# Wheel of Time... lags **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 12, 2003, 9:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122 "2003-01-12T09:21:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![SkipMagic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skipmagic/32/20706_2.png) [@SkipMagic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkipMagic)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/61 "2003-01-16T04:46:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Legomancer \* > \*\*I’ve yet to hear from anyone who is actually reading and enjoying them. \*\* Well then, I guess I’ll be your first. (I hope it doesn’t hurt much.) 🙂 Seriously, I enjoy his books and am excited about getting and reading _Crossroads of Twilight_. I don’t mind the intricate details, the drawn out plot, the mini-plots and the millions of characters. (Hell, _The Brothers Karamazov_ had a cast of billions, too, and I managed to slough through _that_. Of course, I’m not sure I’d be able to stick with a series should Dostoevsky have actually written sequels and all. ;)) I also enjoy reading Martin (and, interestingly enough, was looking at Hobbs the other day) and others (Jennifer Roberson’s always been fun for me with her Cheysuli and Sword-Dancer series), too. They’re all good authors, just different. (I am not a fan, however, of Modesitt or Feist because they tend to write with too little detail.) But I do agree with the notion that he doesn’t write all of his female characters very well. They DO pull braids once too often and they all seem to be timid flowers, waiting to bloom with a lot of bosomy busts. All-in-all, if he goes another two or three books in the series, I won’t mind much. There are thousands of other books out there that I can read in the mean time, so I’ll be happy. Besides, I’m patient like that. 🙂 Do NOT tell my SO about that last line. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Master\_Wang-Ka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/master_wang-ka/32/3325_2.png) [@Master\_Wang-Ka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Master_Wang-Ka)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/62 "2003-01-16T04:51:59Z")
Well, yeah, but “The Brothers Karamazov” wasn’t published in forty-three installments, either. The author said what he had to say, and then FINISHED THE BOOK. Then again, I suspect Dostoevsky wasn’t getting advances from his publishers, either. ---
**Author:** ![SkipMagic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skipmagic/32/20706_2.png) [@SkipMagic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkipMagic)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/63 "2003-01-16T05:32:37Z")
Oh, sure. I agree. I definitely think Jordan is dragging this out, but I don’t think he’s doing it badly. YMMV, of course. 🙂 (Okay, okay, I _know_ your mileage does.) I think he’s created a an interesting, complex world that needs the amount of detail he puts in his book. I wish more authors would provide detail when they give us a book with “Okay, here’s this entire world and all I’m gonna describe is this itty-bitty portion of it. And even if I DO have my characters venture out to another country–or city, or tavern or hell dimension–I’m gonna make the other country/city/tavern/seven levels of Hell just like the country they came from. Except the ‘foreigners’ might wear different clothes. Or have horns on their heads.” Take Edding’s _Belgariad_ and _Mallorean_ series, for example. No matter which country Garion and his Scooby Gang traveled, they all seemed the same. I mean, yes, there were superficial differences, but none of which to really take note. Don’t get me wrong, I _like_ those two series (and they are fun to read over again), but they don’t live up to Jordan’s for level of detail. I mean, very few authors flesh out their books with enough detail, IMHO. True, I know that a lot of readers are tired of Jordan’s “fleshing out”, but I think he still has a masterful grip on his books. I enjoy 'em. 🙂 Of course, I could be masochistic, too. ---
**Author:** ![Silentgoldfish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@Silentgoldfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silentgoldfish)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/64 "2003-01-16T05:55:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Primaflora \* > \*\*Epithemus, it’s Ian Irvine and he’s an Australian author. I didn’t like the two of his I tried, I wanted to give them a decent editing as the style was too flowery for me. They are very popular though so it was a personal response I think. > > Simon Green’s good, what I’ve read of his. \*\* If you’re interested I got Glen Cook’s first trilogy for Christmas. Now that they’re all read they’re just sitting on my shelf… ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/65 "2003-01-16T06:04:06Z")
—I think he’s created a an interesting, complex world that needs the amount of detail he puts in his book.— It isn’t detail that I object to, but repetative detail about things we already know: characters we’ve already met. Especially if we believe Jordan’s claim that he’s writing it as if it’s all one book. I mean, if it WAS all one novel, wouldn’t it be weird to be told, every six hundred pages, that Mat wears a wide brimmed hat, or Elayne has blond braids that she tugs on, or whatever? —They DO pull braids once too often and they all seem to be timid flowers, waiting to bloom with a lot of bosomy busts.— Timid!?? They’re JERKS. Constantly. Arrogant. Mean. Pigheaded. Not that I’m complaining (though it would be nice to have more than just Brigette and Moraine as exceptions for some variation in character), but TIMID? WHAT? ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/66 "2003-01-16T06:09:30Z")
