# When Good TV Shows Go Bad **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 27, 2000, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967 "2000-08-27T21:34:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![jab1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee7513/32.png) [@jab1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jab1)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2000, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/1 "2000-08-27T21:34:45Z")
I stole this idea from the website [http://www.jumptheshark.com](http://www.jumptheshark.com). (In the show _Happy Days_, Fonzie jumps a shark on water skis. In the author’s opinion, that’s when the show went downhill.) 1. _Roseanne:_ When she won the lottery. 2. _M_A_S_H:\* When Trapper John left and Henry Blake died. (Remember, both events happened at about the same time.) One could also argue it went downhill when Alan Alda became Creative Consultant. That was when the show became preachy and dramatic instead of satirical and humorous. 3. _Batman:_ When they brought in Batgirl. 4. _Star Trek:_ “Spock’s Brain.” 'Nuff said! 5. _Lois and Clark:_ A: When they got rid of Lex Luthor and brought in silly villains. B: When Clark proposed. (It was like a roller coaster: It when downhill once, and then downhill AGAIN.) 6. _Dallas:_ Bobby wasn’t really dead, it was all a dream. 7. _Law and Order:_ While still a GREAT show, they should have put up with Michael Moriarty, a great, unappreciated actor. 8. _Babylon 5:_ A: Getting rid of Captain Sinclair and bringing in Bruce Boxleitner (Sheridan). B: Letting Ivanova go. 9. _Seinfeld:_ The whole last season was a mistake. They shoulda quit while they wuz ahead. 10. _Murphy Brown:_ When she had her baby. Ditto for _Mad About You_. Your turn. ---
**Author:** ![Gilligan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Gilligan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gilligan)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2000, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/2 "2000-08-27T21:57:09Z")
_Pinky and the Brain_ - When they added Elmyra, they ruined one of the best shows on. _Melrose Place_ - Killing off Sydney, the show just wasn’t any fun after that. ---
**Author:** ![lucie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ed8c4c/32.png) [@lucie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lucie)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2000, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/3 "2000-08-27T22:25:31Z")
Northern Exposure - when Joel went native and was replaced by that doctor from LA. Saturday Night Live - when the entire original cast left. A few bright spots here and there afterwards, but mostly it became dull and unfunny. Brother Cadfael - when Sean Pertwee left and the important character of Hugh was then played by a series of actors each more annoying than the next. Red Dwarf - Went into the crapper in season 7 and stayed there. No slow decline, just a sudden descent that was exacerbated by Rimmer leaving. ---
**Author:** ![Tzel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Tzel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tzel)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2000, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/4 "2000-08-27T22:48:32Z")
Seinfeld: The last episode was an embarrassment. Truly, truly awful. And this coming from a huge Seinfeld fan. SNL: Is there a law that this show must go on forever? It’s not funny anymore. Let it die. Flintstones: The Great Gazoo Talk Soup: I never watched the Kinnear days, but I was a big Henson fan, and it’s hard to imagine someone that could do that job better than he. I don’t watch the show anymore. It was only good because of John Henson ---
**Author:** ![Snooooopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2000, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/5 "2000-08-27T23:01:26Z")
“Night Court” – when Christine got involved with the Italian cop. “The Smurfs” – when they started time travel. I would have to disagree with the observation about “Law and Order.” I don’t think I would have liked a decade’s worth of Benjamin Stone’s rather preachy style. Jack McCoy’s sometimes questionable pragmatism adds spice. “Law and Order” has done a remarkable job of replacing good people with good people, although that string may be about to come to an end. I have read that Dianne Wiest is going to replace Steven Hill. I don’t really like Wiest that much. ---
