# When people insist on using lower-case letters for their names. . . **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 6, 2011, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386 "2011-09-06T14:28:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![FlyingDragonFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c89c15/32.png) [@FlyingDragonFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingDragonFan)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/61 "2011-09-06T21:28:51Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > “John” and “john” are not two different names, in the same way that “John” and “JOHN” are not two different names. This is the way I look at it. Capital ‘B’ and lowercase ‘b’ are not two different letters, they’re different forms of the same letter used for different purposes. One of those purposes is to denote a proper name, and that’s the way I prefer to do things, other people’s pretensions notwithstanding. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/62 "2011-09-06T21:31:24Z")
> [@chiroptera](#): > > In the OP’s scenario, I wonder if her colleague has actually had her name legally changed? If she is a professional and ever published, she certainly should do so if she wants to be taken seriously. > > Interesting point…I wonder if it is indeed possible to legally specify case in a name change? I would think so - in my MacBain/Macbain scenario, or for someone who has apostophes or other characters as part of their proper name, those details make a difference. Legally speaking, I doubt it makes a difference. I can’t think of any situation in which minor differences in capitalization or punctuation would have any significance so far as the law is concerned. ---
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/63 "2011-09-06T21:34:54Z")
> [@Keeve](#): > > Ditto. > > I recall the conversation when [Prince](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_%28musician%29) changed his name to that [unpronouncable symbol](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_Symbol_Album). Personally, I was pretty put off by this change, and couldn’t figure out whether he even had a right to do such a wacky thing. Then I saw an article where someone had written that there is no human right more basic than the right to decide how other people will refer to you. That logic was so appealing that it totally won me over. I disagree with that so strongly. Basic rights, in fact, stop short of requiring others to change their behavior. If I insist that you refer cease using pronouns when referring to me, and rather use my full title of Lord Hufflebat Snufflebumps Artichoke, Esquire, do you really feel like my rights are violated if you fail to do so? ---
**Author:** ![Otara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a88e4f/32.png) [@Otara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otara)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/64 "2011-09-06T21:42:47Z")
Worrying about things like this always seem like looking for reasons to be grumpy to me. T Otara ---
**Author:** ![chiroptera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df705f/32.png) [@chiroptera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chiroptera)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/65 "2011-09-06T21:51:33Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Legally speaking, I doubt it makes a difference. I can’t think of any situation in which minor differences in capitalization or punctuation would have any significance so far as the law is concerned. So Q’sha is no different, legally, than Qsha? Not arguing, just asking. Because I am here to tell you that there are lots of names with punctuation marks and odd capitalizations in them out there, especially where I live. I have no idea whether Michigan includes apostrophes or other punctuation marks in ID cards or drivers licenses. Seems to me if your given legal name is Q’sha, that’s how it ought to be spelled on state documents. I just looked at my driver’s license and my name (aka MacBain) is indeed spelled all in caps. I just checked Michigan’s offender registry ([OTIS](http://mdocweb.state.mi.us/OTIS2/otis2.aspx)) but it’s down right now; I was curious how they handled unconventional capitalization and punctuation marks. ---
**Author:** ![Shalmanese](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shalmanese](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shalmanese)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/66 "2011-09-06T22:08:01Z")
> [@Tiger\_Lily](#): > > A colleague of mine in academics spells, and asks all others to spell, her first and last names using lower-case letters. An example is bell hooks, or mary sullivan. As a traditionally schooled academic myself, I face great dissonance when typing her name. My tendency is to “properly” capitalize her name, but of course that is probably seen as oppositional. > > My question: When one chooses to disregard convention such as in this case, must others oblige by also disregarding convention? > > In the meantime I will continue to type her name out with first and last names capitalized. “Mary Sullivan, you are no bell hooks!” :rolleyes: If the academic you’re talking about is danah boyd, she has an explanation [on her own website](http://www.danah.org/name.html) ---
**Author:** ![Sierra\_Indigo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f0a364/32.png) [@Sierra\_Indigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sierra_Indigo)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/67 "2011-09-06T22:13:17Z")
She should be strangled just for using pale grey text on a white background, let alone for the sheer pretentious wankery of that screed. ---
**Author:** ![rogerbox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/76d3ee/32.png) [@rogerbox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rogerbox)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/68 "2011-09-06T22:36:24Z")
Haha, [danah.org](http://danah.org)… ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/69 "2011-09-06T23:02:04Z")
Not spelling someone’s name the way they want it spelled on purpose is dickish. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/70 "2011-09-06T23:03:57Z")
