# When do words REALLY rhyme? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 23, 2003, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641 "2003-04-23T17:49:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![jsb5048](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@jsb5048](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsb5048)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641/1 "2003-04-23T17:49:13Z")
Does the sound have be similar throughout the whole end of each word? For Ex: Report and Torque? The “or” sound is the same but would e e cummings say they really rhyme? This is a huge debate at work right now. Any reference to the “rules” of grammar would be appreciated. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641/2 "2003-04-23T18:29:38Z")
When the last _accented_ vowel and the rest following it sound alike. From OED. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641/3 "2003-04-23T18:38:31Z")
No matter what we say, songwriters and poets are going to keep on pretending that “self” rhymes with “else,” and that “lady” rhymes with “baby.” So, what’s the point of arguing about it? ---
**Author:** ![bradwalt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/858c86/32.png) [@bradwalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bradwalt)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641/4 "2003-04-23T18:38:40Z")
A good question - I particularly object to mis-rhymes in song lyrics: sometimes the rhyme becomes “almost” acceptable because of bad diction on the part of the singer. But “REPORT” and “TORQUE” do not rhyme by any stretch of the imagination; neither do “PORT” and “PORK” ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641/5 "2003-04-23T18:52:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bradwalt \* > \*\*A good question - I particularly object to mis-rhymes in song lyrics: sometimes the rhyme becomes “almost” acceptable because of bad diction on the part of the singer. > > But “REPORT” and “TORQUE” do not rhyme by any stretch of the imagination; neither do “PORT” and “PORK” \*\* ---
**Author:** ![jsb5048](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@jsb5048](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsb5048)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641/6 "2003-04-23T18:54:13Z")
I don’t think they rhyme either. Does anyone have a grammar text they can refernce or something!! Heated opinions are running around here like crazy. It’s a slow day at work. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641/7 "2003-04-23T19:00:38Z")
\ What I meant to say there is that “Report” and “Torque” is an example of assonance, and “Port” and “Pork” and example of alliteration, both of which are kinds of rhyme. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641/8 "2003-04-23T19:09:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jsb5048 \* > \*\*I don’t think they rhyme either. Does anyone have a grammar text they can refernce or something!! Heated opinions are running around here like crazy. It’s a slow day at work. \*\* So OED wasn’t good enough for you? ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641/9 "2003-04-23T19:19:53Z")
**Earl** (love the username, by the way), Maybe our OP’er **jsb5048** either didn’t catch the reference to the **O** xford **E** nglish **D** ictionary, or didn’t know what **OED** stood for. I tried to find the OED definition online, but they only allow access by subscription. At Merriam-Webster they state: > [@](#): > > : correspondence in terminal sounds of units of composition or utterance (as two or more words or lines of verse) b : one of two or more words thus corresponding in sound c : correspondence of other than terminal word sounds And American Heritage had more or less the same thing. I would stick with was **Mr. Snake Hips Tucker** cited from the OED. It is what I would think of - in terms of starting from the last accented syllable… ---
**Author:** ![stuyguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@stuyguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stuyguy)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-do-words-really-rhyme/170641/10 "2003-04-23T20:46:20Z")
Get yerself a copy of the Clement Wood’s (ed.) “The Complete Rhyming Dictionary, The essential Handbook for Poets and Song Writers.” Read the first few chapters and you’ll learn WAY more than you ever thought there is to know about rhyming. BTW, it is the rhyming dictionary that Stephen Sondheim swears by, and that’s good enough for me. And no, Report and Torque do not rhyme. Captain Amazing correctly called that “vowel rhyme” an assonance.