# When did Columbus Day turn into Italian-American heritage day? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 12, 2009, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596 "2009-10-12T22:58:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/1 "2009-10-12T22:58:31Z")
Not that I have a problem with either, it just seems that a Genovese explorer working for the Spanish crown in the 1400s doesn’t have a whole heck of a lot to do with extensive Italian immigration to the United States in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. But watching the parades on TV, it seems to be the functional Italian equivalent of St. Patrick’s Day. When did this shift occur and how did people celebrate Columbus Day (if at all) before it was adopted by the Italian-American community? ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/2 "2009-10-12T23:11:32Z")
I’m guessing it probably occurred during the first few decades of the 20th century shortly after the wave of Italian immigration had crested. Italian-Americans were extensively discriminated against so they rallied around Columbus to get back at the nativists who disparaged them as not being “good enough” to be real Americans. Of course, I’m probably grossly oversimplifying things. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2009, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/3 "2009-10-12T23:59:31Z")
Here in Minnesota, in front of the State Capitol, we have a statue of Columbus on one side and a statue of Leif Erikson on the other. The italians gather at one, the scandanavians at the other, have speeches, drink beer, then meet in the middle for a good brawl. The native americans sit up above on the Capitol steps and mutter “why don’t you all go back where you came from?”. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim_r.mortiss/32/142_2.png) [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_R.Mortiss)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/4 "2009-10-13T00:09:51Z")
My understanding is that it was \*always _a bone thrown to the Italian-American voting bloc_ by giving their heritage a day of its own…TRM (proud Eye-talian-American) \*as implied here: [Columbus Day - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbus_Day#United_States_observance) ---
**Author:** ![brujaja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4af34b/32.png) [@brujaja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brujaja)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/5 "2009-10-13T04:23:28Z")
…ever since I was old enough and informed enough to feel really, really shitty about imperialism, manifest destiny, and the effect of European settlers on the beautiful state where I live. When I look at the SF Bay, which smells like sewage and washes up a nauseating grey foam on the slimy beaches, I think of how lovely the pristine bay must have been before Europeans got here, teeming with sea life of every kind, wholesome and good-smelling, surrounded by oaks and everything. The Columbus Day Parade in SF, on the other hand, is the only place I have ever known where I can be around a lot of other Italians and feel like I fit in. (that is, unless I join the local VFW, hee hee.) ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/6 "2009-10-13T04:45:46Z")
According to [Wiki,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbus_day) it began as early as the 1860s, and became more significant in the early 1900s, culminating in the declaration of a Federal holiday in 1934: > [@](#): > > Some Italian-Americans observe Columbus Day as a celebration of their heritage, the first occasion being in New York City on October 12, 1866.[3] Columbus Day was first popularized as a holiday in the United States through the lobbying of Angelo Noce, a first generation Italian, in Denver. The first official, regular Columbus Day holiday was proclaimed by Colorado governor Jesse F. McDonald in 1905 and made a statutory holiday in 1907.[4] In April 1934, as a result of lobbying by the Knights of Columbus, Congress and President Franklin Delano Roosevelt October 12 was made a federal holiday under the name Columbus Day[5] and a Federal holiday.[6] While Columbus Day was commemorated to some extent before this, it was really the push by Italians for a day to celebrate their heritage that made it a significant holiday. > [@Erdosain](#): > > But watching the parades on TV, it seems to be the functional Italian equivalent of St. Patrick’s Day. It might be mentioned that St. Patrick’s Day is much more important in the US than it is in Ireland, again because of the need of an immigrant community to have a day to celebrate their heritage. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 9:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/7 "2009-10-13T09:13:10Z")
> [@NDP](#): > > I’m guessing it probably occurred during the first few decades of the 20th century shortly after the wave of Italian immigration had crested. Italian-Americans were extensively discriminated against so they rallied around Columbus to get back at the nativists who disparaged them as not being “good enough” to be real Americans. > > Of course, I’m probably grossly oversimplifying things. When my mother announced that she was going to marry my father, her father told her that nice WHITE girls didn’t marry EYE talians. On the way to the wedding, he decided that his car needed an oil change right then. Fortunately for me and my sibs, he was persuaded otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Serenata67](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/serenata67/32/10646_2.png) [@Serenata67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Serenata67)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/8 "2009-10-13T15:27:31Z")
This is kinda funny, because it wasn’t until college that I even really knew that Italians had such a connection to Columbus day. Where I grew up, there aren’t a lot of Italians who are super strongly connected to their heritage. There aren’t any Columbus day rallies or festivals or anything. Sophomore year, I had a friend who was really Italian from a larger city and she was complaining that there weren’t any Columbus day activities. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/9 "2009-10-13T15:46:06Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > It might be mentioned that St. Patrick’s Day is much more important in the US than it is in Ireland, again because of the need of an immigrant community to have a day to celebrate their heritage. I’m not really sure if you can say this. St. Patrick’s Day is a national holiday here. In the past it was a bigger deal on that side of the pond but nowadays the St. Patrick’s festival is a big deal here. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/10 "2009-10-13T15:54:57Z")
Some people just like to party. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/11 "2009-10-13T16:04:41Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > When my mother announced that she was going to marry my father, her father told her that nice WHITE girls didn’t marry EYE talians. On the way to the wedding, he decided that his car needed an oil change right then. Fortunately for me and my sibs, he was persuaded otherwise. They could have told him that a good source of oil for the car would be to ring out the greasy Italian fiance’s pillowcase, if OPEC hadn’t already staked their claim. And yes, I’m a greasy Italian, so I can make jokes like that. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/12 "2009-10-13T17:28:08Z")
