# When (if ever) was McCain a "maverick"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 8, 2009, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083 "2009-10-08T18:16:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/1 "2009-10-08T18:16:54Z")
Because he certainly doesn’t seem to be one now; almost every voting decision he’s made in the past several years seems to have followed the Republican party line to a T (counterexamples welcome). It’s just you’d think he’d want to cement his legacy, put some distance between himself and the GOP’s base position on a number of issues, but there he is now staunchily defending any and all Republican viewpoints. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/2 "2009-10-08T18:22:41Z")
The most often-cited examples would be the McCain-Feingold campaign finance law, which is largely despised by conservatives, and his work with the “Gang of 14,” which resolved a dispute over Bush’s nominees to the federal bench while avoiding the infamous “nuclear option,” which would have seen Republicans changing the laws on filibustering judicial nominees. I’ll see if I can find a good estimate of how his voting record stacks up to other Republicans and Democrats in terms of party loyalty. It’s true that he is definitely a Republican and not one of the most moderate Senators, but on certain issues - often high-profile issues - he was willing to cross party lines. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/3 "2009-10-08T18:58:18Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I’ll see if I can find a good estimate of how his voting record stacks up to other Republicans and Democrats in terms of party loyalty. It’s true that he is definitely a Republican and not one of the most moderate Senators, but on certain issues - often high-profile issues - he was willing to cross party lines. This [article](http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/is_it_true_john_mccain_voted_with.html)might help. I cite it rather than the CQ database because I don’t have an account with them. > [@](#): > > According to Congressional Quarterly’s Voting Studies, in 2007 McCain voted in line with the president’s position 95 percent of the time – the highest percentage rate for McCain since Bush took office – and voted in line with his party 90 percent of the time. However, McCain’s support of President Bush’s position has been as low as 77 percent (in 2005), and his support for his party’s position has been as low as 67 percent (2001). That 67% seems kind of “mavericky”. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/4 "2009-10-08T18:59:18Z")
According to the Washington Post, [McCain has voted with the majority of Republican Senators on 91.6 percent of bills since January](http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/111/senate/party-voters/), which is definitely above average for Republicans and is also higher than average for all Senators. [In the 110th Congress](http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/110/senate/party-voters/), when he was running for president and missed a lot of votes, he voted with the GOP majority 88.2 percent of the time, which was again above average for Republicans and for the full Senate. [In the 109th Congress](http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/109/senate/party-voters/), he voted with the Republicans 79.4 percent of the time, which was far below average. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/5 "2009-10-08T20:40:46Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > … while avoiding the infamous “nuclear option,” which would have seen Republicans changing the laws on filibustering judicial nominees. I wonder how much the Repubs appreciate his help in blocking the “nuclear option” now… ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/6 "2009-10-08T21:36:33Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > I wonder how much the Repubs appreciate his help in blocking the “nuclear option” now… Probably they appreciate it a great deal. In any case they haven’t needed it, and there are ways to block and stall nominations without filibustering. Other than Sotomayor, the Senate has only approved one of Obama’s nominees to the federal bench. I think six other nominees are waiting around, and one (David Hamilton) will probably be the subject of a big fight sooner or later. ---
**Author:** ![UncleFred](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f0a364/32.png) [@UncleFred](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleFred)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/7 "2009-10-08T21:51:37Z")
Working on partial memories here but… Prior to 2004 McCain tried to position himself for a run at the Presidency by taking a somewhat contrarian approach that would gain him more votes ‘across the aisle’ of the public. However after 2004 he realized the only way he stood a chance of getting the (Republican) nomination was to fully embrace the conservative agenda. So; pre-2004 = Maverick, post-2004 = not ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/8 "2009-10-08T22:01:04Z")
> [@UncleFred](#): > > Working on partial memories here but.. > > Prior to 2004 McCain tried to position himself for a run at the Presidency by taking a somewhat contrarian approach that would gain him more votes ‘across the aisle’ of the public. However after 2004 he realized the only way he stood a chance of getting the (Republican) nomination was to fully embrace the conservative agenda. > > So; pre-2004 = Maverick, post-2004 = not Yeah, he seemed like he got burned in the 2004 nomination process and “got Religion” (literally as well as figuratively) in 2008. Not much of a maverick in that last election. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/9 "2009-10-08T22:08:43Z")
Yea, it was sorta bizarre watching him pick fights with Bush when Bush was poplular, and then watch him attach himself progressively more tightly to the President as Bush’s popularity dropped. Which I guess is kinda mavericky in and of itself, or meta-mavericky, or something. I predict he’ll do the same thing with the Obama admisitration, stay advisarial till the press starts to ignore him, and then find some things he can cross the aisle on to reclaim his Maverick hat. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/10 "2009-10-08T22:16:34Z")
He can’t run for the presidency again (well, he can, but he won’t), so with luck we’ll get the “old” McCain back. Or the “young” McCain back, depending on how one looks at it. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/11 "2009-10-08T22:18:21Z")
> [@UncleFred](#): > > Prior to 2004 McCain tried to position himself for a run at the Presidency by taking a somewhat contrarian approach that would gain him more votes ‘across the aisle’ of the public. However after 2004 he realized the only way he stood a chance of getting the (Republican) nomination was to fully embrace the conservative agenda. The important year here is 2000, not 2004. In 2000 McCain did the whole “Straight Talk Express” thing, which made him a media favorite for years - remember he’s been a guest on The Daily Show about 12 or 13 times, which is probably more than any other politician - and won the New Hampshire primary, but couldn’t beat George W. Bush, who had the support of religious right voters and the GOP establishment. I think it’s been established as a fact by now that McCain and John Kerry talked about a joint ticket in 2004. The talks didn’t go very far, and each camp said the other came up with it, but I think it was briefly considered. It didn’t happen. McCain endorsed Bush and campaign for him, although he supposedly didn’t like Bush at all. The infamous McCain-Bush hug took place on on August 30, 2004. When McCain got ready to run for the president in the 2008 election, he knew he had to win more support from conservatives. He struggled with this for a long time and several other people took over as frontrunners before failing. McCain successfully tacked right and won the nomination, but lost most of his independent cred in the process. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2009, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/12 "2009-10-08T22:32:13Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Yeah, he seemed like he got burned in the 2004 nomination process and “got Religion” (literally as well as figuratively) in 2008. Not much of a maverick in that last election. Oops. 2000 nomination process. ---
