# When wasn't this guy well-known? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** reality-or-game-show\ **Created:** [November 14, 2021, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347 "2021-11-14T23:28:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/21 "2021-11-15T01:00:23Z")
I hate when Google shoots my arguments out of the water. > **[KFC beach ad 6-2-1962 - Newspapers.com](https://www.newspapers.com/clip/24823944/kfc-beach-ad-6-2-1962/)** > > Clipping found in Pensacola News Journal in Pensacola, Florida on Jun 2, 1962. KFC beach ad 6-2-1962 So they were using his image by 1963 but I t must not have been widespread enough for most people to recognize him. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/22 "2021-11-15T01:01:54Z")
In addition to the big red bucket sign, all the stores had a big portrait(s) of him on the walls. This too goes back as far as I can remember, but I don’t know how far back that is. My earliest _specific_ recollections about KFC go back to 1969, but I’m sure I was eating KFC since sometime before that. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/23 "2021-11-15T01:08:01Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > My earliest _specific_ recollections about KFC go back to 1969 Same here. We were eating chicken out of the bucket on a ski boat waiting for fireworks on Lake Havasu a few weeks after the first moon landing. I knew who Col. Sanders was but I couldn’t tell you what he looked like at the time. ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/24 "2021-11-15T01:14:12Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > I _think_ I was aware of Kentucky Fried Chicken (and the colonel) in the mid-to-late '60s. I remember the white meat was always dry and chewy. Once you got past the breading, it was disappointing. Agreed. I can definitely remember frequenting Kentucky Fried Chicken in 1967 (San Diego). I’m fairly sure I was aware of it well before then. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/25 "2021-11-15T01:36:57Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > Here’s an old KFC sign. It has the colonel’s name on it but not his image. Dang I’ll bet there aren’t too many of those left. (love old - and way too quickly disappearing - kitschy signs) Totally unrelated to OP but will mention vicarious claim-to-fame anyway of a friend of a friend recounting 70’s mall appearance, with the Man, Himself, sitting alone at a table eating cole slaw with dribbles and drabs of the stuff hanging from his mouth - an image that said extended friend was stuck with, all this time. ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/26 "2021-11-15T01:49:53Z")
I’d say mid-60s was when I was aware of Colonel Sanders, mainly because I was a wee lad and thought his string tie was his actual body. [![](https://loginportal.funnyjunk.com/pictures/Big_e7d030_501555.jpg) ](https://loginportal.funnyjunk.com/pictures/Big_e7d030_501555.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/27 "2021-11-15T01:50:46Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > I _think_ I was aware of Kentucky Fried Chicken (and the colonel) in the mid-to-late '60s. I remember the white meat was always dry and chewy. Once you got past the breading, it was disappointing. Sanders was infamous for going around after he sold the company and complaining how the new owners had ruined the food. As for people not knowing him, it might be because KFC was a much smaller and more regional chain in those days. It had about 600 outlets as opposed to 4000 today. It certainly featured Sanders in its ads: [here’s a pag](https://www.grayflannelsuit.net/blog/retrotisements-early-days-kentucky-fried-chicken)e with multiple ads from the 1950s showing Sanders’ face. What’s My Line was shot in NYC by CBS in Studio 52. I don’t remember one in upstate New York as a kid, and it may be that it just hadn’t reached New York City by 1963. Very few fast food franchises put stores there until much later. Trivia extra: CBS Studio 52 was located at 254 W. 54th St. That’s why a later more famous nightclub was called Studio 54. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/28 "2021-11-15T01:56:14Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > The chain may have been well known, but why would the founder be well known before KFC started using him in advertising? Would you be shocked if a panel didn’t know what Roy Croc looks like? > [@Senegoid](#): > > It’s just that, I personally have no recollection of ever knowing of a time when Colonel Sanders and his picture weren’t associated with KFC. But I can’t really remember how long ago that was. > > (How many people know what Roy Croc looks like, even to this day?) No one knows what Roy Croc looked like. Ray Kroc, however… [https://www.biography.com/.image/t\_share/MTgwMzY3NTg3NTM0NzEwNjM2/gettyimages-82600289.jpg](https://www.biography.com/.image/t_share/MTgwMzY3NTg3NTM0NzEwNjM2/gettyimages-82600289.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/29 "2021-11-15T01:56:50Z")
> [@Guest-starring\_Id](#): > > (love old - and way too quickly disappearing - kitschy signs) Try loving this one! > **Warning! Profoundly offensive by modern sensibilities!** > > [https://images-cdn.auctionmobility.com/is3/auctionmobility-static/IS2U-1-1Z1E6/1-4FND7/164A\_1.JPG](https://images-cdn.auctionmobility.com/is3/auctionmobility-static/IS2U-1-1Z1E6/1-4FND7/164A_1.JPG) ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/30 "2021-11-15T01:59:59Z")
