# When is it OK to hate Republicans? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 19, 2005, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895 "2005-02-19T16:20:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![milroyj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@milroyj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/milroyj)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/41 "2005-02-20T05:04:25Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > Anyone who sent money to George W. Bush helped enable his gay bashing, war mongering, civil rights destroying policies to continue. Just to pick one example from your stupid post, please cite a single civil right that has been **destroyed** by the President’s policies. ---
**Author:** ![Nobody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@Nobody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nobody)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/42 "2005-02-20T05:08:45Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > Being a member of the Republican party is tacit acceptance of their policies. If you believe their policies are vile, shouldn’t it be ok to hate those who enable their policies to come to fruition? Anyone who sent money to George W. Bush helped enable his gay bashing, war mongering, civil rights destroying policies to continue. > > I’m willing to make exceptions for those rare Republicans who voted against George Bush in the primaries and abstained from supporting GWB (whether it be voting for a third party in protest or even just not voting), but other than that I’m not willing to give them a pass. Problem is, you’ve got Conservative Republicans, Moderate Republicans, and Liberal Republicans. You also have NeoConservatives and Paleoconservatives. You have conservatives who whole heartedly agree with Bush and his ideals, those who agree with some, and those who agree with none. You have some who voted for him because they totally agree with what he stands for, those who voted for him because, although they don’t agree with him about everything, think that he’s a better than the alternative, and there are those who disagree with him too much to vote for him. Also, there are those who don’t interpret things the same way you do. For example, you see an anti gay marriage stance as gay bashing. Many don’t. You see Bush as war mongering, many don’t. You see civil rights being destroyed, many don’t. In short, things are too complicated to make a blanket statement “Republicans are evil” ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/43 "2005-02-20T06:03:29Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > Being a member of the Republican party is tacit acceptance of their policies. If you believe their policies are vile, shouldn’t it be ok to hate those who enable their policies to come to fruition? I think this is too sweeping an indictment, **Blalron**. The Republican Party isn’t a monolithic entity. There are wings and factions with the party, just as there are within any political party. There are gradations of interpretation, McCain to Cheney, so to speak. I don’t fault Republicans who vote their ticket, even though they may not like every plank in the platform du jour. They might well dislike some aspects but think/feel overall the Republican stance suits their beliefs more closely overall than the Democrats’. I’ll tell what I’d hate: if socially moderate/fiscally conservative Republicans _didn’t_ hang tough to make their influence known within the party. The current administration isn’t the final sum and finest exemplar of conservative principles. Some of my good Pubbie buddies are thoroughly disgusted with what Bush/Rove have done in the name of conservatism. That doesn’t make them Democrats, Libertarians or Independents. Maybe they’re unwilling to abandon their convictions just because this very time-limited administration has made a hash of things. Babies and bathwater, doncha know. It’s not a political toggle switch: lock-step adoration of Bush/Rove or ooops! off to another party. I’m not a political party animal because neither major party seems to stand for much beyond a ruthless thirst for power. I think I’m more effective as an outsider, but hey, different stokes and all that. But IMO it’s disgraceful to hold people in contempt, much less _hate_ them, by slapping lasting labels on them under temporary circumstances. Veb ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/44 "2005-02-20T06:11:34Z")
> [@Master Control](#): > > Problem is, you’ve got Conservative Republicans, Moderate Republicans, and Liberal Republicans. You also have NeoConservatives and Paleoconservatives… Are there no group properties at all? If not, why is there a republican party? From what source do these damn fool policies spring? Is there a mystery here that is beyond the mind of man to unravel? I think not. The party as a whole must be judged based on it’s collective properties, it’s actions, not the individual diversity of its members. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/45 "2005-02-20T06:40:53Z")
