author:** ![not\_alice](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_alice/32/7283_2.png) [@not\_alice](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_alice)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/99 "2010-12-10T22:00:55Z")
> [@Jeneva](#): > > I got through pre-calculus there with one of the best math teachers I’ve ever had, and then had to struggle with learning from someone’s grad student TA when I went on to take trig at the university, which was annoying. You do know that both “pre calculus” and “trig” are math at no greater than a 10th grade level, right? I would question whether a “university” that teaches “trig” is a real university, or a glorified CC, which to me is a glorified HS academically in most cases. Just saying… ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2010, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225/100 "2010-12-10T22:04:08Z")
> [@not\_alice](#): > > You do know that both “pre calculus” and “trig” are math at no greater than a 10th grade level, right? I would question whether a “university” that teaches “trig” is a real university, or a glorified CC, which to me is a glorified HS academically in most cases. > > Just saying… Right now, approximately 30% of American high school graduates require remedial math, remedial English, or both, when they attend college. That number jumps up to 50% or higher at the community college level. So it’s absolutely possible that a “real university” teaches remedial courses - I knew some people (yes, at Harvard) who had to take pre-calculus math courses in their freshman year. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-if-anything-with-community-colleges/557225.md?page=6)