# When did open hatred become fun family entertainment? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 12, 2013, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077 "2013-08-12T21:34:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/161 "2013-08-14T06:12:56Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Since the margin of error on the poll is 4%, the results from 2009 and 2013 are within it. Nitpick: Since you want to understand statistics, here’s a little tip; the margin of error computation assumes 50-50 splits. A poll with “4% margin of error” has 2.4% margin on 90/10 questions. (Disclaimer: I think. I’m running on inadequate caffeine right now.) ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/162 "2013-08-14T06:46:15Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Nitpick: Since you want to understand statistics, here’s a little tip; the margin of error computation assumes 50-50 splits. A poll with “4% margin of error” has 2.4% margin on 90/10 questions. > > (Disclaimer: I think. I’m running on inadequate caffeine right now.) Wrong. Margin of error is always ±. See for yourself: [http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/2009/PPP\_Release\_National\_9231210.pdf](http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/2009/PPP_Release_National_9231210.pdf) PPP conducted a national survey of 621 voters from September 18 th to 21st. The survey’s margin of error is +/-3.9%. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/163 "2013-08-14T07:37:26Z")
Just for myself, I don’t think the intense reaction to Obama is directly a matter of race, but that he represents change. And its change more than race _per se_ that causes the conservative mindset to cringe. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/164 "2013-08-14T08:00:03Z")
> [@camille](#): > > I was curious when my post seemed to inspire you to start witnessing all of a sudden… Whoa, hold those horses. The subject interests me, and that is the extent of it. The only thing less interesting than somebody else’s dreams is somebody else’s acid trips, and trumping both are somebody else’s religious opinions. I see no reason to inflict mine on you, you seem a rather nice person, over all. It is unlikely you deserve any such fate. > [@](#): > > …St. Augustine wrote refutations of astrology. How is numerology any different, I wonder? I am told that he is not nearly such a tiresome old prune in the original as he is in translation, and I am willing to accept that without further investigation. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 8:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/165 "2013-08-14T08:08:12Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Just for myself, I don’t think the intense reaction to Obama is directly a matter of race, but that he represents change. And its change more than race _per se_ that causes the conservative mindset to cringe. What about the general “foreignness” of his name, his origins, and his upbringing–even if he was born in the US? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 8:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/166 "2013-08-14T08:54:34Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Wrong. Margin of error is always ±. See for yourself: [http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/2009/PPP\_Release\_National\_9231210.pdf](http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/2009/PPP_Release_National_9231210.pdf) > > PPP conducted a national survey of 621 voters from September 18 th to 21st. The survey’s margin of error is +/-3.9%. You quote from the survey’s own incorrect (though oft-seen) formulation as though that were a cite from a statistics expert. Laughable. I infer from other threads you’re a gambler of sorts. Too bad SDMB doesn’t have a Wagering forum where you and I could Paypal sums, awaiting arbitration by one of the Board’s statistics experts. 😃 But it doesn’t. I’ll have mercy on you and let you find the following at Wikipedia: > [@](#): > > **When a single, global margin of error is reported** for a survey, it refers to **the maximum margin of error for all reported percentages** using the full sample from the survey. If the statistic is a percentage, this **maximum margin of error can be calculated as the radius of the confidence interval for a reported percentage of 50%.** If this Wiki quote, even with relevant phrases underlined, is too opaque to fight your ignorance, I respectfully suggest you avoid statistics in future. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/167 "2013-08-14T15:45:06Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > You quote from the survey’s own incorrect (though oft-seen) formulation as though that were a cite from a statistics expert. Yep. Of course, **septimus** knows better what their margin of error is than the people who did the survey. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/168 "2013-08-15T04:13:46Z")
Speaking of President masks and rodeo clowns: [http://articles.philly.com/1994-08-19/news/25842089\_1\_bullfighting-clowns-rodeo-arena-clown-smile](http://articles.philly.com/1994-08-19/news/25842089_1_bullfighting-clowns-rodeo-arena-clown-smile) The bull came out bucking. The rider flopped from side to side and the bullfighters held back, letting the bull make his moves until the rider dropped off. Licciardello crouched in a heavily padded barrel, a human target should the bull decide to charge. Hawkins waited near the barrel, holding his big inner tube. A dummy with a George Bush mask stood beside the clown, propped up by a broomstick. … .J. Hawkins rolled out the big inner tube, and the bull lowered his head, shot forward and launched into the tube, sending it bounding down the center of the arena. The crowd cheered. Then the bull saw the George Bush dummy. He tore into it, sending the rubber mask flying halfway across the sand as he turned toward the fence, sending cowboys scrambling up the fence rails, hooking one with his horn and tossing him off the fence. ---
