# When did McDonalds start changing their fryers from tallow to vegtable oil in the U.S.? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 4, 2020, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835 "2020-09-04T18:34:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![CanTak3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f14d63/32.png) [@CanTak3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanTak3)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2020, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/1 "2020-09-04T18:34:50Z")
As a kid I have a very vivid memory of McDonalds fries being amazing and then turning into flavored garbage one day. I was a small child at the time and I remember it so distinctly because I couldn’t believe anyone would purposely make this change. I tried looking up when this changeover happened and I get two results: 1990 and 1992 depending on the source. However for either of these to be accurate my memory cannot be. See I was not a kid then. My memory places this event somewhere circa 1983-4. Was the changeover instant across the country or staggered? Could I have been in an unlucky pocket of trial runs? Was there some other change in the early 80’s I could be thinking of? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2020, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/2 "2020-09-04T19:08:57Z")
Apparently, In the U.S., they still had some “beef” flavor > **[McDonalds Fries Are Vegetarian in India but Not in the U.S.](https://www.treehugger.com/mcdonalds-french-fries-still-not-vegetarian-3970283)** > > McDonald's changed their policy about gestation crates and chickens, but their French fries aren't vegetarian. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2020, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/3 "2020-09-05T07:28:04Z")
Although McDonald’s fries in America went 100% vegetable fat in ?? 1990 ?? , that doesn’t mean that they were “original recipe” before that. They might well have gone to different blend in 1983-84. I think that the price of Beef Tallow was rising in the 70s, and the internet says that the reason McDonald’s started with a mostly-beef blend was because their supplier couldn’t do hydrogenated vegetable oil. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/4 "2020-09-06T02:20:05Z")
I kind of wish they’d go back. But it’s probably high in trans fats. I can live with the saturated ones. ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/5 "2020-09-06T02:42:52Z")
It’d be a logistics nightmare, but I’d love to see BOTH offered on their menu. Let’s say, for a year. Vegan fries vs. Tallow fries. (Make sure all the keto and paleo folks are made aware.) What’s the data, re: popularity? Profit margins? ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/6 "2020-09-06T03:10:30Z")
I worked at McDonald’s in the summers from 1985 to 1987. I can confirm that the French fries were definitely fried in tallow throughout my employment. They were big blocks of white solid fat wrapped in foil. You added them to the fryer by unwrapping a block of tallow and plopping it into a fry basket, then slowly lowering it into the hot oil to avoid splattering. Everything other than the fries (including McNuggets, filets, and pies) were fried in a separate fryer using vegetable oil. I recall being told that they had tried to switch the fries to vegetable oil as well on a trial basis, but received too many complaints, so had switched back. I later heard somewhere that sometime after that (i.e. sometime after 1987), they ultimately did make the switch a few years later. I’ve heard two stories on the switch: (1) they made the switch, but did it very gradually (i.e. slowly reducing the proportion of tallow over the course of months) so that customers would get used to it, and (2) they added some kind of beef flavoring to the vegetable oil. Maybe they did both. In any event, it was after I worked there. ---
**Author:** ![fedman1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e495f1/32.png) [@fedman1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fedman1)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/7 "2020-09-06T06:57:24Z")
wasn’t there a lawsuit from a Sikh about that time because of the tallow? ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/8 "2020-09-06T08:29:15Z")
AFAIK Mc D have always used oil here in the UK. “Tallow” is only used for candles. If you like chips (fries) cooked in beef fat there are plenty of fish and chip shops using it if you search online. More in the North than the South but they do exist. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 10:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/9 "2020-09-06T10:47:40Z")
> [@fedman1](#): > > wasn’t there a lawsuit from a Sikh about that time because of the tallow? I don’t understand. Why was the Sikh suing over tallow? ---
**Author:** ![fedman1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e495f1/32.png) [@fedman1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fedman1)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/10 "2020-09-06T15:35:30Z")
they don’t eat any meat ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/11 "2020-09-06T16:38:29Z")
> [@bob\_2](#): > > AFAIK Mc D have always used oil here in the UK. “Tallow” is only used for candles. According this [article](https://blog.cheapism.com/why-mcdonalds-fries-used-to-be-better/), McD’s used a proprietary blend of 93% beef tallow and 7% vegetable oil worldwide before they switched to 100% vegetable oil. > [@](#): > > …Interstate, the fry oil supplier for the McDonald brothers’ burger stand, was too small of an operation to afford the expensive hydrogenation equipment to produce partially hydrogenated vegetable oil — the most popular frying oil at the time. Instead, Interstate provided McDonald’s with a blend of 7% vegetable oil and 93% beef tallow, sourced from the stockyards of Chicago, which could extend the life of the oil without expensive equipment. It also happened to make the fries incredibly delicious. > > The special beef tallow and oil blend for McDonald’s fries became known as Formula 47, named after the combined cost of the restaurant’s “All-American meal” at the time, which included a 15-cent burger, 12-cent fries, and a 20-cent shake. Kroc insisted that all of the McDonald’s franchises use Formula 47, ensuring that the rest of the country — and eventually the world — would come to love the taste of McDonald’s french fries. ---