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2009, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/13 "2009-10-09T06:05:02Z")
He broke ties with his party on torture, immigration, climate change, and campaign finance reform. Then during the 2008 election he rolled back his position on torture and immigration. Which played into Obama’s playbook of painting McCain as Bush 2.0. McCain could have done a lot better if he took more moderate positions. There seems to be some irrational hesitancy in the GOP to break ties with their base. Oh well, a few more losses in future elections and they will figure it out. It seem that McCain is back to being a [moderate conservative](http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1009/27832.html) now: > [@](#): > > Fresh from a humbling loss in last year’s presidential election, Sen. John McCain is working behind-the-scenes to reshape the Republican Party in his own center-right image. > > McCain is recruiting candidates, raising money for them and hitting the campaign trail on their behalf. He’s taken sides in competitive House, Senate and gubernatorial primaries and introduced his preferred candidates to his top donors. ---
**Author:** ![TheMadHun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@TheMadHun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheMadHun)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2009, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/14 "2009-10-10T18:59:12Z")
He’s a maverick these days by giving Obama credit when credit is due, not automatically taking the anti- stance the other Republican spokesfolk go for these days. Maybe he’s looking for an ambassadorship. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2009, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/15 "2009-10-10T19:59:14Z")
He also voted against the Bush tax cuts of 2001 and preferred a more progressive approach with middle class tax cuts and a long term balanced budget. No idea why the guy who once opposed the Bush tax cuts and wrote McCain/Feingold then turned around 8 years later and picked Palin and generally refused to stand up for Obama when his audience members were making death threats. Maybe he realized 2008 was his last chance as president, and he was desperate. If so, then I hope he goes back to being more moderate in 2010 or so after he calms down. ---
**Author:** ![Frostillicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Frostillicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frostillicus)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2009, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/16 "2009-10-11T02:50:55Z")
When he picked that spunky maverick Sarah Palin (R- Death Panels) as his running mate after a 15 minute phone conversation. You can’t get much more mavericky that that. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2009, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/17 "2009-10-11T16:07:20Z")
Yes, McCain was genuinely a maverick in 2000 but then became progressively more orthodox especially when he fought for the 2008 ticket. Once he had sewn up the nomination he could have moved back to the center and regained some of his maverick mojo but he apparently believed that he could beat Obama by following a Atwater/Rove style personal-attack campaign. It didn’t work and has left him a diminished figure. I bet he wishes he had fought a more unorthodox campaign. He probably wouldn’t have won but would have maintained his high reputation among beltway pundits and would have been a bigger force after the election. He would have also enjoyed himself more. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2009, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/18 "2009-10-11T19:24:35Z")
[This May 2002 Washington Monthly article](http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0205.green.html) gives a pretty good sense of how McCain was viewed by many on the left side of the divide at the time: > [@](#): > > As a war hero who’s hawkish on foreign policy, he more than matches Bush on the military front. As a reform-minded foe of corporate welfare, Big Tobacco, and the Republican right, he is peerless. McCain is Bush’s most vociferous critic, voted against the president’s tax cut, forced his hand on campaign finance reform, and federalized airport security in the face of White House opposition. He has co-sponsored numerous bills with Democrats–many of them in the presidential-aspirant class–requiring background checks at gun shows (Lieberman), a patients’ bill of rights (Edwards), better fuel-efficiency standards in cars and SUVs (Kerry), and expanded national service programs (Bayh). He is even drafting a bill with Lieberman to reduce greenhouse gasses and mitigate global warming. The end of McCain the Maverick was pretty abrupt, really: a few weeks after the conversations between McCain’s staff and Kerry’s over a Kerry-McCain ticket ended in May 2004, McCain endorsed Bush, and with only occasional exceptions, pretty much attached himself to Bush like a barnacle for the next few years. But there was one other important consideration: the one aspect of McCain’s record during his maverick phase that went over especially poorly with people on the left was his unabashed hawkishness. But before the run-up to the Iraq War, that aspect of McCain’s politics wasn’t regarded as particularly important. Once it became acceptable to use our military might as a solution to whatever bothered us overseas, it mattered a great deal. ---
**Author:** ![Alex\_Dubinsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dbc845/32.png) [@Alex\_Dubinsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alex_Dubinsky)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2009, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-if-ever-was-mccain-a-maverick/513083/19 "2009-10-13T03:07:10Z")
You to have congratulate McCain for winning the 2008 ticket, and I think that justifies all the despicable ass-kissing he’d done. But for the love of god, once he had it it should have been “haha, fuck you guys now!” I would have voted for him. Many others would too. But nooo. He dug worse into the Bush conspiracy than imaginable. Who was Palin but a stooge, chosen by the powers to take over the country once McCain fell ill or got assassinated or whatnot. Sigh. His greed for Presidential title overpowered him. Btw, what first earned my respect for him was his vocal criticism of Bush’s handling of the Iraq campaign. (And for the record, that’s where the evil lied. Not the invasion, the [purposefully] fucked-up reconstruction.) Also, his Daily Show appearances :-[