Agreed. Capitalization of the initial letter of a personal name is not a matter of spelling. ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/71 "2011-09-06T23:08:02Z")
OK - I am also someone who only writes/signs my name in small case letters. Why? Back when I was about 12, I wrote an essay and didn’t capitalize the word “god”. My teacher said, “You capitalize your own name, so you should capitalize god’s name as well.” Even at age 12, I was stubborn and from that day on, have never capitalized my name. I don’t get upset when people write me and capitalize it, but on not one single legal document have I ever signed my name with a capital letter. Once, this actually saved me a lot of grief. Someone had stolen a check from me and tried to do what they thought was a good, sloppy signature. However, they capitalized my name and the bank immediately stopped the payment on the check, as they noticed I had never done that! At any rate - my personal quirk, and so be it. But again, if you write me a letter (or a large check for lots of money), I will not be pissed off one iota if you use capital letters. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/72 "2011-09-06T23:09:47Z")
Another good comparison is the question of whether to put a comma before “Jr.” or “III” and the like. Whether the comma goes in is a matter of style for the publication to choose and is done consistently by the publication regardless of the personal preferences of the people whose names they are. If you’re a publication that does not put a comma before “Jr.,” then there are no commas before “Jr.” in the publication. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/73 "2011-09-06T23:11:48Z")
Fine, then. Writing someone’s name with characters other than the specific ones they have chosen to be their name is dickish. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/74 "2011-09-06T23:43:17Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > I’d use all caps for their names, just to rub it in. . . . yes, but make the initial letters lowercase. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/75 "2011-09-06T23:50:16Z")
I get irked when people can’t be bothered to spell my name correctly. It has two capital letters and the first and ‘middle’ name is ‘smooshed’ together. It’s not a hard name or a crazy name or even spelled awkwardly. People are just lazy. (And I am talking about people who have known me for years.) Also, if someone’s name is Cindy Lou, I won’t call her ‘Cindy’ anymore than I’d call a guy named Bob “Bah”. I try to be sensitive to other people’s identities when it comes to their names because your name is the most personal thing you have. Spelling? If it makes your coworker (is she a writer?) happy, whatever. You can seethe quietly, but it’s probably not worth the slight to capitalize her name. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/76 "2011-09-06T23:50:22Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > People get to decide what to call themselves. Just like Liz can decide that she should be called “Liz” not “Elizabeth” or “Beth” or “Lizzie,” john can decide that his name is “john” and not “John.” > > If they’re overly obnoxious in correcting a mistake, the problem is the obnoxiousness, not the request itself. But it’s their name. Excellent rule of thumb. I’ll try to spell, pronounce, type, or otherwise represent people’s names the way they want them. Even the argument that ALL names are capitalized in English runs aground on certain shores, like “ffoulkes.” ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2011, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/77 "2011-09-06T23:55:56Z")
Both my forename and surname have equally common variants. If my name were John Clark (which it isn’t), I would prefer to be known as that, not Jon Clarke. This would remain equally true had I changed my name to that, or were I to change it to Johann Claerke, or whatever. Similarly, if I choose to be referred to as john clark, that is my choice, and if I’ve made it clear that’s how I wish to be referred to, it would be disrespectful not to. As for the use of Jr, III, or whatever, if the person who’s name it is has a preference, it should be respected, and should override any style guides. That said, I wouldn’t get upset about someone using the wrong name in an informal setting, and I think people who get overly bothered about it should perhaps chill out slightly. If someone deliberately uses the wrong name, though, they are an arsehole. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/78 "2011-09-07T00:15:05Z")
> [@Dingbang](#): > > You know, if they legally changed their name to lowercase, I think I would go along with it because that IS their name then. (I don’t know that’s even possible to specify case in your legal name. Probably isn’t, for the same reason I’m arguing this point.) It would be weird and still wrong to me, but then it wouldn’t be just a pretentious affectation, it would be their actual name. You don’t think that telling someone what they can and cannot capitalize in their name is…pretentious? ---
**Author:** ![rogerbox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/76d3ee/32.png) [@rogerbox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rogerbox)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/79 "2011-09-07T00:32:02Z")
My name should be pronounced while inhaling instead of exhaling. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_I\_Am](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e495f1/32.png) [@Sam\_I\_Am](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_I_Am)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2011, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386/80 "2011-09-07T00:59:11Z")
> [@shiftless](#): > > I forgot to hit the shift key when I typed my username the first time. I don’t remember insisting that everyone else must type my username the exact same way. If I did, it would be for the attention. So shiftless was shiftless. That actually made me LOL [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-people-insist-on-using-lower-case-letters-for-their-names/595386.md?page=5)