**Author:** ![divemaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/divemaster/32/78_2.png) [@divemaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/divemaster)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/6 "2000-08-28T00:53:34Z")
One of the few shows I enjoyed in the 80s (early 90s?) was _L.A. Law_. Great writing, interesting characters, and gripping drama. However, it became unwatchable (and I mean an absolutely, totally, worst-show-on-television, cringe-inducing, pile of dreck). The downhill slide I think started when the Rosalind Shays character fell to her death in the elevator shaft. The last few seasons had stupid new characters, Arnie Becker looking like the wild man of Borneo, and other plot lines that best stay repressed. I’m so bitter because it was one of the very very few TV shows I have actually enjoyed. ---
**Author:** ![CnoteChris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/278dde/32.png) [@CnoteChris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CnoteChris)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/7 "2000-08-28T01:07:03Z")
TZEL- I have to take issue with you on your Talk Soup comment. Greg Kinnear was far more funny then Henson ever was. Henson had some big shoes to fill and he didn’t even come close. My two cents: Cheers: When Diane left. The sexual tension between her and Sammy was gone. The Ms. Howe character was truly boring to watch. Getting pregnant by Sam? Please… All In The Family: When Mike and Gloria left. And especially when Archie took over the bar. Can you say, ‘milking the money machine?’. Dallas: When Miss Ellie left and was replaced by a mannequin. ---
**Author:** ![MysterEcks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f475e1/32.png) [@MysterEcks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MysterEcks)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/8 "2000-08-28T01:36:35Z")
**jab1** said: > [@](#): > > 1. Babylon 5: A: Getting rid of Captain Sinclair and bringing in Bruce Boxleitner (Sheridan). B: Letting Ivanova go. I have to disagree with (A)–Michael O’Hare didn’t impress me, and I thought Bruce Boxleitner was a major improvement. I’ll agree with (B). In fact, I’ll go further–given the way the fourth year ended (because they weren’t sure they’d be renewed for another season), the entire fifth year should have been canned. I think \*Magnum, P.I.\*was another show which ran one year too long. The last season (the eighth, I believe) was mainly an exercise in destroying Magnum’s life–it was more depressing than anything else. They should have just let Magnum die at the end of year seven. ---
**Author:** ![ThisYearsGirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@ThisYearsGirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThisYearsGirl)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/9 "2000-08-28T01:38:28Z")
ER–When Carter grew the beard. Or when they had that live episode. ---
**Author:** ![timmar68](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/97f17d/32.png) [@timmar68](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/timmar68)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/10 "2000-08-28T01:53:35Z")
Designing Women: when Delta Burke left. ---
**Author:** ![DoctorJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctorj/32/2904_2.png) [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/11 "2000-08-28T01:58:05Z")
I think “The X-Files” visibly jumped in that episode with Garry Shandling and Tea Leoni last season. I can’t believe they decided to go on for another season. Dr. J ---
**Author:** ![EnochF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/779978/32.png) [@EnochF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EnochF)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/12 "2000-08-28T02:00:42Z")
Millennium: The major cop-out at the beginning of Season 3. X-Files: The Season 6 cliffhanger. (This one has got to get the award for falling the furthest in quality.) Sliders: Depends. Got worse when Arturo left and was replaced with Kari “does nudity for scale” Wuhrer. Got worse when Wade left. Became pretty much unwatchable when Jerry O’Connell got replaced by that 48th percentile twerp whose name I can’t remember. Quantum Leap: Oh, shut up, it was good for a while. The “Sam leaps into a chimpanzee” episode in Season 4. Voyager: The episode after the pilot. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/13 "2000-08-28T02:40:35Z")
Roseanne went bad WAAAAY before the lottery part. That’s the main reason I no longer watch network tv. A show starts out good, then goes bad quickly. Even the Simpsons seems dull this year! ---
