# When does virginity and age become weird? (Offshoot of What's sexier) **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 13, 2005, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302 "2005-07-13T05:06:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/2bfe46/32.png) [@John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Carter_of_Mars)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/101 "2005-07-14T05:42:38Z")
> [@La Llorona](#): > > INTP is one of the Myers-Briggs types, very loosely based on the ideas of Carl Jung;… Oh. Thanks. E **X** troverted **S** mooth **T** alking **S** um-bitch here. ---
**Author:** ![lel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8797f3/32.png) [@lel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lel)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/102 "2005-07-14T05:48:10Z")
I don’t want to look weird, so I say that I’m saving myself for religious reasons. That has become a handy catch all excuse for pretty much everything, though. I can use it in a number of different ways. Religious reasons is one way, but not the only reason I say that. I say I’m waiting for religious reasons because… \*I signed one of those cards saying I was back in my teenage years, and I’m a stubborn sort. (It’s not a major factor, but I am stubborn!) \*I really don’t want to have sex without a major level of commitment in a relationship, and if I say it’s religious reasons, hopefully they’ll understand that I’m looking for serious commitment first. \*I want to make it look more like a choice when really I am rather physically unattractive. (I’m overweight, but I don’t think I look like a hydra.) \*Having raised myself quasi-fundamentalist Christian, I do still harbor a few sexual neuroses. But, when does it become weird to be a virgin? That’s not my place to judge, generally speaking. If I’m contemplating having sex with someone, I’m going to have discussed all this with them anyway and be satisfied that I would like to have sex with them. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hook](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ccd318/32.png) [@The\_Hook](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hook)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/103 "2005-07-14T06:10:43Z")
> [@La Llorona](#): > > As with all personality tests, [YMMV](http://skepdic.com/myersb.html), and I wouldn’t take it seriously, but it’s fun for a boring afternoon or two. I used to be one and, quite frankly, the questions posed in these kinds of tests need a bit of tweaking (though this very criticism and further analysis of a system is an INTP trait). Then I read this: [http://www.intp.org/intprofile.html](http://www.intp.org/intprofile.html) It blew my mind away. I have never been described in such a detailed and understanding way. As things go, my lack of “trivial chatter” abilities, my keeping most of my thoughts to myself, reworking each and every idea until it’s fully understood and real world-proof, my enjoying solitude, my sense of humor that normally doesn’t find its way into others’ ideals, my seeing the local bars and overall drinking appointments as murderous to the mind (oh, precious thee), and my inability to express myself in a brief and concise manner shatter all possibilties of my laying on a woman. 😛 I’m a young one, yes, but the pattern seems to hold for the future. Have you ever seen the episode where Malcolm (in the Middle) tries to ask to the dance this blonde girl? He talks too much and can’t explain himself properly without having to resort to 3/10s of a dictionary. That’s me. 😃 Only I can’t play dumb and score as he later did, because I have seen that show and I am now aware of the consequences. 😉 For those interested: > **[Personality test based on Jung and Briggs Myers typology](http://www.humanmetrics.com/personality)** ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/104 "2005-07-14T13:41:24Z")
> [@FilmGeek](#): > > Decreased sex drive is a sign of depression, not low sex drive. I call BS. Read my post–the part where I said that I am a little tired of being told that “low sex drive” is a sign of depression (or frigidity). BS–a _change_ in sex drive can signal depression. Kind of like a change in appetite (not eating or overeating). there is nothing wrong with me, sexually. I just don’t seek sex, think about sex, fantasize about sex, inititate sex as often as others here. That does not make me depressed. It makes me different than many here, but still “normal”. Maybe we should define normal–that could take some time… BTW, I lost my virginity at 17. Had 4 partners (not simultaneously!) until my marriage at 24. I certainly didn’t live like a nun. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/105 "2005-07-14T13:48:01Z")
Just finished reading the thread. I’m an INTJ, too! we are rare, BTW. Greettings and salutations and all that. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![SisterCoyote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@SisterCoyote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SisterCoyote)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/106 "2005-07-14T13:55:46Z")