“When is it OK to hate Republicans?” The same time it’s OK to hate any other group of people – when they willfully, intentionally, and deliberately choose to do evil… ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/46 "2005-02-20T07:29:57Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > “When is it OK to hate Republicans?” > > The same time it’s OK to hate any other group of people – when they willfully, intentionally, and deliberately choose to do evil… That’s howlingly asinine, even by your questionable standards, **rjung**. Do you honestly claim that anyone who charts a different course than yours, by whatever extended label–Republican, Libertarian, Not-Liberal-Enough-for-TRUE-Democrat–therefore acts ‘willfully, intentionally and deliberately’ toward evil? Anybody who finds honor in conservatism should burn down the whole damned kitchen because one enchilada’s rotten? Let me get this straight. The entire spectrum of conviction can and _should be_ perilously narrowed down to a razor’s edge defintion of rightness. Careful now, because that razor can and _should_ cut both ways, lest you’re just as willing to impute horrible, base motives to Democrats/Liberals who don’t bow exactly to the party line. Oh wait. There isn’t one at the moment. They’re still scrambling, playing catch-up in the spin game. Sheesh, fanatics of any stripe make themselves ridiculous. Veb ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/47 "2005-02-20T07:37:29Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > “When is it OK to hate Republicans?” > > The same time it’s OK to hate any other group of people – when they willfully, intentionally, and deliberately choose to do evil… If you’re gonna quip, rj, at least make it _funny._ Sanctimony is so… Republican? ---
**Author:** ![Nobody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@Nobody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nobody)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/48 "2005-02-20T07:48:37Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > Are there no group properties at all? If not, why is there a republican party? From what source do these damn fool policies spring? Is there a mystery here that is beyond the mind of man to unravel? I think not. The party as a whole must be judged based on it’s collective properties, it’s actions, not the individual diversity of its members. Probably the most broadly accepted Republican properties are: Lower taxes. Smaller government. Less reliance on the government. The private sector is better at most things than the government. A general aversion for socialized medicine. Or just about any other aspect of the economy. Pro school vouchers. Other things like abortion, gay marriage or separation of church and state are more descriptive of where you stand in regard to being a liberal, moderate, or conservative. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/49 "2005-02-20T08:20:15Z")
> [@PatriotX](#): > > … > > > [@Sevastopol](#): > > > > Was that the dude who said he was voting Red because even they wouldn’t be able to keep a lid on all the scandal brewing? There’d be some people of integrity in the party or exective who’d let out the Valerie Palme etc facts. > > Yeah. What of it? Waiting… ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/50 "2005-02-20T08:50:31Z")
> [@Master Control](#): > > Probably the most broadly accepted Republican properties are: > Lower taxes. > Smaller government. > Less reliance on the government. > The private sector is better at most things than the government. > A general aversion for socialized medicine. Or just about any other aspect of the economy. > Pro school vouchers. > Other things like abortion, gay marriage or separation of church and state are more descriptive of where you stand in regard to being a liberal, moderate, or conservative. I disagree. Those are issues-du-jour, not core conservative principles. _Conservative_ principles are (in my understanding: - A lean, closely monitored governmental authority, limited to determining issues of fundamental principles. - Fiscal accountablity. No mandates imposed without realistic reckoning of how they will be paid. No convient buck-passing. If something’s for overall benefit of the commonweal, federal tax dollars will be channeled back to meet them. - Severely limited governmental interest or interference in the lives of citizens: religion, language, sex, manner of life, etc. - A very careful, cautious approach to ‘nanny-stating’, because control means…control, for good or ill: the proverbial slippery slope. And it varies wildly over time, depending who owns the purse strings. It goes way beyond BushII. He isn’t a conservative. He’s a dangerously misguided twit. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 9:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/51 "2005-02-20T09:10:10Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > I disagree. Those are issues-du-jour, not core conservative principles. He didn’t say they were conservative principals. He said they were _Republican_ principals. I’d guess there’s a (mostly) economic spectrum with Democrats on the left and Republicans on the right (though by the standard of most nations, both parties are quite right-wing) and a (mostly) social spectrum with liberals on the left and conservatives on the right. When combined, these make a two-dimensional grid and it is possible for an American to be in any of the four quadrants. I expect there are numerous Americans who like lower taxes _and_ abortion rights, as well as Americans who like private gun ownership _and_ universal health coverage. It’s not an entirely apt analogy, but I’m a Canadian who has consistently voted with the Conservative Party for economic issues, though I disagree with them on most everything else. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/52 "2005-02-20T09:41:11Z")
