# When would a minority of people be religious and how would society look like? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 9, 2021, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260 "2021-08-09T00:32:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/81 "2021-08-10T14:33:12Z")
🤷‍♂️ None of those things are gods. The Pew survey I linked earlier showed 22% of self declared atheists hold at least one of the three ‘new age’ beliefs they asked about. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/82 "2021-08-10T15:36:47Z")
Nor can that poll. > [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > Uh… no. Fuck no. Not even. We get this all the time. There are at least as many types of atheists as there are of Christians. Not all hold the same beliefs. But it seems many atheists seem to think their variety is standard. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/83 "2021-08-10T15:38:44Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > As many other people have pointed out, it really is. Maybe some parts of the US are as secular as Western Europe, but there is nothing like the Bible Belt in the UK, for example… actually, maybe Northern Ireland could qualify, but it has a small population and generally not much influence at a national level. The census numbers disagree. That is pretty much all the people, instead of a tiny few in a poll. But again, what is "being religious? ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/84 "2021-08-10T17:29:25Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > The census numbers disagree The census numbers say nothing about how religious people are. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/85 "2021-08-10T17:31:06Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > Uh… no. Fuck no. Not even. Oh absolutely it is possible. Atheism is a statement of acceptance of _one_ proposition only, that a god exists. It tells you nothing about any other beliefs that a person may have. ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/86 "2021-08-10T17:59:21Z")
I’m going by this definition of atheist: > [Atheism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism), in the broadest sense, is an absence of belief in the existence of deities. Less broadly, atheism is a rejection of the belief that any deities exist. In an even narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities. One who has no belief in deities has no reason to believe in ghosts and crystals. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/87 "2021-08-10T18:02:58Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > One who has no belief in deities has no reason to believe in ghosts and crystals. I’m as atheist as can be, reject any believe in the supernatural, take any transcendence or metaphysics for illusions, but how does your statement follow? ETA: do you think there are absolutely no atheists who believe in astrology, the moon’s influence on mood/sleep/planting or whathaveyou? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/88 "2021-08-10T18:43:17Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > One who has no belief in deities has no reason to believe in ghosts and crystals. Sam Harris is unquestionably an atheist. He is also into spirituality. He doesn’t define it in terms of a soul but he gets pretty esoteric with its definition and has often used psychedelic drugs to try to connect with whatever it is he’s trying to describe as spirituality. It doesn’t make a lick of sense to me. But you cannot say that an atheist can’t hold some arguably strange ideas. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/89 "2021-08-10T19:47:26Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > One who has no belief in deities has no reason to believe in ghosts and crystals. Well you certainly can’t draw a causal line between lack of a belief in deities and a belief in ghosts and crystals but, to quote myself… > [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > Atheism is a statement of acceptance of _one_ proposition only, that a god exists. > It tells you nothing about any other beliefs that a person may have. You can have all sorts of wacky beliefs and still be an atheist. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/90 "2021-08-10T20:00:20Z")
I’ve known people who identified as atheists and had all sorts of wacky superstitions. I, personally, think they were more a-orgainzed\_religion than a-theists, but it’s not like there’s a church of Atheism that defines who gets to belong. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/91 "2021-08-10T20:10:35Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > I remember there was a sort of atheist movement with regular meetings - the sister of one of my friends’ was active in it - but it seemed to peter out. Yeah… it’s a bit of cat herding, isn’t it? It’s like the Bill Hicks bit: > There’s a new party being born. The “People Who Hate People” Party. People who hate people—come together! > > _“No!”_ > > We’re kinda having trouble getting started… > > _“Are you gonna be there?”_ > > Yeah… > > _“Then I ain’t fuckin’ comin’!”_ > > But you’re our strongest member! > > _“Fuck you!”_ > > That’s what I’m talkin’ about you asshole! > > _“Fuck off!”_ > > Damn, we almost had a meeting going. It’s so hard to get my people together ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/92 "2021-08-10T20:14:11Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Even in China, which is generally seen as being a country which isn’t particularly religious, [this Wikipedia article on religious affiliation by country](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_information_by_country) indicates that only half (52%) of the population is “unaffiliated.” I think this kind of stat is misleading though. The main “religion” of China is listed variously as “China folk religion” or “Ancestor worship”. But it’s kind of a vague thing compared to religion as many in the US would see it. AIUI there’s no church attendance or doctrine. Few rules about how you live your life apart from “do your ancestors proud” and a few ceremonies like burning money that you don’t need to take particularly seriously. -------------------------------------------------------- And I think it gets to a bigger point with this thread. I think many responses here have suggested that as long as there’s still superstition or spirituality then that’s still religion. But I think that would be an unfairly high bar to pass; we have all kinds of cognitive biases, and expecting everyone to be Dr Spock is unrealistic. I think it’s enough to talk about a time where organized religion is basically gone even if not all biases have been expunged. And of course, we are basically there in many parts of the world. Not just the aforementioned China, but much of Europe, Russia, Australia etc too. It actually makes surprisingly little difference to how people live day to day. ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/93 "2021-08-10T21:01:36Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > expecting everyone to be Dr Spock is unrealistic. No indeed; for one thing Dr Spock was an Olympic gold medallist. Not a lot of people know that. ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/94 "2021-08-10T21:08:46Z")
As an atheist, I feel a little attacked (and hence a little defensive) when I come across sentiments like: “When men choose not to believe in God, they do not thereafter believe in nothing. They then become capable of believing in anything.” (wrongly attributed to Chesterton). In my experience, people who are sceptical of religion tend to be sceptical of other supernatural beliefs (though I am sure there are exceptions). The idea that non-religious people are particularly credulous, or indeed that atheists are people who “choose not to believe in God”, sounds like a typical religious-person misunderstanding of atheism and atheists. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2021, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/95 "2021-08-10T23:01:27Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > One who has no belief in deities has no reason to believe in ghosts and crystals. I don’t understand how you arrive at that conclusion, because they’re not connected. Atheism is a lack of belief in a God or Gods, not a lack of belief in things which haven’t 100% scientifically been proven to exist. How is what you’re saying any different from saying someone who believes that music on vinyl sounds better than music in a lossless digital format? ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2021, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/96 "2021-08-11T13:25:52Z")
It’s my assertion that one who professes to be an atheist but is into New Age woo, aliens and ghosts, accepting the existence of supernatural phenomena, isn’t truly atheist. They’re just trading one system of unproven spiritual beliefs for another. Maybe that’s too absolute, but saying that God doesn’t exist but ghosts do doesn’t make sense to me. At any rate, it’s splitting hairs when referring to the non-religious, so I’ll stop derailing the thread. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2021, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/97 "2021-08-11T13:29:47Z")
Is there a word for people who don’t believe in anything supernatural? If not, let’s invent one. ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2021, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/98 "2021-08-11T13:36:24Z")
How about “scientists”? ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2021, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/99 "2021-08-11T13:41:05Z")
There are plenty of religious scientists, and plenty of nonbelievers who work in other professions. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2021, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260/100 "2021-08-11T13:44:07Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > How about “scientists”? Like say, [Francis Collins](https://www.ncronline.org/news/people/dr-francis-collins-national-institutes-health-wins-templeton-prize)? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/when-would-a-minority-of-people-be-religious-and-how-would-society-look-like/948260.md?page=6)