> [@An\_Gadai](#): > > I’m not really sure if you can say this. St. Patrick’s Day is a national holiday here. In the past it was a bigger deal on that side of the pond but nowadays the St. Patrick’s festival is a big deal here. I had heard that before, but it’s nice getting confirmation from a native. Do you guys dress up in silly “Irish” costumes like we do, or make sure to wear something green? Green beer, too? I’m just wondering if you’ve picked up on some of the more “extreme” aspects of Saint Patrick’s day in the US. ---
**Author:** ![TheMadHun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@TheMadHun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheMadHun)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/13 "2009-10-13T17:28:35Z")
Columbus and his lore are a lot more real than St. Patrick and his snakes. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/14 "2009-10-13T17:47:58Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I had heard that before, but it’s nice getting confirmation from a native. Do you guys dress up in silly “Irish” costumes like we do, or make sure to wear something green? Green beer, too? I’m just wondering if you’ve picked up on some of the more “extreme” aspects of Saint Patrick’s day in the US. A lot of people will dress up in silly costumes, some will be in parades throughout the country, some will get blind drunk, it’s a problem with teenagers getting completely wasted as a rite of passage. I bet you could get green beer in some touristy places but it’s not that common. We usually spend the day with family eating food and drinking, maybe listening to some Irish music. Back in the day, the Dublin parade was an embarrassment, underfunded and lame, compared with its transatlantic cousins. In more recent years it has become more elaborate and better funded and is quite a spectacle. I don’t think it is as big as the NYC parade but it is still quite a sight. The “wearing of the green” thing isn’t engrained here at all and a friend of mine who was working in the US, their child got mocked for not wearing green to school on St. Patrick’s Day, ironic since she was the only kid in the class who was actually Irish. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/15 "2009-10-13T18:02:29Z")
> [@brujaja](#): > > …ever since I was old enough and informed enough to feel really, really shitty about imperialism, manifest destiny, and the effect of European settlers on the beautiful state where I live. Even if the Europeans hadn’t colonised the Americas the likelihood is that things would be much the same, ie there would be a 21st century industrial society on the continent, whether Native American or otherwise. Same old pollution. ---
**Author:** ![davekhps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@davekhps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davekhps)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/16 "2009-10-13T18:16:03Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > It might be mentioned that St. Patrick’s Day is much more important in the US than it is in Ireland, again because of the need of an immigrant community to have a day to celebrate their heritage. Not to contradict anything An Gadai wrote, but on the face of it, this wouldn’t be very strange at all, seeing as there [are more Irish in America than Irish in Ireland](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_American). It’s like growing up third-gen Polish in Chicago-- we always heard that Chicago was the second-largest Polish city in the world, at least back in my childhood. Of course, we’re all American mutts anyway. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/17 "2009-10-13T18:36:15Z")
> [@davekhps](#): > > Not to contradict anything An Gadai wrote, but on the face of it, this wouldn’t be very strange at all, seeing as there [are more Irish in America than Irish in Ireland](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_American). Oh there’s no doubt it’s a big deal in the US, bigger in number of people involved than in Ireland but the fact is it’s a _national_ holiday here. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/18 "2009-10-13T19:00:04Z")
> [@Serenata67](#): > > This is kinda funny, because it wasn’t until college that I even really knew that Italians had such a connection to Columbus day. Where I grew up, there aren’t a lot of Italians who are super strongly connected to their heritage. There aren’t any Columbus day rallies or festivals or anything. Sophomore year, I had a friend who was really Italian from a larger city and she was complaining that there weren’t any Columbus day activities. The funny thing to me is that Columbus could be considered to be a traitor, but I see him mostly as a mercenary, willing to sell his ideas and experience to the ones that financed his trip. That turned to be Spain. Italy and its city states were considered but Columbus actually proposed his plan to Portugal first! Some private Italians gave some financial help for the trip, but the states or rulers in Italy got no territory or gain from this deal. Looking to the future, I think the celebration of the day in the USA will include even more of the Hispanic take on it. Yesterday I saw on Monday Night football several mentions to the holiday and Columbus and Italians, but also mentioned the Hispanic heritage and celebrations in Miami. The only thing missing was that Hispanics call the day “Día de la Raza” literally the day of the race, but at least in El Salvador the “raza” refers not just to the Indians but to the meeting of the races (Caucasians, Indians and the result of the mix: the mestizos) . **It is a day to celebrate the good that came from the encounter and at the same time does not ignore the bad**. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/19 "2009-10-13T19:28:41Z")
At least Columbus has some connection to Italy, unlike St. Joseph, whose day is also a sort of “Italian heritage day” (though it can be overshadowed by St. Pat being just two days earlier). > [@](#): > > The “wearing of the green” thing isn’t engrained here at all and a friend of mine who was working in the US, their child got mocked for not wearing green to school on St. Patrick’s Day, ironic since she was the only kid in the class who was actually Irish. Every year, I wear my Irish wool sweater and carry my shillelagh, and almost invariably, someone will ask me why I’m not wearing anything green. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596/20 "2009-10-13T19:41:35Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > Here in Minnesota, in front of the State Capitol, we have a statue of Columbus on one side and a statue of Leif Erikson on the other. The italians gather at one, the scandanavians at the other, have speeches, drink beer, then meet in the middle for a good brawl. > > The native americans sit up above on the Capitol steps and mutter “why don’t you all go back where you came from?”. So, they gonna go back across the Bering Strait then? Everyone’s an immigrant, if you go back far enough, even “native” Americans. 😉 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-columbus-day-turn-into-italian-american-heritage-day/513596.md?page=2)