# When was the last time a British citizen needed a visa to travel to the US? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 20, 2012, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530 "2012-05-20T18:41:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2012, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/21 "2012-05-22T21:06:20Z")
Could be worse. I was talking to an Egyptian tourist guide who was guiding a US family during the outbreak of the revolution. It was an interesting time and they later invited him to come visit them in the USA. Despite the invitation, the place to stay, and having sufficient funds - a youngish, single man erratically employed on a contract basis (thanks to subsequent downturn in tourist volume) will NEVER convince the US that he is not a risk to simply remain in the country illegally. IIRC the backlog for some visas over there is months, if not years, and most are denied. For starters, they wanted proof of a bank account, something not a lot of Egyptians have… ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/22 "2012-05-23T03:38:57Z")
> [@The\_Great\_Cornholio](#): > > I applied for a visa in 1988 when I went to the US on holiday, it took about 2 weeks to come through, once I’d sent the passport off. > > When I went in 2000 (on a new passport), no visa, I’m pretty sure I just filled in the form on the plane, all 6 lines of it. > > Last October when I visited (on, yet again, a new passport) I had to _pay_ and fill out the ESTA form online beforehand. I know of a couple of people who have been turned back from US Immigration but not sure if they had the ESTA form or, like me in 1990, just rocked up with my passport ( “I’m British donchaknow, let me in, you bloody colonial. Britannia Rules The Waves etc etc”) > > Since 9/11 things have changed so much, only a fool thinks that getting into America, especially by air, is going to be a breeze like it once was. > > Oh, and US Immigration officers must take lessons in being rude, ignorant and aggressive…until they stamp you through, when they instantly turn into humans again, give you a huge smile and say “Welcome to the US, enjoy your stay”. It really throws you, one minute they are talking to you like you are shit on their shoe, next minute you are a welcome guest. I guess the people who rise to the bait when they are being arseholes are not the kind of people they want wandering around the US. Britannia may rule the waves, but the US waives the rules… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/23 "2012-05-23T06:08:27Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > Could be worse. > > I was talking to an Egyptian tourist guide who was guiding a US family during the outbreak of the revolution. It was an interesting time and they later invited him to come visit them in the USA. Despite the invitation, the place to stay, and having sufficient funds - a youngish, single man erratically employed on a contract basis (thanks to subsequent downturn in tourist volume) will NEVER convince the US that he is not a risk to simply remain in the country illegally. IIRC the backlog for some visas over there is months, if not years, and most are denied. > > For starters, they wanted proof of a bank account, something not a lot of Egyptians have… I don’t know how many people in the USA are aware that for most of the world getting a tourist visa to the USA is an expensive crap shoot, capricious too as it is totally up to the whims of the official you see. You’re basically under total suspicion, AND this thinking that everyone wants to live in the USA even goes so far as being suspicious of those who don’t. My wife didn’t want to deal with applying for permanent residency, she just wanted to go with me to the USA on a tourist visa. Well they flat out say thats pretty much not going to happen(I’ve seen others say if you have cash to blow you can keep applying for a tourist visa for the spouse of a citizen but don’t get your hopes up) and they say why don’t you just get permanent residency:dubious: Why don’t you want to live in the USA:dubious: Damned if you do, damned if you don’t. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 10:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/24 "2012-05-23T10:04:48Z")
> [@The\_Great\_Cornholio](#): > > Since 9/11 things have changed so much, only a fool thinks that getting into America, especially by air, is going to be a breeze like it once was. > > Oh, and US Immigration officers must take lessons in being rude, ignorant and aggressive…until they stamp you through, when they instantly turn into humans again, give you a huge smile and say “Welcome to the US, enjoy your stay”. It really throws you, one minute they are talking to you like you are shit on their shoe, next minute you are a welcome guest. I guess the people who rise to the bait when they are being arseholes are not the kind of people they want wandering around the US. I recently read (IIRC on one one of the major news sites) that the US tourism industry is suffering because of an international perception that the US doesn’t _want_ people to visit, with the immigration/customs hassles, onerous security, and generally making people feel like they’re being treated as suspected malefactors instead of welcome guests. Personally, I know a number of people who just can’t be bothered with it all and won’t visit the US again, or have been put off by hearing about the hassles from people who have visited and won’t go in the first place, but I’m not really sure why the US is singled out in this respect considering a lot of countries have similarly strict border security controls nowadays. ---
**Author:** ![HazelNutCoffee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@HazelNutCoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HazelNutCoffee)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/25 "2012-05-23T11:16:16Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > Personally, I know a number of people who just can’t be bothered with it all and won’t visit the US again, or have been put off by hearing about the hassles from people who have visited and won’t go in the first place, but I’m not really sure why the US is singled out in this respect considering a lot of countries have similarly strict border security controls nowadays. I’ve actually experienced more hassle trying to get through Heathrow. The last time I visited the US was for a friend’s wedding, and I was fully prepared to produce the wedding invitation as well as answer a long litany of questions as to how I knew the person. All they wanted to see was my return ticket. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Cornholio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ed8c4c/32.png) [@The\_Great\_Cornholio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Cornholio)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2012, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/26 "2012-05-23T12:02:15Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > I’m not really sure why the US is singled out in this respect considering a lot of countries have similarly strict border security controls nowadays. Possibly because some people confuse “The Land of the Free” with “Anyone can go there and do what the hell they like”, and it’s a big surprise to find that when you get to the gates, if you’re not 100% legit, you will find yourself on the next plane home. Videos of the TSA acting like the Gestapo don’t help, but they’ve always been like that IMHO. Like I said above, before being granted entry, they always were nasty and rude and tried to wind you up. They were the law, and fuck you if you didn’t like it, even before 9/11. I was grilled at LAX by a geezer who claimed to know the street I was going to be staying in, with friends, and that there was no family by their name there. What the hell could I say about that? Eighteen years old, first time abroad, hell, he might have been right! Two minutes later, big smile, “Enjoy your vacation sir” and I’m stamped through, shell-shocked. At least these days I know I’m going to be treated like a potential terrorist, from the moment I get to Heathrow, where the security staff come from the same school of fuckwittery as the TSA. So long as you’ve done your homework, know what and who is allowed into the US, aren’t telling lies, and don’t allow yourself to be riled by the first dick you meet in uniform, there’s no more problem getting in than any other country. Getting stressed doesn’t solve things, you just have to take deep breaths, smile, and be civil. It’s well worth that little bit of effort. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2012, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/27 "2012-05-24T12:24:57Z")
> [@The\_Great\_Cornholio](#): > > Possibly because some people confuse “The Land of the Free” with “Anyone can go there and do what the hell they like”, and it’s a big surprise to find that when you get to the gates, if you’re not 100% legit, you will find yourself on the next plane home. > > […] > > So long as you’ve done your homework, know what and who is allowed into the US, aren’t telling lies, and don’t allow yourself to be riled by the first dick you meet in uniform, there’s no more problem getting in than any other country. Getting stressed doesn’t solve things, you just have to take deep breaths, smile, and be civil. It’s well worth that little bit of effort. This is all true, but the point the tourism people were making (not unreasonably, IMHO) is that when a sizeable number of tourists (from friendly countries like Australia, the UK, Canada etc) are made to feel like they’re suspected of some vague but slightly notorious crime simply for coming to US on holiday, they’re going to think maybe somewhere like Thailand or Spain or one of those Caribbean Island Nations would be a better place to go next time. I haven’t been to the US since they introduced the whole Electronic Travel Authority thing, but basically needing special permission to travel to a “Friendly” first-world country is not a good look for your tourism industry (and yes, I know Australia requires Visas for nearly everyone and no, I don’t agree with that either). Even visiting the UK (where they’re rightly concerned about Antipodeans popping over to visit rellies and then sort of forgetting to leave) didn’t require much beyond showing up at Heathrow with a valid passport and a return ticket for a few weeks hence. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2012, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/28 "2012-05-24T12:45:16Z")
> [@The\_Great\_Cornholio](#): > > Possibly because some people confuse “The Land of the Free” with “Anyone can go there and do what the hell they like”, and it’s a big surprise to find that when you get to the gates, if you’re not 100% legit, you will find yourself on the next plane home. Being 100% legit has nothing to do with not being allowed into the country on grounds of being female, single and a foreigner. There may be other countries where a bank branch manager travelling for tourism with over 20 friends of both sexes is considered suspect of “wanting to marry into the country”, but I have never heard of one. And when other countries want someone to get a visa, they call it a visa. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Cornholio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ed8c4c/32.png) [@The\_Great\_Cornholio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Cornholio)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2012, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/29 "2012-05-24T13:22:31Z")
I can’t really understand what you mean there, unless you are that single foreign female who was denied entry. A visa doesn’t mean you will get into any country, it just means you’ve fulfilled the requirements on paper. Anyone can smile and say they are going on holiday to get their visa then turn up at Immigration with their work gear. The officer at the gate will be quite justified in throwing that person on the next plane home, they are not 100% legit, no matter what their visa says. I’ve never heard of anyone turned away from the US for no reason. They might start off saying there’s no reason, but before long you find out about the 20 year old conviction, or the white lie about where they were staying, or the fact they were pissed up and argumentative. Trivial things, yes, but how does the officer know that’s not just the tip of the iceberg. What else have you “forgotten” to declare? Customs officers have enough real work to do to be harrassing people they don’t like the look of, unless that dislike comes from their professional nose for a wrong 'un. Maybe if it’s a quiet day, they are bored, and you are a total arsehole, then you might get bounced out, even out of the UK, for no real reason, but you’d have to be asking for it! All that said, I’m sure it _has_ happened, the innocent traveller denied entry, and I’m sure there’s absolutely nothing anyone can do about it - the officer on duty has the final say. Harsh if you are bounced out, but I still feel there must have been something to mark them out as worthy of more than a few questions. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2012, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/30 "2012-05-24T14:32:39Z")