INFP. Which doesn’t make the dating thing any easier for me, either. Darned introversion! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Cliffy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/59ef9b/32.png) [@Cliffy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cliffy)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/107 "2005-07-14T14:08:22Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Yeah, that’s not offensive. Uh huh. You quoted four people there. One of them said something very different from the other three. Read again. > [@](#): > > you can’t get a date/job because you don’t have experience, but how are you supposed to GET experience if no one will give you a chance? But it’s not a Catch-22, not really. Because in my experience, the reason adult virgins are virgins is because they want to be. If you don’t want to be, it’s not that hard to change. –Cliffy ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/108 "2005-07-14T14:12:46Z")
> [@continuity eror](#): > > Because it is immature. (snip) Just because the consensus seems to be that someone is unscrewable doesn’t make them so. If you’re attracted to someone when you thought they were “normal,” you should be just as attracted to them after they drop the V-bomb. Does being a virgin make someone less attractive? Less interesting? Less likable? It’s immature to say that someone is abnormal or weird because of it, yes. But it is not immature in any way to make a decision about whom to have a relationship with. I base my decisions on several factors, not just sex. But sex is important to me. I don’t want to be in a marriage where I’m not sexually compatible with the person. Marriage is a huge deal for me, and I’m somewhat afraid of it. So I would want to make sure we’re compatible in every way first. Living together, paying bills together, social obligations, hobbies, interests, and sex. It just goes with the package. But again, all I’m trying to do is that both viewpoints are either normal or abnormal. It really doesn’t matter. It’s all about personal choice, and I guess I’m trying to convince both sides on that. For those of you who absolutely wouldn’t sleep with a virgin, or think there’s something wrong with it, did you in your life ever set any provisos on your first time? Just wondering. Because even I decided I wasn’t going to lose my virginity until I was out of my teens. Everyone just has different limits, that’s all. If you never set a proviso, you still really don’t have the right to tell other people what to do or not to do, but I actually haven’t seen that in this thread. I’ve seen a lot of personal feelings, and “It would bother me” but those are opinions. And one last thing: Like \*\*Sister Coyote \*\* said, any outsiders who are reading this shouldn’t feel obligated to lose their virginity just because of some people. Lose it when you are ready. Just…be aware that every choice has consequences. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/109 "2005-07-14T14:48:24Z")
Does a pre-sexual-maturity encounter count? What if it was consensual, with underage partners? I consider myself to have Lost It at the age of 8, after what I like to think of as a hands-on friendship with two 11-year-old girls. Since then, let’s just say it’s gotten a lot harder. In more ways than one. ---
**Author:** ![Aangelica](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b2d939/32.png) [@Aangelica](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aangelica)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/110 "2005-07-14T16:01:15Z")
I responded a lot earlier in this thread and now I feel compelled to clarify. I meant that “accidental” virginity (which I’m defining for my purposes given that this is a personal opinion as “Actively seeking to have sex but failing in said pursuit”) after the middle-to-late twenties gives me pause. In other words, I would be curious about it and probably demand an explanation. Much as I would demand an explanation if a person I was interested in pursuing a serious relationship with had an avowed preference for bondage. Or had a shrine to Cthulu in his basement. Or felt compelled to adhere to a strictly organic and vegan diet. Or voted Republican. It’s a thing that might prove to have an effect on the relationship. Hence I get to be curious about it if we’re heading in its general direction. I didn’t mean it’s weird as in “Omg! That dude is a virgin at 35! Someone call the leper colony and let’s lock him away for his obvious mental instability!”. There are a _lot_ of reasons to remain a virgin at a later-than-usual age that could well be exceptionally detrimental to the relationship - or at the very least provide issues that must be addressed and hence I should know about them. Some of them have been mentioned: childhood abuse, past sexual abuse, mental illness, total lack of sex drive, religion, etc. I’m not sayin’ I’d send a fella I was into to the curb just because he’s never done the nasty, but I’d for sure want a little additional information. As is my right as a potential sexual partner. If I’m serious about you to be thinking of sharing my body with you, I’d like to know why nobody else has been that important to you in the past. In my own view, it’s responsible behavior to consider a person’s sexual history or lack thereof when contemplating entering that phase of a relationship with them. Not only sexual history in the “Does he have any nasty diseases?” sense, but in the “Is there anything atall here that’s going to bite me in the ass unexpectedly” sense. A person’s attitudes about sex and sexuality are an important part of who they are. If I’m in a relationship with someone whose attitudes in that area do not match mine precisely (most people really - whose attitudes on sex are identical to someone else’s really?), then the differences need to be explored. For my own good and his. And if you’re in my dating age-range and haven’t had sex with anyone, that in and of itself indicates a difference in our attitudes towards sex and sexuality. Might not be a big enough one to matter in the grand scheme, but a girl’s gotta find out for sure. Plus, there’s the exciting thought pattern that many women have had down the years that goes as follows: We’re dating, and yet he wants to wait to have sex. Is it _only_ because of the strength of his committments or does he _really_ not find me sexually attractive and only wants the companionship? ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/111 "2005-07-14T16:27:52Z")
