# When did fish become meat? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 3, 2006, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-fish-become-meat/378948 "2006-11-03T08:21:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-fish-become-meat/378948/21 "2006-11-03T19:31:19Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] And, generally, you’d be right. But the hard-core Vegans are trying to get “vegetarian” (without qualifiers) = “vegan”. Words change, especially those which have a heavy socio-political load. Currently, “vegetarian” means vegan, ovo-lacto, and even fruitarian- years ago, it also covered pescarians. [/QUOTE] I understand. But they’ve already got a perfectly good word that many people know and understand to describe their brand of vegetarianism. Why the need to claim “vegetarian”? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-fish-become-meat/378948/22 "2006-11-03T19:45:16Z")
[QUOTE=pulykamell] I understand. But they’ve already got a perfectly good word that many people know and understand to describe their brand of vegetarianism. Why the need to claim “vegetarian”? [/QUOTE] In India, those claiming to be vegetarians avoid eggs but not dairy. I don’t think Western-style ovo-lacto-vegetarians have any better claim to the term “vegetarian.” ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-fish-become-meat/378948/23 "2006-11-03T20:24:48Z")
[QUOTE=pulykamell] I understand. But they’ve already got a perfectly good word that many people know and understand to describe their brand of vegetarianism. Why the need to claim “vegetarian”? [/QUOTE] "one-true"ers. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-fish-become-meat/378948/24 "2006-11-03T20:29:22Z")
[QUOTE=acsenray] In India, those claiming to be vegetarians avoid eggs but not dairy. I don’t think Western-style ovo-lacto-vegetarians have any better claim to the term “vegetarian.” [/QUOTE] I’m not disagreeing. I’m saying “vegetarianism” should be a broad term, not a narrow one like “vegan.” Both Indian-style vegetarianism and American ovo-lacto vegetarianism fits under the umbrella of “vegetarian.” ---
**Author:** ![groman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/73ab20/32.png) [@groman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/groman)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-fish-become-meat/378948/25 "2006-11-04T00:16:35Z")
For some reason in Russia every single _vegetarian_ I’ve met ate fish, shellfish, eggs and dairy. Vegans are the same here and there though(although I don’t know the Russian term for “vegan” since I only know one and he didn’t self-identify as anything). ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-fish-become-meat/378948/26 "2006-11-04T02:38:42Z")
> [@](#): > > We all know a vegetarian considers fish meat. As others have noted, it’s a flexible rule. The Moosewood, one of the country’s most famous vegetarian restaurants, serves fish. > [@](#): > > But at the same time, the Catholic rules of abstinence from meat don’t consider fish as meat. Kosher regulations also hold to this classification, which suggests in ancient times people didn’t consider fish meat. The distinction was based more on economics rather than zoology. In the classical Mediterranean region where the church was formed, fish was a common food for the masses. Meat was a gourmet item consumed by the wealthy. So the idea of renouncing meat for fish was an exercise in humility. > [@](#): > > A Japanese told me that squirrels are not considered meat, nor are whales. They were both eaten during the period up to the Meiji revolution in, I think, 1867, that ended to taboo on eating meat. Squirrels were classified as birds (and still are) and whales as fish. I’ve read that during the Renaissance, the Catholic Church defined beavers as a form of fish so they could be eaten on Fridays. (And yes, you perverts, I’m talking about the large semi-aquatic rodents of the genus Castor.) ---
**Author:** ![scareyfaerie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scareyfaerie/32/3135_2.png) [@scareyfaerie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scareyfaerie)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2006, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-fish-become-meat/378948/27 "2006-11-04T15:24:39Z")
[QUOTE=groman] For some reason in Russia every single _vegetarian_ I’ve met ate fish, shellfish, eggs and dairy. [/QUOTE] When we were on holiday in Russia earlier this year, we went to a restaurant for a traditional meal - our tour guide told me that the chef had prepared a special vegetarian meal for me, and had previous asked me what I did or didn’t eat because their idea of vegetarianism wasn’t the same as mine. The food was fantastic though! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-fish-become-meat/378948.md?page=1)