# What's wrong with Russell Wilson? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Tags:** football-nfl\ **Created:** [January 2, 2024, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489 "2024-01-02T11:27:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/61 "2024-03-07T17:21:49Z")
> [@Railer13](#): > > Unless the Broncos organization is different from the other 31, as GM he was primarily responsible for the draft. On a lot of teams the head coach also has some say, but I’m not aware of a team that has a GM with **no** say in draft picks/priorities, and as you said the GM is generally the primary decision maker for personnel. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/62 "2024-03-07T17:37:19Z")
> [@Railer13](#): > > So while Elway was never the quarterback coach, it’s painfully obvious that he also had no eye for talent, as all of his draft choices were failures of varying degrees. HIs one bright spot was signing Manning, so he does get major kudos for that move. But the draft? Not so much. Do you really get kudos when Manning shows up on your doorstep and says, “Please sign me.”? ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/63 "2024-03-07T17:38:31Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > John Elway’s father, Jack Elway, was his coach in his young years, both officially and unofficially. I believe John Elway knows a thing or two about how to coach and lead QBs, though he clearly did not want to get into that line of work. I’m confused. Do you mean **Jack** Elway knows a thing or two about how to coach and lead QBs because John has never shown any ability in that direction. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/64 "2024-03-07T18:29:40Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Do you really get kudos when Manning shows up on your doorstep and says, “Please sign me.”? Compared to his drafting ability, yes. And it wasn’t that Manning was begging the Broncos to sign him. He met with at least two other teams prior to signing with Denver, so one would think that Elway had at least some influence in the final decision. > **[Peyton Manning chooses Broncos over Titans, 49ers](https://www.nfl.com/news/peyton-manning-chooses-broncos-over-titans-49ers-09000d5d827b2043)** > > The official source for NFL news, video highlights, fantasy football, game-day coverage, schedules, stats, scores and more. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/65 "2024-03-07T18:34:22Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > It’s not like the guy who got Russel Wilson fired in Denver is great at drafting QBs either. No argument from me. As a KC fan, I suffered through years of Bronco greatness. Now I am pleased with their ineptitude. Will Sean Payton turn it around in Denver? I would like to think not, but obviously time will tell. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/66 "2024-03-07T18:54:01Z")
> [@Railer13](#): > > Will Sean Payton turn it around in Denver? I would like to think not, but obviously time will tell. Payton did a good job of turning the Saints into something successful so it’s possible, but he’s going to need the right personnel and a front office that helps and doesn’t hurt him. So as you said, time will tell. I’d say he probably has a year of rebuilding ahead of him (ditching the QB is a big deal and they probably have cap space issues thanks to that contract) and if he doesn’t have something to show for it by the 2025 season, it ain’t gonna happen. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/67 "2024-03-07T19:17:39Z")
Denver just released Justin Simmons, who had a $14.5M cap number, so they’re not in terrible cap shape anymore, just plain bad. I think they have $1-2M more to get under. It’s not the most comfortable situation, given they’re going to have less flexibility when it comes to free agents, and they have some new contracts to work on, but the big increase in the cap this year really helped out. Never say never, but they play in the AFC West, so a decent rebuild year built off a solid draft should be considered a pretty good success, though I realize owners and fans often think anything less than a playoff berth is akin to abject failure. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/68 "2024-03-07T20:23:02Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > Never say never, but they play in the AFC West, so a decent rebuild year **built off a solid draft** The Broncos … And you said “solid draft” … BwahHaHaHaHa ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/69 "2024-03-07T20:32:00Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > a decent rebuild year The Broncos were 8-9 last year, and were actually in playoff contention until they lost 3 of the last 4 games. Considering that two 9-8 teams made the playoffs, they don’t need much of a rebuild to achieve that playoff berth. Their offense wasn’t terrible, as they scored just 14 points less than the Chiefs during the regular season. But their defense was pathetic, allowing the second-most points in the AFC. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/70 "2024-03-07T20:35:45Z")
Getting under that cap hit means potentially losing some of those veterans, though. They already released Simmons, who was a top tier safety, so that defense is going to be even more challenged. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/71 "2024-03-07T20:59:15Z")