**Author:** ![DRY](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a87d85/32.png) [@DRY](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DRY)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/14 "2000-08-28T03:56:56Z")
I’ll cut Dallas some slack over the “it was all a dream” season, because they were pretty much between a rock and a hard place as far as what to do about Patrick Duffy: the show was suffering without him, and in bringing him back, you either make him an imposter/evil twin, or do what they did. As to Dallas, the last few seasons or so really slipped and were pretty unwatchable: I can’t really pinpoint the cause, but it things really went downhill when Victoria Principal, Linda Gray, and Barbara Bel Geddes left the show. More input: Star Trek (the original): Most of the third season. Particular episodes: And the Children Shall Lead (starring Melvin Belli as the friendly lawyer), The Omega Glory, the previously mentioned Spock’s Brain, the episode with the “Medusan ambassador” (that thing in the box)–episode was so dull the name isn’t coming to me. And most of all, the infamous The Way to Eden, which really and truly deserves it’s own special place in hell. Twin Peaks: All the episodes after the Laura Palmer thread finally played out. Dynasty was at least OK until that horrible wedding in Moldavia thread: cliffhanger shows everyone being shot at and lying motionless before the scene fades out. They ended up killing off TWO MINOR CHARACTERS. (I never watched the show again) ---
**Author:** ![HelloKitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecccb3/32.png) [@HelloKitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HelloKitty)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/15 "2000-08-28T03:58:37Z")
The Tonight Show – When Johnny Carson left and Jay Leno took over. ER - Maybe it’s because George Clooney left, but it’s just not the same. The new characters are very bland. Cheers - I would have to say this is another show that went 1 or even 2 seasons too long. (I never could stand Diane…the show was much funnier without her.) Frasier - The first 2 seasons were excellent, but the Niles/Daphne thing got really tiresome, and we have known since “Cheers” how annoying Frasier can be! The Practice - It’s getting a little too preachy and why is Eugene in only about 1 scene per show? I liked it better when they were the “little law firm that could.” Seems like this happens every time a David E. Kelly show wins an Emmy. ---
**Author:** ![Snooooopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/16 "2000-08-28T06:26:53Z")
I don’t think “Sliders” was ever as good as it was during the first season. The concepts behind the slides were really thoughtful – what if intelligent people were treated like we treat professional athletes, what if no one had discovered penicillin, what if Einstein had derailed the invention of the atomic bomb – during the first season. After that, “Sliders” sort of turned into a generic action/adventure show. ---
**Author:** ![JavaMaven1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/cab0a1/32.png) [@JavaMaven1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JavaMaven1)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/17 "2000-08-28T08:19:34Z")
I have to agree with SNL: it had 2 major peaks, when it first went on the air, and then again in the late 80’s/early 90’s with Mike Meyers, Phil Hartman & Chris Farley. It hasn’t been the same since. They need to finally bury that show. Letterman hasn’t been funny in about 3 years now. That’s another guy who needs to retire. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/18 "2000-08-28T09:11:50Z")
I think Law and Order is still good. It’s the ‘Special Victims Unit’ that sucks bilge water. And I think SNL with Will Farrel, Cheri Oteri, and Daryll Hammonds was much funnier than the original. Now, the late 80’s SNL, that sucked \*ss. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/19 "2000-08-28T13:42:40Z")
I´m surprised no-one has mentioned this - “Moonlighting”, when David and Maddie slept together. The episode itself was great, but the series just clunked to a stop right after it. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Zero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@Saint\_Zero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Zero)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2000, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967/20 "2000-08-28T14:03:55Z")
The problem with season three of star trek: TOS was the fact that they’d suffered massive budget cuts, and couldn’t afford outside sets. So most of the season had to be set in the ship. Did slide downhill, tho. MASH: I like Winchester TONS better than Burns. They’d just exausted all the possibilities in Burns, and everyone knew it. Linville was smart to want out. Now, let’s talk Dr Who. I am a massive Who fan. Can recite trivia for days. BUT… What is it with Doctor #7? Sylvester McCoy is interesting, but… not that interesting. I mean, granted Pertwee, Tom Baker, and Davidson were hard to live up to, but still. Colin Baker sucked. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-good-tv-shows-go-bad/30967.md?page=2)