—Stopped after reading Fires of Heaven, never looked back. Pity, it came so highly recommended. My recommendation to anyone in the future will be to stop reading one book before I did.— Oh, Lord of Chaos is pretty good, and Path of Daggers, though it definately has the problems of slowdown, isn’t horrible. Winters Heart is where you realize that too many things are just spinning in place. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/67 "2003-01-16T17:31:10Z")
I thought _Winter’s Heart_ was a sign that the plot might start moving again…they actually acclompished something for the first time in several books. Apparently things have stopped again. ---
**Author:** ![Lezaza](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Lezaza](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lezaza)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/68 "2003-01-16T17:46:29Z")
I liked the end of Winter’s heart. Too bad that this book is so… dead. (You see, mr. Watson, the body is still warm, the corpse has not been dead for long. Or wait, it has.) ---
**Author:** ![GrandfatherTrout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f17d59/32.png) [@GrandfatherTrout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandfatherTrout)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/69 "2003-01-16T20:23:59Z")
I, too, gave up on the RJ stuff ages ago. At some point a new book came out and I forgot to read it, and after that I just didn’t care. Try _Perdido Street Station,_ by China Miéville. It’s not the High Fantasy stuff that others have been recommending in this thread—more like steampunk-flavored urban fantasy—but it is nonetheless fabulous. Plus it all happens in one volume. ---
**Author:** ![Qixotica](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/5fc32e/32.png) [@Qixotica](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qixotica)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/70 "2003-01-17T04:05:31Z")
I tend to be the type that either likes a story and continues reading it, burdensome details and all, or hates it and never finishes the first installment. I myself enjoy the Wheel of Time series, even though I agree that things need to get moving again plotwise. I enjoyed _Winters Heart_ and look forward to reading the new book. Even if he doesn’t advance the plot in the places I’d like, RJ spins a yarn that I enjoy. > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Primaflora_ > \*\*Somebody recommend me something worth reading in the interim. Please? \*\* I particularly enjoyed the _Sword of Truth_ series by Terry Goodkind. Book One, _Wizards First Rule_ was a very enjoyable read. Many people I know who are frustrated with Robert Jordan are now infatuated with this series. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/71 "2003-01-17T07:31:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Qixotica \* > \*\* > I particularly enjoyed the _Sword of Truth_ series by Terry Goodkind. Book One, _Wizards First Rule_ was a very enjoyable read. Many people I know who are frustrated with Robert Jordan are now infatuated with this series. \*\* That’s odd. Many people I know now think Terry Goodkind sucks ass. Just to present a dissenting opinion… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Who\_me\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/958977/32.png) [@Who\_me\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Who_me_1)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/72 "2003-01-17T13:44:16Z")
Since I read everything, I’m still reading the WoT. Yeah, I do enjoy it, but I wish the week in that world would get over with… (I think the series has moved forward about 6 days in the past 2 books) I’ll continue to read the series. > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Silentgoldfish_ > If you’re interested I got Glen Cook’s first trilogy for Christmas. Now that they’re all read they’re just sitting on my shelf… I’m assuming you mean the first trilogy of _The Black Company_. I really like Cook’s earlier stuff (esp. the _Starfisher’s trilogy_, but it’s all out of print now. ---
