# When did ships get wheels? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 8, 2011, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902 "2011-08-08T02:31:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/1 "2011-08-08T02:31:55Z")
We sailed on _Lady Washington_ yesterday, and she was steered with a tiller. (A fake wheel was used in POTC.) One of the crew said that ships’ wheels did not come about until the 19th Century – I think. When were tillers replaced by wheels on ships? And yes, I’m cringing at the inevitable posts about ships that roll along on wheels. . ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/2 "2011-08-08T04:13:48Z")
Just want to say, my best friend was a crewman on the _Lady Washington_ two years ago. He was also on _Hawaiian Chieftain._ ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/3 "2011-08-08T04:18:06Z")
If I recall my Burke correctly, ship’s wheel entered service about the time European sailors started rigging their craft with both square and lateen sails. So…15th century or thereabouts. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/4 "2011-08-08T04:35:47Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > Just want to say, my best friend was a crewman on the _Lady Washington_ two years ago. He was also on _Hawaiian Chieftain._ Pics linked [in this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=619365). > [@silenus](#): > > If I recall my Burke correctly, ship’s wheel entered service about the time European sailors started rigging their craft with both square and lateen sails. So…15th century or thereabouts. Really? Early-19th Century seems too late to me (but I may have misheard), but 15th Century seems a bit early. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/5 "2011-08-08T05:35:34Z")
Wiki says 1700, with no cite. I re-checked Burke, and his reference was to s_tern-post rudders_, not _wheels_, so I was off on the 15th century. remembered the rudder but not the way to move it. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/6 "2011-08-08T05:36:40Z")
Dup post. NM. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/7 "2011-08-08T07:36:38Z")
Here [http://www.usatoday.com/tech/columnist/aprilholladay/2006-06-26-tiller-steering\_x.htm](http://www.usatoday.com/tech/columnist/aprilholladay/2006-06-26-tiller-steering_x.htm) > [@](#): > > Steering mechanisms for Western Ships > Before 1450 At first, helmsmen used a simple steering oar located on the right side of the boat. Hence, by the way, the term starboard for right from Old English stéor, meaning ‘steering paddle’ and bord, meaning ‘ship’s side’, says curator Anna Holloway of The Mariners’ Museum in Newport News, Virginia. The term ‘port’ for left, evolved in the 1540’s from the ‘port side’ of the boat, which became the docking side to avoid crushing the steering oar. Later a tiller moved a stern-mounted rudder, which steered the ship. Small sailing ships, even today, use a tiller. > > From 1450 to 1700 The deck had become so high above the rudder by 1450 the helmsman couldn’t see where the ship was headed if he were stationed by the tiller and rudder. To solve this problem, ship builders attached a stout piece of timber (called a whipstaff) to the tiller. The whipstaff reached the deck - the new helmsman station. Here he could both control the rudder and see the sails. He also gained a mechanical advantage of about 4 to 1. The Mayflower helmsman used a whipstaff. > > From about 1703 on The helmsman used a steering wheel from about 1703 on. In fact, ships used both a whipstaff and a wheel until about 1717. ---
**Author:** ![picunurse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@picunurse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/picunurse)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/8 "2011-08-08T13:38:19Z")
> [@Johnny L.A.](#): > > And yes, I’m cringing at the inevitable posts about ships that roll along on wheels. Yesterday, after the hydro flipped, one of the announcers made a comment about her wheels coming off. The other announcer quietly said “They don’t have wheels.” ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/9 "2011-08-08T16:27:25Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > When were tillers replaced by wheels on ships? > > And yes, I’m cringing at the inevitable posts about ships that roll along on wheels. About the time treadmills came into existence. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![OttoDaFe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ottodafe/32/356_2.png) [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/10 "2011-08-08T23:01:06Z")
> [@picunurse](#): > > Yesterday, after the hydro flipped, one of the announcers made a comment about her wheels coming off. The other announcer quietly said “They don’t have wheels.” Actually, I recall from watching the thunderboats mumble-mumble years ago\* that the prop was frequently referred to as the wheel, as in “they’re going to try a wheel with a different pitch.” Doesn’t mean that the first announcer wasn’t something of a dunce, though. \*Back when the boats actually, you know, thundered. I know that the turbines are faster and more reliable, not to mention less likely to incinerate the driver; but compared to the old Allisons and Merlins, they just don’t sound right. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2011, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/11 "2011-08-08T23:25:27Z")
[History of the ships wheel](http://blog.handcraftednauticaldecor.com/history-of-the-ship-wheel/) - looks like originally, on the larger ships, they had two wheels. Right around the time when the British royal naval was formed…according to that short article. From personal experience, people seem to enjoy a smaller rig like JY13 or sunfish with a small tiller, it’s easier to race when you can lean waaay out and not dump it or lose your baring. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2011, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-did-ships-get-wheels/591902/12 "2011-08-09T02:16:43Z")
Good article. I had to look up ‘whipstaff’, mentioned earlier, as I’ve never seen one.