# When should Republicans start setting themselves up as the anti-Trump **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [May 30, 2024, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275 "2024-05-30T13:46:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/21 "2024-05-30T14:46:09Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > Neither would be in office without some help from Democratic voters. Isn’t that the goal of a moderate? I mean look at the thread on Biden and the OMG if he doesn’t pick up anti-Trump Pubs then his re-election is doomed!!! ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/22 "2024-05-30T14:47:40Z")
You have to have a moderate electorate to elect a moderate candidate. That’s not the norm in most of this country. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/23 "2024-05-30T14:54:07Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > But those were also the Obama years, which was the beginning of the steep part of their descent. Not at all. Republicans did the same thing after George H. W. Bush lost the presidency to Clinton. They stopped talking about Bush, but didn’t outright reject him. Hell, their next president was Bush’s son. Republicans don’t learn from their failures because they can’t ever admit that they were failures. No matter how many elections they lose, or policies fail, they’ll cling to anyone who tells them that they were right all along. I’m not saying Democrats don’t do the same thing. Republican failures have been more catastrophic, so their refusal to acknowledge them is more glaring. ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/24 "2024-05-30T15:09:13Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Republicans did the same thing after George H. W. Bush lost the presidency to Clinton. They stopped talking about Bush, but didn’t outright reject him. Hell, their next president was Bush’s son But on the Normal-to-wackjob spectrum was HW positioned such that he should have been rejected? If you were to show that spectrum with HW, W, and Trump I don’t think that Trump would be anywhere near the Bushes, even acknowledging how bad Bush jr was in particular. ---
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/25 "2024-05-30T15:11:59Z")
The number of actual Republicans who voted for Haley in the meaningless primary that won’t turn around and vote for Trump is statistically nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/26 "2024-05-30T15:14:08Z")
> [@velomont](#): > > But on the Normal-to-wackjob spectrum was HW positioned such that he should have been rejected? He raised taxes. In Republican circles, that’s equivalent to calling yourself Napoleon. ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/27 "2024-05-30T15:19:54Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > He raised taxes. In Republican circles, that’s equivalent to calling yourself Napoleon Ok, that makes sense. I’m Canadian so from my POV I didn’t consider that. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/28 "2024-05-30T15:23:31Z")
At the absolute latest June 2015 when he said Mexicans were rapists. In practice it will only happen when Trump and the MAGA movement becomes a threat to their jobs and access to political powers. Which will happen when there is an overwhelming, up and down ballot, electoral disaster for the GOP and they handily lose the presidency and Congress in a landslide. I sincerely hope this happens in November (though it’s more hope than expectation). If it does happen though, oh boy, get ready for a rewriting of history that would embarrass Josef Stalin. “Trump, who’s that? MAGA? Never heard of it. Sounds like a lame stream media scare story.” ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/29 "2024-05-30T15:24:30Z")
We shouldn’t be confusing; Moderate Republican with Moderate Republican. 'Cause they ain’t the same thing! ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/30 "2024-05-30T15:30:56Z")
> [@Chingon](#): > > The number of actual Republicans who voted for Haley in the meaningless primary that won’t turn around and vote for Trump is statistically nothing. We’re talking about will vs want. Yes, they’re _willing_ to vote for the crazy candidate when that’s the only option, but supporting Haley shows they _want_ a less-crazy candidate. That’s the best we can expect from anyone still voting in the Republican primaries. Anyone not willing to vote for the crazy candidate has already jumped ship. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/31 "2024-05-30T16:01:26Z")
> [@Chingon](#): > > The number of actual Republicans who voted for Haley in the meaningless primary that won’t turn around and vote for Trump is **statistically nothing**. Neither of us can support our opinions with hard facts, but I disagree here. Not a statistically _large_ portion, no, but Trump needs only to flake off a small percentage of support in the right states. If Trump only gets 95% of the registered-GOP Haley primary voters, that’s roughly ~0.75% - 1.00% of the Republican vote he’s losing. That’s more than enough to matter. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/32 "2024-05-30T17:53:23Z")
The GOP has spent the past 44 years, since Reagan won the nomination in 1980, moving further to the right (and lately, further off the deep end). I’ll believe they’ll return to some semblance of sanity - as in, being conservative but in the same universe as the rest of us with respect to what they acknowledge as **fact** - when it happens. I really think the best approach for sane Republicans would be the formation of a new party - not with the goal of winning on their own, but being able to throw their weight around in a coherent manner. If such an organization existed now, they could support Biden in the general election, support the saner of the primary candidates in GOP primaries, support not-insane Republican Congressional candidates in the general election, and support Dems against insane GOP Congressional candidates. If they represented 5% of the electorate, they’d have some serious power. But they don’t have much of any clout as part of the GOP. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/33 "2024-05-30T18:13:21Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Believe it or not, there is a faction of the Republican Party that does not believe in MAGA, believe the Constitution should run the country and not The Bible™, that newcomers are human beings, &c. But many are afraid to speak out because they get cancelled by the loonies. That have next to no power at this point, and are as relevant to their cause as the Log Cabin Republicans. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/34 "2024-05-30T18:52:27Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > I really think the best approach for sane Republicans would be the formation of a new party - not with the goal of winning on their own, but being able to throw their weight around in a coherent manner. Which might work if Congress allowed proportional representation in the House and states apportioned their EVs proportionally. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/35 "2024-05-30T19:10:48Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Which might work if Congress allowed proportional representation in the House and states apportioned their EVs proportionally. My big take-away from the last 10-20 years or so is that the US electoral system is fundamentally broken, and things won’t really get better until they fix that. That fixing it will be almost impossible is just the cherry on top. You need to re-write the Constitution to create a uniform framework for elections throughout the US, both at state and federal levels, and ban things like gerrymandering, and hugely improve ballot access. “Let everyone vote” has to become more than a platitude, it needs to be the fundamental basis for elections. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/36 "2024-05-30T19:19:42Z")
You can’t rewrite the Constitution without major Congressional support…and that isn’t happening. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/37 "2024-05-30T19:26:36Z")
It can if enough states demand an Article V convention. I’m not saying it actually has to be held because in the past the real threat of one was enough to get Congress to act. IIRC, the 17th Amendment came about this way. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/38 "2024-05-30T19:33:44Z")
Didn’t we already do this? It’s only been 5 months since the last post in this thread: > [@Is now the time for moderate Republicans to try to retake control of the party?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-now-the-time-for-moderate-republicans-to-try-to-retake-control-of-the-party/969704/210): > > We’re all yelling (largely in unison) but once again I’ll bring up that the chance for ‘moderates’ to claim the party was probably sometime in the immediate post-Regan years. That was when the Religious Right became the tail that started to Wag the Dog. As it grew ever more dominant, then they could have realized they were becoming welded to that specific ideology rather than any semblance of a “conservative” political platform. And each election, a new, more reactionary faction would be adde… Anyway, my feelings are largely unchanged from the linked post. The Republicans had been losing on their prior strategies, and kept bringing in “new blood” to boost their numbers - the ever increasing number of crazed individuals that were _if anything_ only united in hate of various other segments of society. And now said groups are the majority and the Republican party as it was, at least pre-Religious Right/Reagan Era is largely dead. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/39 "2024-05-30T19:34:41Z")
The 17th Amendment was heavily popular and supported by Congress. They led the drive and because of this it passed easily. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2024, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275/40 "2024-05-30T19:36:49Z")
I felt this question was different in that this one is about Republican leaders willing to stick their neck out to possibly get their head lopped off. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-should-republicans-start-setting-themselves-up-as-the-anti-trump/1002275.md?page=3)