# When should one stop using 'SIR' for older men? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 2, 2003, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313 "2003-01-02T23:56:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2003, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/21 "2003-01-03T23:03:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Birefringence \* > \*\* We just hired a kid who is 21, and always calls me sir when he addresses me. I didn’t mind the first few times he did it, but he has been with us 2 months and still calls me sir. > > \*\* What??? The NERVE of him!! Calling you a respectful title??? The little punk! More seriously, the PROPER thing to do is call a superior or older person “Sir” or “Mr. So-and-so” until he tells you to call him something else. In this case, an employee has been calling his boss “Sir” for months, and it appears that nobody’s told him to stop it. So, why would anyone expect him to stop on his own? If you dislike being called “Sir,” tell him that. Tell him that “Sir” is a little too stiff and formal, and you’d rather be called “Mr. Smith.” Or if you prefer, tell him “We’re pretty informal around here- why don’t you just call me Joe.” But if you don’t want to be called “Sir,” it’s up to YOU to set the kid straight. Don’t wait for him to get tired of being courteous. ---
**Author:** ![jujuju](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7993a0/32.png) [@jujuju](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jujuju)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/22 "2003-01-04T04:18:31Z")
i will refer to males with a ‘yes sir’ when answering a question/request. but i do it in a a sexy, submissive voice. most men do not expect this, but it’s fun. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/23 "2003-01-04T05:36:56Z")
I use “sir” and “ma’am” 1. if the person is unknown to me and older than I am, 2. if I am requesting something of the person, 3. if “doctor” isn’t more appropriate. My Quaker friends in college tried to get me to stop this, but I mostly grew up in Maryland, so this is what pops out of my mouth at these times. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/24 "2003-01-04T05:45:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Birefringence \* > \*\*I was raised in the conservative north east and must say: I said sir to everyone I met who - like **Pottery** - was entitled to some modicum of respect. > \*\* I was raised up north too, but age factors into it; they need to be older than I am to prompt me to use the title. I wouldn’t call someone “sir” if he wasn’t at least in his 30s. The same thing goes for ma’am. ---
**Author:** ![Urban\_Ranger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Urban\_Ranger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urban_Ranger)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/25 "2003-01-04T06:17:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by astorian \* > More seriously, the PROPER thing to do is call a superior or older person “Sir” or “Mr. So-and-so” until he tells you to call him something else. What? I much prefer the gender-natural term “buckwheat.” 😃 Seriously, why is an older person so respectable that you need to call him “sir?” “Mr. so-and-so” I can understand, but “sir?” ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/26 "2003-01-04T06:59:08Z")
You call him “Sir” until he says, “Please–call me Mr Birefringence.” ---
**Author:** ![gex\_gex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/94ad74/32.png) [@gex\_gex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gex_gex)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/27 "2003-01-04T12:42:59Z")
I don’t call anyone “Sir”, customers (I work for a dept store) or not. They’re not any better than I, no matter how many years older they are. The sooner we get rid of such antiquated notions, the better. It’s simply another class system waiting to be torn down. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/28 "2003-01-04T13:39:18Z")
_Seriously, why is an older person so respectable that you need to call him “sir?” “Mr. so-and-so” I can understand, but “sir?”_ Not sure why you seem to think “sir” and “Mr. X” indicate different levels of respect. Anyway, “sir” is noticeably shorter, often a plus in the flow of discourse. _I don’t call anyone “Sir”…They’re not any better than I, no matter how many years older they are._ It’s a title of respect, not of superiority. Who pissed in your Cheerios? ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/29 "2003-01-04T15:52:07Z")
I don’t work with customers, so usually “sir” and “ma’am” are what I used when I’m trying to get someone’s attention – like when the customer ahead of you in the grocery store leaves one of his or her bags, I’ll say “Sir (or ma’am), you forgot your bag.” People don’t always turn around for that, leaving me calling plaintively, “Sir? Sir?..” I generally call people “gentlemen” or “ladies” when greeting two or more – it used to crack up the kids next door (other half of the twin) when I’d come up on the porch and say “Gentlemen, how are you today?” as I let myself into my front door. I also do it in other situations when I’m entering a room of people I know well – when I go back to say good morning to my two female underlings, I’ll say “Ladies, how are you this lovely morning?” It’s playful but respectful. ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/30 "2003-01-05T01:01:00Z")
I’m excessively polite. On the job, for quite a while, I called all my customers Sir or Ma’am, as in, “Excuse me, sir, would you move your feet so I can sweep there?” Then one day, the bartender/waitresses at my favorite watering hole told me, through clenched teeth, that they were not old enough to be called “ma’am.” Furthermore, they would both smack me if I persisted. That was enlightening, and I’ve changed my ways. ---
**Author:** ![irishgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/8edcca/32.png) [@irishgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/irishgirl)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/31 "2003-01-05T02:00:30Z")
when do you stop calling someone sir? when you know their name. when they ask you to. if they have a title to use instead; Father, Dr, Professor, Reverend etc. and only use madam with ladies over 60. the rest of us don’t like it. ---
**Author:** ![leroy\_the\_mule](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6a8cbe/32.png) [@leroy\_the\_mule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leroy_the_mule)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/32 "2003-01-05T04:36:02Z")
When he is passed out on the floor of the bar with a big pee stain in his pants.😃 ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Cool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecb155/32.png) [@Joe\_Cool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Cool)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/33 "2003-01-05T08:15:30Z")
Personally, I generally refer to any adult male that I don’t know as ‘sir’, and moreso when it’s somebody older than me. And I don’t really expect to stop. It’s just a matter of respect. ---
**Author:** ![mdf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dbc845/32.png) [@mdf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mdf)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/34 "2003-01-05T08:35:13Z")
If you are female, 20-25, and said older man is attempting to pick you up, then you should stop immediately. God, that’s depressing… 😃 -mdf ---
**Author:** ![burundi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3ec8ea/32.png) [@burundi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burundi)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2003, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/35 "2003-01-06T16:28:05Z")
**Urban Ranger** , **gex gex** , I don’t think “sir” or “ma’am” is a sign of superiority. It’s a sign of respect and until you prove otherwise, I’m going to assume that you’re worthy of my respect. Besides, if I don’t know your name, what am I supposed to call you? Likewise, I don’t freak out if someone calls me “ma’am.” They’re just trying to be polite. ---
**Author:** ![loinburger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/db5fbb/32.png) [@loinburger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/loinburger)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2003, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/36 "2003-01-06T20:18:56Z")
I use “Sir” or “Ma’am” if I don’t know somebody’s name, unless they’re _very_ young (I usually address 5-year-olds as “shorty” or 2-year-olds as “baldy”), or not particularly deserving of respect (in which case I’ll use “Hey you” or some variant). For people who are approximately my age in casual settings (I’m 22) I’ll usually drop the subject (or is it an object?) and just use “Hey” or “Yo” or “`Sup” or whatever. If there were a better informal system of address then I’d use it, but English only seems to have “formal,” “rude,” and “ad hoc” systems of address. My difficulty is always in figuring out whether I should address an older person whose name I know as “Mr/Ms/Dr/Prof So-And-So” or whether I should use their first name. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2003, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313/37 "2003-01-06T20:29:28Z")
When they work for you. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-one-stop-using-sir-for-older-men/146313.md?page=1)