**Author:** ![camille](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/22d042/32.png) [@camille](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/camille)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/169 "2013-08-15T06:37:56Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Whoa, hold those horses. The subject interests me, and that is the extent of it. The only thing less interesting than somebody else’s dreams is somebody else’s acid trips, and trumping both are somebody else’s religious opinions. I see no reason to inflict mine on you, you seem a rather nice person, over all. It is unlikely you deserve any such fate. Any apparent niceness up until now is only a cover for my demonic destiny. I hope it kicks in soon, my severance pay runs out in three weeks… But seriously, no horses, no bull (well, maybe one), and no intent to gore anyone’s ox. I do understand why you don’t want to get into it, so I really was surprised when you… got into it back there. And I was a little bummed out when I ran across that Antichrist gizmo and _only my name of all the ones I plugged in_ turned up positive. Apologies if you read it as a cheap shot. It is an interesting subject, scary online calculators aside. Maybe another time. Funny how this thread went from racist rodeo clowns to Antichrists and numerology, and then wagering over how to calculate a margin of error. ---
**Author:** ![camille](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/22d042/32.png) [@camille](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/camille)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/170 "2013-08-15T06:44:22Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Speaking of President masks and rodeo clowns: > > [Inquirer.com archives](http://articles.philly.com/1994-08-19/news/25842089_1_bullfighting-clowns-rodeo-arena-clown-smile) **Terr** , that rodeo article was from the summer of 1994. George Bush wasn’t even elected as Governor of Texas until November of that year. It wasn’t a President’s mask then, was it? I admire your determination, but it’s not a comparable situation. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/171 "2013-08-15T06:52:04Z")
> [@camille](#): > > **Terr** , that rodeo article was from the summer of 1994. George Bush wasn’t even elected as Governor of Texas until November of that year. It wasn’t a President’s mask then, was it? I admire your determination, but it’s not a comparable situation. You’re serious, aren’t you? [Hint](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Presidents_of_the_United_States) ---
**Author:** ![camille](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/22d042/32.png) [@camille](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/camille)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/172 "2013-08-15T07:11:25Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > You’re serious, aren’t you? [Hint](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Presidents_of_the_United_States) I know what you’re saying, but Bush the Elder wasn’t President then either. You can’t even be sure which one is meant by the description, but I thought it was protocol to refer to a former President as President in a news article. ---
**Author:** ![camille](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/22d042/32.png) [@camille](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/camille)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/173 "2013-08-15T07:26:31Z")
Too late to edit: I think you’re right that it was an HW mask. I thought it was a Texas rodeo, and they were going after W as a nominee for Governor. But I guess it would be too early for a W. mask at a New Jersey rodeo in 1994. They must have been using leftover masks from the last season. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/174 "2013-08-15T13:54:14Z")
Meh. Rodeos are animal abuse for entertainment; why is it surprising that the people attending enjoyed seeing (simulated) abuse of humans? ---
**Author:** ![Longshanks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Longshanks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Longshanks)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/175 "2013-08-15T14:28:49Z")
At least in the good ol’ days the Christians were used as fodder the lions. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/176 "2013-08-15T15:01:36Z")
I wonder, if the next POTUS is a woman, are we going to go through all of this all over again, substituting sex for race? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/177 "2013-08-15T15:30:45Z")
Oh yeah. Think of some of the stuff Rush has already said. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/178 "2013-08-15T16:44:57Z")
No. I won’t. You can if you want to, but I flat refuse. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/179 "2013-08-15T16:59:40Z")
The Texas rep who invited the clown to our state [has been answered](http://www.khou.com/news/Texas-congressman-offers-invitation-to-rodeo-clown-with-Obama-mask-219643541.html) by somebody who actually runs a Texas rodeo… > [@](#): > > Stockman’s district encompasses a large area of southeast Texas, including portions of Houston. > > But RodeoHouston Vice President and Chief Operating Officer Leroy Shafer made it clear that the controversial clown would not perform there. > > ‘’The Houston Livestock Show has had no conversations with Congressman Stockman. The Congressman has no authority to invite any person to perform at our show," Shafer said. "As the largest rodeo in the world, we invite only the top rodeo contestants to compete and we only employ the top performers in the rodeo industry. We pride ourselves on providing a quality, affordable and family-friendly presentation that entertains everyone and offends no one.‘’ [The rodeo](http://rodeohouston.com/) is a really big deal, even in a city where damn few of us ever punched a cow. And they’ve been going after a diverse customer base for quite a while… ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077/180 "2013-08-15T17:05:23Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > [The rodeo](http://rodeohouston.com/) is a really big deal, even in a city where damn few of us ever punched a cow. I’m an old cowhand from the Rio Grande But my legs ain’t bowed and my cheeks ain’t tan I’m a cowboy who never saw a cow Never roped a steer cause I don’t know how Sure ain’t a fixing to start in now Yippie yi yo kayah [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-open-hatred-become-fun-family-entertainment/666077.md?page=10)