Omg, that is hilarious! I’ll never be able to see that any other way now! ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/31 "2021-11-15T02:02:03Z")
Why would you even post that? Let alone in a thread about KFC? ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/32 "2021-11-15T02:10:54Z")
Cause the guy loves old kitchy stuff? At least I followed the double-click rule, and included a warning. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/33 "2021-11-15T02:11:16Z")
It’s possible that the nature of the panelists made them less aware of the Colonel: - Arlene Francis and her husband, Martin Gabel, were both Broadway actors; Francis was also a radio and TV show host - Dorothy Kilgallen was a columnist for the New York Evening Journal - Bennet Cerf was a publisher and writer They were all New Yorkers, and likely at least somewhat upscale in their social circles and tastes. Especially if KFC didn’t have many (if any) outlets in NYC back then, the four of them might simply have not really known much about the chain, or the founder. I also wonder to what extent KFC was doing network television advertising at that time. The oldest ads for them that I can find with a cursory search on YouTube go back to around 1967, though that is undoubtedly not definitive. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/34 "2021-11-15T02:14:50Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > No one knows what Roy Croc looked like. > Ray Kroc, however… “[… like crocodile, not spelled that way…](https://youtu.be/YuH3taDJkNU)” ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/35 "2021-11-15T02:18:12Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > What’s My Line was shot in NYC by CBS in Studio 52. I don’t remember one in upstate New York as a kid, and it may be that it just hadn’t reached New York City by 1963. Very few fast food franchises put stores there until much later. Definitely hadn’t reached NYCity by 1963. [Here’s a 1970 article from the New Yorker](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1970/02/14/kentucky-fried) saying: > New York City, where the K.F.C. franchising effort has just begun. And I don’t remember one in upstate New York in the 1960’s, either (that is, there may have been some, but not anywhere I usually went to; certainly not by 1963. For fried chicken we went to Nor-Ann’s.) I don’t think I ever heard of KFC until, maybe, the 70’s. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/36 "2021-11-15T02:29:39Z")
[This](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_KFC) is interesting: > By 1956, Sanders had six or eight franchisees, including [Dave Thomas](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dave_Thomas_(businessman)), who eventually founded the [Wendy’s](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wendy%27s) restaurant chain.[[1]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_KFC#cite_note-autogenerated44-1)[[24]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_KFC#cite_note-anbo-24) Thomas developed the rotating red bucket sign, was an early advocate of the [take-out](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Take-out) concept that Harman had pioneered, and introduced a [bookkeeping](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bookkeeping) form that Sanders rolled out across the entire KFC chain ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/37 "2021-11-15T02:33:53Z")
That’s what I was thinking. Those people were not the target audience for this restaurant chain. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/38 "2021-11-15T02:44:06Z")
It’s more than that. They had probably never even seen a franchise or an ad for one. Nothing about KFC had appeared in New York at the time. The simplest explanation for why they didn’t recognize him is that they never had an opportunity to see a store, or look at a bucket, or have an ad run in one of their newspapers. If you asked a New Yorker today what an In-and-Out Burger symbol looked like, they probably would have no idea for the same reason: they’d never seen one, even if they’d heard references to the chain. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/39 "2021-11-15T02:46:31Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > If you asked a New Yorker today what an In-and-Out Burger symbol looked like, they probably would have no idea for the same reason: What is the In-N-Out Burger symbol? The first thing I think of is the two crossed palm trees. ETA: Pic: [![](https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/n-out-palms-view-n-out-burger-restaurant-building-featuring-landscape-criss-cross-palm-trees-located-los-174164862.jpg) ](https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/n-out-palms-view-n-out-burger-restaurant-building-featuring-landscape-criss-cross-palm-trees-located-los-174164862.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![jaycat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jaycat/32/3015_2.png) [@jaycat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jaycat)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2021, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347/40 "2021-11-15T02:48:03Z")
KFC wasn’t sold only at KFC joints. When I was a kid in northern Virginia, you could get KFC at Topps Drive In. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-wasnt-this-guy-well-known/954347.md?page=3)