# When is it okay for a minister to tell their assistant to buy sex toys? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 29, 2017, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134 "2017-10-29T12:25:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2017, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134/61 "2017-11-09T13:02:27Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Seems it was two friends who went shopping: That’s his story. Which is exactly the story that would be told by: a) Someone who, in a friendly way, innocently invited his junior employee to buy sex toys for his wife and mistress, in that way that friends do all the time OR; b) Someone who is bullshitting to keep his job. Caroline Edmondson’s story is that she felt that as his employee she had no choice but to go along with it, and that she felt humiliated by the whole incident. Again, exactly the story which would be told by a) Someone who - for reasons entirely unrelated either to that incident or being publicly called “sugartits” by her boss - is now no longer friends with the person they were happy to buy sex toys for OR; b) Someone who felt forced to run a humiliating errand by her boss Declaring the matter closed just because Garnier has stuck with his denial seems a bit premature. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2017, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134/62 "2017-11-10T02:43:51Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Seems it was two friends who went shopping: > > Fuck you. Thankfully the media hounding didn’t lead to another suicide. [Moderating] Saying “fuck you” to other posters is a violation of the Pit language rules. Please avoid this in the future. No warning issued. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2017, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134/63 "2017-11-10T02:56:28Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Seems it was two friends who went shopping: > > Fuck you. Thankfully the media hounding didn’t lead to another suicide. Literally all you are doing is repeating what the accused has said, while disregarding what the accuser said. And now you’re using the suicide of a different case that **Quartz** himself was also upset about as a way to attack **Quartz**. Multiple people point out that you are wrong, besides **Quartz**. You can’t have them all on ignore, so you’re just ignoring everyone else to attack him. You are coming off as the guy deserving that epithet. You’re just using a bad story either way to attack a poster you don’t like. Yeah, I’m tut-tutting you. Enjoy. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2017, 8:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134/64 "2017-11-10T08:41:46Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Yeah, I’m tut-tutting you. Enjoy. It’s not my place to _help_ folks read the runes but this is what happened. The story was out there for a week, more nuance was added - they were former friends, now not friends, it was several years ago. No one else came forward, there was no pattern of behaviour. It fell into the - until now - ill-defined category of a MP/researcher,/friend, employer/employee category, which will now be changed due to wider issues. There was no sexual harassment. He accepted waiting outside a shop was inappropriate.The matter is closed. Hence the statement by the MP. On this occasion, the Internet will have to look elsewhere for outrage. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2017, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134/65 "2017-11-10T09:24:39Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > It’s not my place to _help_ folks read the runes but this is what happened. Maybe, maybe not. Maybe what she said happened is what happened. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2017, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134/66 "2017-11-10T09:30:37Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > It’s not my place to _help_ folks read the runes but this is what happened. The story was out there for a week, more nuance was added - they were former friends, now not friends, it was several years ago. No one else came forward, there was no pattern of behaviour. It fell into the - until now - ill-defined category of a MP/researcher,/friend, employer/employee category, which will now be changed due to wider issues. There was no sexual harassment. He accepted waiting outside a shop was inappropriate.The matter is closed. Hence the statement by the MP. > > On this occasion, the Internet will have to look elsewhere for outrage. It’s not up to the MP accused of harassment to unilaterally declare the matter closed. Garnier’s statement now adds no new information than his statement when the story broke. We know he agrees it happened. We know he insists that it was all a bit of fun. We know he doesn’t consider it harassment. So what? We also know that Caroline Edmondson didn’t think it was fun. We know she felt humiliated. We know she did consider it harassment. Who’s the better judge of how Caroline Edmondson felt? A) Caroline Edmondson or B) literally anyone else? Why would you prefer Garnier’s assessment of her mental state over hers? I’m perfectly prepared to believe that Garnier genuinely \*thought \*that calling his female employee “sugartits” in front of his colleagues was just a joke. And that the whole vibrator thing was a merry lark between pals. He thought it was funny, so he assumed the employee dependent solely on his approval for her future career thought it was funny too when she went along with it. That’s not nuance to the story of harassment. That _is_ harassment. Blithe disregard for other people’s feelings, and wilful ignorance of the power dynamics at play leading to a powerful man making a subordinate woman feel humiliated at his sexualised jokes and never even noticing. Oh, but if he says it was all fine, then I guess it’s all fine. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2017, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134/67 "2017-11-10T11:19:53Z")
Well, enjoy your outrage. When you’re ready, the rest of the world is up the road. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2017, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134/68 "2017-11-10T12:20:39Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Well, enjoy your outrage. When you’re ready, the rest of the world is up the road. “Outrage” I’m trying to imagine a situation in which I felt like pointing out that something obviously bad was in fact bad, then didn’t because I was worried you might suggest I was over-reacting. …Nope. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2017, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134/69 "2017-11-12T00:49:01Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > Why didn’t the guy just go in and buy them himself? It is lame for a teenage guy to make his girlfriend buy condoms instead of doing it himself, it is worse for an adult. Because if the papers ever got wind of the fact that he’d been in a sex shop buying a vibrator, he’d loose his job. If there’s been a breakdown of personal relations with his assistant, that suggests he’s a dick and should loose his job. But in the normal course of things, parlimentary/ministerial assistants do cover for their boss: it’s an implicit if not explicit part of the job. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-is-it-okay-for-a-minister-to-tell-their-assistant-to-buy-sex-toys/800134.md?page=3)