# When good artists Go Bad. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 3, 2001, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305 "2001-01-03T22:04:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![SpinneZiege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9e8a1a/32.png) [@SpinneZiege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpinneZiege)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2001, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/21 "2001-01-07T00:31:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by astorian \* > **because even John Lennon himself fully believed that the Beatles were a mere passing fad that the public would tire of in short order- all the more reason to make big bucks in a hurry** > [@](#): > > We’re bigger than Jesus. > -John Lennon ---
**Author:** ![ThisYearsGirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@ThisYearsGirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThisYearsGirl)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2001, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/22 "2001-01-07T01:00:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by mangeorge \* > \*\*Probably a dumb question, but is Joan Osborne related to Ozzy? > Peace, > mangeorge \*\* According to Pop-up Video, they are not related. They aren’t related to Super Dave Osborne, either. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2001, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/23 "2001-01-07T01:06:26Z")
Thanks, **ThisYearsGirl**. In fact, my kids, my grandkids, and **Zoggie** all thank you. Kinda nice to be a hero, huh? 🙂 Peace, mangeorge ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/24 "2003-01-16T22:47:04Z")
What could be more of a sell out than releasing a Christmas album when you’re Jewish (or an atheist, etc.)? Take the prize **Neil Diamond** , **Barbra Streisand** , and **Barry Manilow**. ---
**Author:** ![Mojo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Mojo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mojo)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/25 "2003-01-16T22:56:19Z")
IIRC, Ozzy’s _Iron Man_ was used to sell Timex Ironman watches. And I’ve always thought the poster child for selling out was Jefferson Airplane/Jefferson Starship/Starship, but at least they had the good sense to alter their name so that fans could retain fond memories when listening to their new crap. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/26 "2003-01-16T23:01:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ThisYearsGirl \* > \*\*According to Pop-up Video, they are not related. They aren’t related to Super Dave Osborne, either. \*\* Joan Osborne is American, Ozzy Osbourne is British. And Super Dave Osborne’s name is an alias- his real name is Einstein. As many of you know, Super Dave’s brother is comedian Albert Brooks. Gee… I WONDER why a guy named Albert Einstein would change his name… - P.S. I don’t remember the specifics, but I’ve heard the opening of Ozzy’s “Crazy Train” in car commercials. ---
**Author:** ![gex\_gex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/94ad74/32.png) [@gex\_gex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gex_gex)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/27 "2003-01-17T14:13:37Z")
I think that the reason fans are so critical of bands is that often the fans or the artists themselves seek to be elevated to the stature of “artists,” rather than the manufacturers of product. Hence, when someone does something distinctly non-artistic, such as selling their art to a commercial, or recording a song that seems to be seeking a larger audience at the expense of quality, the fans feel they have lowered themselves from the status of “artists,” to “producer of product.” Selling out. This also explains why no-one complains about Britney selling out when she does commercials for Pepsi. She was never considered an artist in the first place and isn’t held to the standards of one by her fans. Of course, some bands say that they aren’t producing art, but this is just as much about the fans’ perception as the artists’. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/28 "2003-01-17T14:19:04Z")
**Moderator’s Note:** Moving to Cafe Society. ---
**Author:** ![broccoli](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@broccoli](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/broccoli)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/29 "2003-01-17T14:45:39Z")
**Iggy** screwed us all when he sold a song about Heroin addiction to the commercial market! Now I hear _Lust for Life_ on cruise ship commercials, SUV commercials, etc etc… Next thing ya know it’ll be in a Disney commercial “Here at Disney, we love to thrill you” I can’t tell if Tim Armstong (formerly from **Op Ivy** now of **Rancid** fame) has sold out yet or not. He’s teamed up with Travis from **Blink182/Box Car Racer** and some other dude as a side project (called the **Transplants** ), but all they do is radio friendly hip hop punk type stuff. Very catchy, very annoying. ---
**Author:** ![everton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecb155/32.png) [@everton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/everton)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/30 "2003-01-17T16:03:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by New & Improved Scott \* > This all sounds like you are expecting pop stars to have some sort of moral standing. These are people who wanted to be rich and famous. They sell music as a career. > > So when Microsoft bought “Start me up”, it was just another sale for Mick. But many of the musicians mentioned in this thread do seem to take a moral stance in their lyrics and in interviews. The Stones wouldn’t necessarily fall into that category, but many more do. In other cases people here have been criticising artists who seemed to begin their careers creating art but wind up churning out any old crap that their record companies think will sell, even if that means alienating their original audience. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dinsdale \* > How can you complain about **Sting** selling out when he has always sucked, with the exception that the Police had a couple of tunes that were somewhat catchy until you got tired of them. > At least **The Who** has the excuse that its members started dying and going infirm. But the people who have been criticising Sting here haven’t done that because they object to his change of musical direction, it’s because they think he’s been a hypocrite on political/ideological grounds. Roger Daltrey created a fuss over here when he started doing ads for American Express. It didn’t seem to be the thing for a renegade Mod to do. ---
**Author:** ![Wumpus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8c91f0/32.png) [@Wumpus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wumpus)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/31 "2003-01-17T16:35:59Z")
The idea that 60s rock artists were altruists untainted by the love of money is a load of malarky. The Who did Coke ads in the '60s. Jefferson Airplane did Levis commercials. And the Electric Prunes did Vox amp commercials. (The horror, the horror!) ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/32 "2003-01-17T16:46:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by broccoli! \* > **Iggy screwed us all when he sold a song about Heroin addiction to the commercial market! Now I hear _Lust for Life_ on cruise ship commercials, SUV commercials, etc etc… Next thing ya know it’ll be in a Disney commercial "Here at Disney, we love to thrill you"** I’m willing to cut Iggy slack because, unlike many musicians who sell their songs to commercials, he’s actually been homeless. And it’s not like his albums have sold very well for the past few decades, and he doesn’t get much radio airplay either. If he weren’t willing to accept money from the car companies, cruise lines, and shoe manufacturers then he might well end up in the poorhouse. Or David Bowie’s guesthouse. One or the other. And personally, it gives me a big laugh every time I see that big boat cruising along to “Lust for Life”. I go “Bwa ha ha ha ha ha!” every time. ---
**Author:** ![everton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecb155/32.png) [@everton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/everton)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/33 "2003-01-17T16:54:41Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Wumpus_ > The idea that 60s rock artists were altruists untainted by the love of money is a load of malarky. The Who did Coke ads in the '60s. Jefferson Airplane did Levis commercials. And the Electric Prunes did Vox amp commercials. (The horror, the horror!) The public image of Coca Cola and Levis jeans in the '60s was that they were products likely to be bought by fans of the bands advertising them. Presumably the Electric Prunes used Vox equipment (or could plausably claim to be doing so)? Surely there’s a big difference between those examples and an outspoken environmentalist advertising sports cars or an icon of rebellious youth advertising a financial services company? The fans may well have been deluding themselves all along, but you’re going to need better examples than those to back up the allegation. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2003, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/34 "2003-01-17T17:34:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zoggie \* > \*\*Not moral…we just want them to have the same outlook as us. Is that so much to ask? \*\* Who’s “us?” “We” don’t all HAVE the same outlook. I see no problem with Townshend’s Army commercial, someone else does. ---
**Author:** ![Bad\_Hat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f0a364/32.png) [@Bad\_Hat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bad_Hat)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2003, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/35 "2003-01-18T13:26:41Z")
Microsoft only asked the stones for “start me up” after R.E.M. turned down a $12mill offer. memory fails as to what song they wanted, but i’ve always appreciated REMs balls on the issue. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2003, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/36 "2003-01-18T18:51:07Z")
Twelve Million Dollars? For that much I’d … Bill Gates! Well, maybe not. But it is a lot of money to this poor boy. ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2003, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/37 "2003-01-19T01:03:21Z")
—But if she does an ad for Silicone Boob Hut ™, that’s a problem.— But, she IS doing an ad for Silicone Boob Hut ™. It’s just a full-time gig. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2003, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/38 "2003-01-19T01:19:24Z")
By the way, **PunditLisa** , how on earth did you come to dig up this two-year- old thread? Getting a little tired of that Neil Diamond xmas cd? 🆒 Peace, mangeorge ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2003, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/39 "2003-01-21T02:38:18Z")
You know, mangeorge, I don’t know _how_ I managed to dig it up! Sorry about the carbon dated thread, folks! ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2003, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305/40 "2003-01-21T06:39:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by everton \* > \*\*Roger Daltrey created a fuss over here when he started doing ads for American Express. It didn’t seem to be the thing for a renegade Mod to do. \*\* Have none of these folks ever heard of _The Who Sell Out_? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-artists-go-bad/48305.md?page=3)