I think losing your virginity past your early twenties can sometimes be a marker for more serious issues. My brother has confided in my mother that he just lost his. Said brother will be thirty-one on his birthday next month. He’s had no significant relationships with a person of the opposite sex even though he states he’s heterosexual. He currently lives at home with my parents and delivers pizza for tips and minimum wage because he lacks the education and motivation to find a better job. When not delivering pizza he dreams of a career in real estate. Actually he dreams of making lots of money in real estate without any real effort on his part so he puts up signs stating he buys and sells houses. He’s never actually owned a house of his own nor is he a mortgage broker or real estate agent. I consider the relatively late loss of his virginity just one of many signs that he’s psychologically and emotionally immature. ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/112 "2005-07-14T16:27:58Z")
> [@Cliffy](#): > > I don’t think it means you’re a loser. It’s abnormal in the strict sense of being outside a standard dev, but there’s certainly nothing wrong with it. But what I’ve said upthread is that being an adult virgin signals to potential partners that regardless of how well you hit it off, they’re not going to be having any sex with you for quite some time. Which seems to me an accurate assumption, and I think you agree with me on that. That might be _your_ assumption, but I disagree that it’s necessarily accurate. I’ve thought more about this issue, and I think our differences come from how differently we see this activity known as “dating”. I’ll explain what I mean, if you think I’m wrong, please tell me. You see, as I’ve said before, I’m a rather shy, introverted person. It’s very rare that I’ll find people who might be interested in pursuing a relationship with me, mostly because I don’t actively seek them. So if I ever find a woman who seems to like me, she’d probably be the only one doing so at this particular time, and I’d probably consider her my “girlfriend” as soon as we start being a little more intimate (and by this I mean kissing, talking about more intimate subjects, etc.) And at this point, yes, I’d probably start having sex with her if she seems interested. I doubt that I would introduce the subject, but if she does, no problem. You, on the other hand, seem like a much more extroverted person. Maybe I’m completely wrong, but you probably have a whole lot of friends and acquaintances. So when you “date” people, you probably date many people at once, since there are many people who seem to be somewhat interested in you at the same time. Presumably, you start getting intimate with them, and having sex with them, before deciding which one (if any) of them you’re going to pursue an actual relationship with. So to you, it makes sense to start having sex with someone you’re not in love with yet. To me, by the time I’d start having sex, I’d be in love. But of course, again, this just means we’re different. (If what I wrote in my two previous paragraphs is right.) You might say that most “normal” people think like you, and I’d better get used to it if I don’t want to stay alone, but I’m not sure you’re entirely right. Sure, the people you hang out with are probably similar to you. But there are many other people who see relationships in a different light. There are probably who see them in the same light as me. And if the female friend you mentioned earlier was closer to my age and lived close to me, I’d ask you to meet her. Her view of relationships is probably somewhat closer to mine. Tell her that there are men who are more like her than those she’s met up to now. ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/113 "2005-07-14T16:34:38Z")
> [@SisterCoyote](#): > > Because although _I_ am confident in my choices, there are those who won’t speak up, who aren’t as confident, and who die inside a little bit every time someone suggests that they might have a “problem” because of what they are or aren’t interested in. So where I, personally, am not offended (please. Rick Santorum offends me. Fred Phelps offends me. This issue? Not worth the effort of taking offense), I’m still going to speak up and let the quiet ones know they’re not alone. > > I know they exist. I know it matters. I used to be one of them. I know what you mean. I’m also still working hard to shake my belief that people who’ve had sex before (or a relationship) consider me to be some sort of inferior creature. Sometimes I tend to think that I am one myself. I won’t let the opinions expressed in this thread offend or depress me, especially since there are also a lot of more “pro-virgin” opinions expressed (or rather “anti-anti-virgin”), but I certainly can understand that someone would feel this way. ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/114 "2005-07-14T16:37:38Z")
> [@Aangelica](#): > > Not only sexual history in the “Does he have any nasty diseases?” sense, but in the “Is there anything atall here that’s going to bite me in the ass unexpectedly” sense. Why, are you into that sort of thing? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/115 "2005-07-14T16:41:11Z")