**The Great Cornholio** is about the most innocent lamb wrt immigration officials that I have met in a while. To the OP. I symphatize. I also need a visa to go pretty much everywhere and yes it can have a real effect on a persons prospects. I lucked out in having an excellent secretary, she took care of everything and I just had to go to the embassy. Otherwise, well I think the sheer volume of bullshit that they expect you to find, notorise and fill in with your application makes you want to say “fuck it, I don’t want to visit that badly.” By “they” I mean the immigration authorities of pretty much every country. ---
**Author:** ![Dervorin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Dervorin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dervorin)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2012, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/31 "2012-05-24T15:57:32Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > **The Great Cornholio** is about the most innocent lamb wrt immigration officials that I have met in a while. > > To the OP. I symphatize. I also need a visa to go pretty much everywhere and yes it can have a real effect on a persons prospects. I lucked out in having an excellent secretary, she took care of everything and I just had to go to the embassy. Otherwise, well I think the sheer volume of bullshit that they expect you to find, notorise and fill in with your application makes you want to say “fuck it, I don’t want to visit that badly.” > > By “they” I mean the immigration authorities of pretty much every country. Hah. Agreed. People who don’t need visas to travel don’t really understand the constant low-level grind that it can be. Not to mention the vaguely uncomfortable scrutiny and sometimes outright hostility of visa officials and border agents. I understand that these people are doing their job, but if a side requirement is to be as obnoxious as possible, they are doing well. Having said that, though, I’ve perfected my strategy. Hand over documents, stand quietly and stare into the distance when they are being scrutinized. Answer any questions immediately, but don’t volunteer any information beyond what’s being asked for. Be polite; act normal. I’ve had to go through border controls so many times in the last few months that it’s become second nature. Also, the last few times I’ve been through UK immigration, it’s been much more friendly. One of them even made jokes. Yes, I know. I was shocked too! ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2012, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/32 "2012-05-24T16:38:24Z")
The difference is that the “moral turpitude” clause allows the customs agents to refuse you entry on a whim. A place like New Zealand, for example has explicit rules - don’t recall exactly, but you are allowed in if it’s something like “5 years since you were released from a sentence of less than 6 months, 10 years since released from sentence of less than 10 years” or something like that. US Customs can ask if you have _arrested_, not _convicted_, and base their decision on that, too. So the time you mouthed off to a police officer, but the charges were dropped the next morning; or the army guy tossed in the brig for the night by the military police - all grounds for refusing you entry. To be fair, land crossings are more complicated. I’ve never been given the third degree in a US airport, but they do ask some interesting questions at the land borders - the latest variation is “have you ever been fingerprinted?” I know of people who have been denied entry to the USA over what seem to be petty and trivial reasons. Getting through China customs, even entering Tibet, was faster and a lot less hassle. Oh, and don’t confuse TSA with border services. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Cornholio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ed8c4c/32.png) [@The\_Great\_Cornholio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Cornholio)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2012, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530/33 "2012-05-25T01:01:08Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > **The Great Cornholio** is about the most innocent lamb wrt immigration officials that I have met in a while. On the contrary, I just don’t give them an excuse to bounce me. When you are an 18 y/o budding rock star, hair down to your arse, having a laugh touring, as I was back in the day (_way_ back) , you learn really quickly that it’s easier to play the game, try to appear like a sensible human being and remember that unless you are in Axl Rose’s league, the decision to let you into a country will be made by one bloke, not very well paid, and how much of an arse you are to him. Once upon a time I had a nice management lady to worry about work permits and visas (after the first visit, when my Mum did it, ha ha), but I was acutely aware that rolling up half-pissed in ripped jeans and an obscene t-shirt made for a longer time in Customs than if I wore a shirt and trousers. Not very rock ‘n’ roll, but then nor is standing in line like a child while they try to work out if the debris in the bottom of your rucksack is drug detritus.(My vice is/was alcohol, so ha!) Ironically, the only problems I have ever had have been coming home to the UK, they used to hover at the entrance to the Green Channel to accost this scruffy oik, laden with guitars. EVERY single time, I got pulled apart as they searched for any sign of drugs, or anomalies in my paperwork for the instruments. I spend lots of my time these days filling out Carnet-de-Passage for trucks full of sound equipment, and my business depends on stuff NOT getting impounded whilst some leisurely C&E chap double checks the validity. Paperwork is a major ball-ache, and costly, but one which isn’t going away anytime soon. It’s some people’s one chance to throw their weight around and act important, and they like to savour it. Whether all of it is absolutely necessary for the good of the country involved, I don’t know, but I make sure all that I need has every i dotted and t crossed. Like Dervorin says “Hand over documents, stand quietly and stare into the distance when they are being scrutinized. Answer any questions immediately, but don’t volunteer any information beyond what’s being asked for. Be polite; act normal.” If you act like a stuck up arsehole, you can guarantee that the Customs man can be a far bigger one than you, and it might just brighten his otherwise boring day by really really screwing up yours. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-was-the-last-time-a-british-citizen-needed-a-visa-to-travel-to-the-us/622530.md?page=1)