**Author:** ![Qixotica](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/5fc32e/32.png) [@Qixotica](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qixotica)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/73 "2003-01-17T23:54:33Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Smeghead_ > **That’s odd. Many people I know now think Terry Goodkind sucks ass.** Well, if you take a [look](http://www.terrygoodkind.com) at the guy, it’s clear from his expression he’s been suckin’ on something unpleasant. I still like the books though 😃 ---
**Author:** ![sturmhauke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e47c2d/32.png) [@sturmhauke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sturmhauke)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2003, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/74 "2003-01-18T09:17:59Z")
I liked Wizard’s First Rule, and the sequels were ok, but I hated how Goodkind kept coming up with ever more ominous and horrible ways that the world was going to end in each book. At least the end of the Wheel of Time only comes once in the timeframe of the series, if Jordan would ever get to it. ---
**Author:** ![Shade](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2bfe46/32.png) [@Shade](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shade)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2003, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/75 "2003-01-18T15:22:40Z")
It would help if each book started with a summary of the rest, who’s who and who did what. ---
**Author:** ![Azael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@Azael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Azael)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2003, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/76 "2003-01-18T16:26:53Z")
I remember I started reading the Wheel of Time series way back in seventh grade. I enjoyed them, very much in fact. Perhaps his writing style isn’t for everyone but I was not intimidated by it and I am commited to reading the whole damn thing someday (if it ever gets finished). Many of the complaints brought up here are the same ones that me and my friends would debate time after time… years ago. I knew then, as I know now, that I would be long out of college before the series ever ended. Personally, if you couldn’t even make it through the first few books then I could care less about your whining. Read something shorter. If there are too many characters and plotlines then read something more simple. I won’t pretend that the Wheel of Time is the series to end all series (God knows it isn’t), but I hear a lot of complaining from people who seem offended that it should ever be as popular as it is. Well it is, and I know as well as anything else that that draws the critics like ants to a picnic. Some good fantasy series would be: George R.R. Martin _A Song of Ice and Fire_ - this man blows Jordan away. Steven Brust - anything based on his Dragaeran world. Raymond E. Fiest - Got me started on fantasy books with Magician: Apprentice and the the _Rift War Saga_. Avoid his newer works like the plague, especially the latter half of the _SerpentWar Saga_. Elizabeth Haydon - _The Rhapsody Trilogy_, excellent series IMO. Excellent writer. Frank Herbert - _Dune Series_… Classic. A fantasy story in a sci-fi setting. David Eddings -_The Elenium_. Read it a long time ago but I really enjoyed it. As for Robin Hobb, all I can say is that I was with him until that utter disapointment of a book he chose to end _The Farseer Trilogy_ with. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2003, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/77 "2003-01-18T19:33:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Shade \* > \*\*It would help if each book started with a summary of the rest, who’s who and who did what. \*\* [www.dragonmount.com](http://www.dragonmount.com) has all kinds of resources, including a chapter by chapter summary of the entire series and an extensive (it’d have to be) database of every character in the series and what we know about them. ---
**Author:** ![Shortie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecd19e/32.png) [@Shortie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shortie)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2003, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/78 "2003-01-18T23:05:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Azael \* > \*\*As for Robin Hobb, all I can say is that I was with him until that utter disapointment of a book he chose to end _The Farseer Trilogy_ with. \*\* I was kinda disapointed in then ending of the first trilogy as well, but I thought the Liveship trilogy was a lot better. Much more sense of conclusion, and I liked the characters more (mostly). ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2003, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/79 "2003-01-18T23:17:05Z")
—I thought Winter’s Heart was a sign that the plot might start moving again…they actually acclompished something for the first time in several books. Apparently things have stopped again.— To make up for it, at least half this new book takes place WHILE that accomplishment is going on. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2003, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122/80 "2003-01-18T23:42:59Z")
Primaflora, I assume you’ve read Ged Maybury? I hear he’s talented. 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wheel-of-time-lags/148122.md?page=5)