> [@Soapbox Monkey](#): > > So apparently, my not having met any girls who want to be with me means that I’m therefore unworthy of being with? Quite a little catch 22 there. I wasn’t aware that finding someone was so easy. I apparently missed the memo they sent out about that magical place where everyone goes to and gets paired off into serious relationships. > > Some of us just can’t find relationships. Maybe we don’t have the qualities that force so many other guys to shake off women with a stick. But for those of you who would refuse to be with me, or any guy (or girl for that matter), simply because no one ELSE found us desirable, then that’s amazingly shallow and immature. And yet I was considered immature for, not even a year ago, complaining that I wanted to lose my virginity to another virgin. I’ve luckily come to terms with that. Amen Brother! (Note: the use of this expression should in no way be interpreted to mean that I’m a virgin for religious reasons and will not have sex with anyone before marriage.) Yes, for some of us, getting into relationships is hard. But that doesn’t mean that we cannot be attractive for anyone. If you’ve met us, haven’t seen anything disturbing yet, and then learn that we’re virgins, it’s unlikely that you’ll find anything disturbing even if you search harder. Just believe in your prior intuition. By the way, I’d also like to lose my virginity to another virgin. I don’t think that’s shallow at all, it’s just a preference. Of course, I know the chances of that happening are slim, so I’m not holding my breath, and will certainly consider non-virgins. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Damage](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@Mister\_Damage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Damage)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/116 "2005-07-14T16:54:25Z")
> [@eleanorigby](#): > > I call BS. Read my post–the part where I said that I am a little tired of being told that “low sex drive” is a sign of depression (or frigidity). > > BS–a _change_ in sex drive can signal depression. Kind of like a change in appetite (not eating or overeating). > there is nothing wrong with me, sexually. I just don’t seek sex, think about sex, fantasize about sex, inititate sex as often as others here. That does not make me depressed. It makes me different than many here, but still “normal”. Maybe we should define normal–that could take some time… > > BTW, I lost my virginity at 17. Had 4 partners (not simultaneously!) until my marriage at 24. I certainly didn’t live like a nun. You said in post #32 > [@eleanorigby](#): > > I get a little tired of being told by women’s mags and friends etc that there must be something wrong with me. “Low sex drive” is a sign of depression etc–if so, I’ve been depressed my whole lifelong… Two posts later in post #34, **FilmGeek** said: > [@FilmGeek](#): > > Decreased sex drive is a sign of depression, not low sex drive. I think the problem is that **FilmGeek** ’s post can be parsed two ways: 1. Decreased sex drive is a sign of depression. Low sex drive is not a sign of depression. 2. Decreased sex drive is a sign of depression. Decreased sex drive is not a sign of low sex drive. …it’s a question of whether you read the “not” in **FilmGeek** ’s post as differentiating between “decreased sex drive” and “low sex drive” or between “depression” and “low sex drive”. Given the context, I parsed it the first way—that **FilmGeek** was trying to say that the people who say low sex drive is a sign of depression are wrong—I think you’re reading it the second way. I can’t speak for **FilmGeek** , but I think this might just be a case of miscommunication, and that you’re both in agreement. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2005, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/117 "2005-07-14T17:40:41Z")
Damn, I’m glad I didn’t read this thread two years ago. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2005, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/118 "2005-07-15T00:45:25Z")
> [@SisterCoyote](#): > > Not to feed into your neuroses, as I have plenty of my own, but you undoubtedly are. Ah. Than you very much, ma’am, may I have another… 😃 > [@](#): > > That said, How YOU doin’? 😉 Oh, my… now I’m blushing :o My very first SDMB "how I’m doin’ "…and from an artist, too! I so like artists! [wait, wait… after six years? :eek: what took me so long? Am I weird? Is there something wrong with me? 😛😃] I’ll always treasure this special moment, **SisterCoyote** 😉🆒 ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2005, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/119 "2005-07-15T02:14:03Z")
> [@eleanorigby](#): > > Just finished reading the thread. > > I’m an INTJ, too! > > we are rare, BTW. > Greettings and salutations and all that. > > 🆒 We are not only rare, we are Masterminds. Hells yeah. -foxy ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2005, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302/120 "2005-07-15T02:39:49Z")
> [@Mister Damage](#): > > I can’t speak for **FilmGeek** , but I think this might just be a case of miscommunication, and that you’re both in agreement. Maybe so. Sorry, bit of a red flag for me–issue between husband and self. I’ve been told my whole married life that whatever I’ve got is never(often) enough\*, so I tend to see red first and think sense later. \*quality is apparently fine, but quantity is not. Whatever. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-does-virginity-and-age-become-weird-offshoot-of-whats-sexier/312302.md?page=7)