**Author:** ![obbn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/d6d6ee/32.png) [@obbn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obbn)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2020, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/12 "2020-09-06T17:52:50Z")
I miss so much of the McDonald’s of the 80s. Yes, the fries were so good, now we have flavorless potato sticks. But the two other things that I really really really miss are: 1. The McDLT. God, that was a tasty burger. Cool side cool, hot side hot. I understand the tree huggers killed that one due to the packaging. Stupid tree huggers. 2. The original apple pie. If you’ve never had one I can’t even begin to describe how delicious it was. Back then they deep fried it. It was incredible! Now we’re forced to choke down that horrible baked thing that should be thrown in the trash. To help a little, Hardees still has honest to goodness fried apple pies. Not quite as good as the old McDonald’s ones, but not bad. If you miss the old McDonald’s pies, do yourself a favor and order one at Hardees. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2020, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/13 "2020-09-07T00:44:34Z")
> [@fedman1](#): > > they don’t eat any meat Sikhs eat meat (or not, if they choose). You may be thinking of a different religion. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2020, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/14 "2020-09-07T01:31:04Z")
In the 1990s, vegetarians in general—which might include some Sikhs and Hindus, but not all of them—objected to the use of animal-sourced fat for the potatoes. In the later 1990s-early 2000s, Hindus, specifically objected to “beef flavoring” in the McNuggets. Hindus who are not vegetarians can eat chicken, but not beef. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2020, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/15 "2020-09-07T02:10:35Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > In the 1990s, vegetarians in general—which might include some Sikhs and Hindus, but not all of them—objected to the use of animal-sourced fat for the potatoes. > > In the later 1990s-early 2000s, Hindus, specifically objected to “beef flavoring” in the McNuggets. Hindus who are not vegetarians can eat chicken, but not beef. When I worked at McDonald’s in the 1980s, there weren’t a lot of vegetarian options (including the fries, as we’ve discussed). An item that some people ordered now and again (which often included people who appeared to be Indian in origin) was a “vegetarian Big Mac.” It was simply a Big Mac without the meat. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2020, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/16 "2020-09-07T02:12:58Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > In the later 1990s-early 2000s, Hindus, specifically objected to “beef flavoring” in the McNuggets. Hindus who are not vegetarians can eat chicken, but not beef. IIRC, the flavoring was some sort of milk-derived concoction that wasn’t strictly speaking, vegetarian, even if the oil itself was vegetable oil. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2020, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/17 "2020-09-07T02:51:12Z")
> [@bump](#): > > > [@Acsenray](#): > > > > In the later 1990s-early 2000s, Hindus, specifically objected to “beef flavoring” in the McNuggets. Hindus who are not vegetarians can eat chicken, but not beef. > > IIRC, the flavoring was some sort of milk-derived concoction that wasn’t strictly speaking, vegetarian, even if the oil itself was vegetable oil. Hindu vegetarians are generally fine with dairy. Veganism is very uncommon in India. “Pure vegetarian” in an Indian context means no animal flesh or fat, and no garlic or onions. But butter, yogurt, and milk is okay. Jain vegetarian means no root vegetables at all. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2020, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/18 "2020-09-07T13:24:18Z")
> [@obbn](#): > > Now we’re forced to choke down that horrible baked thing that should be thrown in the trash. Underlining mine. Perhaps eating elsewhere would solve your problems. McDs has generally been nasty unhealthy food since Day One. Sometimes tasty by the standards of the times, but nasty nevertheless. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2020, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/19 "2020-09-07T16:01:40Z")
> [@bob\_2](#): > > AFAIK Mc D have always used oil here in the UK. “Tallow” is only used for candles. That’s just because we call it ‘dripping’. McDs was here in the UK in the 80s, and I remember going there as soon as it opened - the fries were quite different to how they are now, which may or may not be due to the oil/fat. Might just be the recipe for the fries themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2020, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835/20 "2020-09-07T16:46:30Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > In the 1990s, vegetarians in general—which might include some Sikhs and Hindus, but not all of them—objected to the use of animal-sourced fat for the potatoes. > > In the later 1990s-early 2000s, Hindus, specifically objected to “beef flavoring” in the McNuggets. Hindus who are not vegetarians can eat chicken, but not beef. Googling, the [Wikipedia article](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_McDonald%27s_products#Fries) says that the switch from tallow was due to a campaign against saturated fats, although even after that, there was beef flavoring added. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-mcdonalds-start-changing-their-fryers-from-tallow-to-vegtable-oil-in-the-u-s/919835.md?page=2)