> [@master control](#): > > Probably the most broadly accepted Republican properties are: Preventative war Torture Larger government Intrusions on individual rights Global warming Party power over competent leadership ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/53 "2005-02-20T13:45:27Z")
> [@Sevastopol](#): > > Waiting… Don’t just wait, keep making a stink. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/54 "2005-02-20T17:03:49Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > There are gradations of interpretation, McCain to Cheney, so to speak. This is a good example of how it is rather more monolithic than you might think. McCain is supposed to be a man of integrity, who says and does the right thing regardless of his party. He was also a man who had his head handed to him in South Carolina in 2000 by the lies of Bush/Rove. Yet, when the time came, he stood shoulder to shoulder with Bush in 2004, against a fellow veteran no less. He helped to keep the current president in power, a man who perhaps best exemplifies all that there is that is hateful (and worthy of hate, too) about Republicans. Party Before Country Republicans. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/55 "2005-02-20T17:16:18Z")
> [@milroyj](#): > > Just to pick one example from your stupid post, please cite a single civil right that has been **destroyed** by the President’s policies. I said his _policies_ are to destroy them. I didn’t say he’s destroyed them _yet_. Still doesn’t excuse them. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/56 "2005-02-20T17:24:58Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > I think this is too sweeping an indictment, **Blalron**. The Republican Party isn’t a monolithic entity. There are wings and factions with the party, just as there are within any political party. There are gradations of interpretation, McCain to Cheney, so to speak. I’m sorry, but at a certain point collective responsibility kicks in. Being a member of a political party isn’t the same as being a certain gender or being in an ethnic group. It is completely voluntary. At a certain point, policies are so vile that it doesn’t let you off the hook that you disagree with them but vote the ticket anyway because you think your tax cut is more important. ---
**Author:** ![Nobody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@Nobody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nobody)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/57 "2005-02-20T19:06:13Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > I disagree. Those are issues-du-jour, not core conservative principles. > > _Conservative_ principles are (in my understanding: > > - A lean, closely monitored governmental authority, limited to determining issues of fundamental principles. > - Fiscal accountablity. No mandates imposed without realistic reckoning of how they will be paid. No convient buck-passing. If something’s for overall benefit of the commonweal, federal tax dollars will be channeled back to meet them. > - Severely limited governmental interest or interference in the lives of citizens: religion, language, sex, manner of life, etc. > - A very careful, cautious approach to ‘nanny-stating’, because control means…control, for good or ill: the proverbial slippery slope. And it varies wildly over time, depending who owns the purse strings. That sounds more like Republican attributes than Conservative attributes. Conservativsm and Liberaism usually deal more with moral issues, although financially you can describe yourself as Conservative, Moderate, or Liberal, that’s more about how much money you spend, as oppsed to what you spend it on. > [@](#): > > It goes way beyond BushII. He isn’t a conservative. He’s a dangerously misguided twit. I don’t really see Bush as much of a Conservative or a Republican, which is why I didn’t vote for him. Well, that, and a bunch of other traits about him that have nothing to do with politics. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/58 "2005-02-20T19:28:46Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > I’m sorry, but at a certain point collective responsibility kicks in. Being a member of a political party isn’t the same as being a certain gender or being in an ethnic group. It is completely voluntary. Kind of like being an American. I’ve been over this before with **Evil Captor** [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=4876869#post4876869](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=4876869#post4876869) Besides, how’d’ya think that the neocons were able to ‘reform’ the GOP? It sure wasn’t from without. Maybe more people _should_ be Republicans. If you don’t like something, change it. Think about it. One Country. One Party. GOP. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/59 "2005-02-20T21:01:24Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > I said his _policies_ are to destroy them. I didn’t say he’s destroyed them _yet_. Still doesn’t excuse them. Well, in addition to wanting to destroy civil rights, you can zing him for being inefficient. I mean, he’s into his second term and not one right destroyed? Talk about lazy! ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2005, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895/60 "2005-02-20T23:17:03Z")
I’m sure the OP didn’t mean it to sound this way - but when the question " When is it OK to hate Republicans?" is answered “It’s not OK”, you expect the response to be “Awwwwww, Mom!!!” 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-ok-to-hate-republicans/290895.md?page=4)