Russell’s just getting old. Maybe the Pats, Cards, or Generals could use him to try to get to a .250 season. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/72 "2024-03-07T21:08:08Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Generals ISWYDT. I laughed. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/73 "2024-03-07T21:11:12Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Russell’s just getting old. He didn’t play like it last year. The biggest issue with his age is that he can’t move as well as he did, so his scramble isn’t as much of a threat as it was during his first decade as a player. But he still has a really good TD:Int ratio, can still hit the long bomb well, and can still improvise and make plays out of garbage. You just need an offense built to his strengths. He will never be as good as he was but he could probably still be in the top half of QBs with the right team. He also has been very healthy in his career and only missed games in one season (his last season as a Seahawk). That was a hand injury, and I haven’t heard that it has any lingering effects on his gameplay. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/74 "2024-03-07T21:35:10Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > The biggest issue with his age is that he can’t move as well as he did, so his scramble isn’t as much of a threat as it was during his first decade as a player. But he still has a really good TD:Int ratio, can still hit the long bomb well, and can still improvise and make plays out of garbage. You just need an offense built to his strengths. QB’s don’t lose their arms as they age, and the sense to avoid interceptions, but they do lose mobility. It takes a better team than Denver had to use a passing technician like Wilson at this point in his career. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2024, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/75 "2024-03-07T21:57:28Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > QB’s don’t lose their arms as they age, and the sense to avoid interceptions, but they do lose mobility. It takes a better team than Denver had to use a passing technician like Wilson at this point in his career. 100% agree with you on every point here. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2024, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/76 "2024-03-08T12:15:24Z")
There has been some discussion of Wilson’s salary in this thread, but in re-skimming through the thread, I didn’t see this factoid, which I read in _The Athletic_ this morning: _the Broncos are paying his entire $39 million salary this year, less what any new team pays him, which could be pennies for all Wilson cares (or $1.2 million, the league minimum)._ I have a subscription to _The Athletic_, so this is from a paywalled article. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2024, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/77 "2024-03-08T12:24:22Z")
Well, first of all, he’s 35 years old. Yes, I know, guys like Brady played into their forties, but Wilson is a scramble/running QB, and they definitely take a licking over time. Also, the speed goes long before the ability to throw a strong pass and, in the NFL, even a 5% loss of speed is going to have an effect because the defenses are so quick. Also, and perhaps this is a sign that most people really don’t have a deep understanding of football, a QB is very much dependent on a quality offensive line, a tight end threat, and wide receivers the defensive secondary has to respect as threats. Even a good defense that gives a QB outstanding field position and more possessions factors in his success. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2024, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/78 "2024-03-08T13:17:40Z")
> [@Railer13](#): > > There has been some discussion of Wilson’s salary in this thread, but in re-skimming through the thread, I didn’t see this factoid, which I read in _The Athletic_ this morning: There’s been a discussion of it in the general NFL thread (along with salary cap implications for all parties involved) but I guess it didn’t make it over here. > [@2024 NFL Pre-Draft Thread - The Chicago Bears are on the clock (for now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2024-nfl-pre-draft-thread-the-chicago-bears-are-on-the-clock-for-now/997548/): > > The Super Bowl is in the rearview mirror with the Kansas City Chiefs claiming the Lombardi for the second straight year. This means it time for teams to start rebuilding for 2024. The Chicago Bears for the second year in a row have the #1 overall pick (fortunately they didn’t earn it through ineptitude this year). [Key Dates](https://operations.nfl.com/gameday/nfl-schedule/2023-24-important-nfl-dates/) Event February 20 Teams can Franchise Tag Players February 27 - March 4 NFL Scouting Combine March 5 Franchise Tag Deadline March 11 Legal Tampering Period M… ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/79 "2024-03-11T12:02:56Z")
Wilson has signed with the Steelers, according to reports. > A great deal for Pittsburgh. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489/80 "2024-03-11T12:11:40Z")
> [@Railer13](#): > > A great deal for Pittsburgh. I agree. He’s certainly better than what they’ve had. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whats-wrong-with-russell-wilson/995489.md?page=5)