# Where are the logic puzzles? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [November 26, 2009, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024 "2009-11-26T11:20:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2009, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/1 "2009-11-26T11:20:34Z")
Last year or therabouts, I got into the logic puzzle books you find along with the crosswords and word searches at the supermarket. However, in the last 6 months, I haven’t seen any logic puzzles for sale. Can you still find them in your area, or are they gone? ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2009, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/2 "2009-11-26T11:58:40Z")
I don’t know the answer, but to re-phrase the question: If logic puzzle book were readily available last year, then disappeared for six months, and a train was running in the opposite direction at 80 km/h, how long until logic puzzle books returned? ---
**Author:** ![DadWagonDriver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/edb3f5/32.png) [@DadWagonDriver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DadWagonDriver)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2009, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/3 "2009-11-26T17:14:44Z")
I’ve been buying them at the Target store I frequent. I’m in Mesa, AZ. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2009, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/4 "2009-11-26T17:16:41Z")
> [@Isamu](#): > > I don’t know the answer, but to re-phrase the question: > > If logic puzzle book were readily available last year, then disappeared for six months, and a train was running in the opposite direction at 80 km/h, how long until logic puzzle books returned? 3, because the train is the puzzle book’s mother. ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2009, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/5 "2009-11-26T19:57:02Z")
They’re over in Aisle 7, with the magazines. ---
**Author:** ![Student\_Driver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3da27b/32.png) [@Student\_Driver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Student_Driver)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2009, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/6 "2009-11-28T03:29:30Z")
Walked through the magazine section of my local, small-ish Walmart. Saw three logic-puzzle magazines for sale, all from Dell/Penny Press… kind of a surprise since I hadn’t seen any for sale for a while, either. Looking them up, I see none of them come out monthly-- two are bimonthly, and one was quarterly judging by [this subscription page](http://www.pennydellpuzzles.com/subcategoryFilter.aspx?f=all&c=LogicMathSubscriptions)– so there’s a good chance you haven’t seen any for ages because they come out infrequently. I know the distributor at this WM only puts out a token couple of copies of these types of magazines (while cramming the shelves with “easy” crosswords and word searches), and removes titles after a couple of weeks of display, which would make finding these even more difficult. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2009, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/7 "2009-11-28T03:46:29Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > 3, because the train is the puzzle book’s mother. And the mother used an ice cube to hold open the door while she robbed the place. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2009, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/8 "2009-11-28T05:42:49Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > And the mother used an ice cube to hold open the door while she robbed the place. No, she put it on the gas pedal so she could hang herself. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2009, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/9 "2009-11-28T05:48:17Z")
I was just in a supermarket and I happened to look through the puzzle magazines. There were definitely logic puzzle themed magazines for sale just like there were suduku, crossword, anagram, and find-a-word themed magazines. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2009, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/10 "2009-11-29T23:26:00Z")
The link above is your best bet. We just subscribe and don’t rely on stores, which variably carry Dell/Penny Press logic puzzles. Or, if the GRE analytic section still uses logic grids, pick up a prep book! Now, someone suggest some sources of very hard sudoku. My partner whips through them while yawning. ---
**Author:** ![StoutHearted](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2bfe46/32.png) [@StoutHearted](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StoutHearted)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2009, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/11 "2009-11-30T00:42:01Z")
They aren’t profitable to make anymore. Puzzles like Sudoku and Word-Finds are easier and cheaper to make, and people buy them in droves. Logic books require lots of time and money to put together. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2009, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/12 "2009-11-30T02:34:06Z")
Everyone says that magazines are dying, and I generally agree. But what about puzzle magazines? I mean, it’s a huge hassle to do crosswords and word searches without a screen you can write on, and it’s not like people usually use their laptops in flight all the time yet. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2009, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/13 "2009-11-30T02:57:03Z")
It’s a tough market – but in general, people prefer to solve word puzzles on paper, as you suggest, so it’s holding its own. The type of puzzles change over time – as someone suggested upthread, Sudoku is big now – but there’s a small but loyal population who continue to buy them. At this point, there are two major players in the biz, Dell/Penny Press and Kappa. Dell has the strongest tradition of logic problems – of variety puzzles in general. Kappa put on a big push about 6-8 years ago, but discontinued all of their variety titles within the last three years. They are in the process of resuscitating two general-variety titles at the moment. twicks, who worked for one of the above companies – care to guess which one? – for 14 years ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/14 "2009-12-09T18:14:21Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > It’s a tough market – but in general, people prefer to solve word puzzles on paper, as you suggest, so it’s holding its own. The type of puzzles change over time – as someone suggested upthread, Sudoku is big now – but there’s a small but loyal population who continue to buy them. > > At this point, there are two major players in the biz, Dell/Penny Press and Kappa. Dell has the strongest tradition of logic problems – of variety puzzles in general. Kappa put on a big push about 6-8 years ago, but discontinued all of their variety titles within the last three years. They are in the process of resuscitating two general-variety titles at the moment. > > twicks, who worked for one of the above companies – care to guess which one? – for 14 years Came in here to offer an answer, and as I Was reading, was wondering if Twickster would field it. [Go Greek Letters!! - Oh sorry, did that give something away?] But yeah, I was going to suggest ““picture logic”” over at [www.conceptispuzzles.com](http://www.conceptispuzzles.com) but I believe the OP is one for the “Suzy has a dog, and lives on the right of the blue house. Billy does not live across from the cat owner” type of puzzle, yes? I thought that World of Puzzles still made an attempt at these. Then again, that would throw back to Twickster. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/15 "2009-12-09T19:11:10Z")
_World of Puzzles_ runs one or two of these puzzles occasionally, but there has never been an all-logic title under any of the _Games_ imprints. The last of the Kappa all-logic titles went belly-up about three years ago. Of course, if you enjoy logical problem-solving, as opposed to word manipulation, you’ve got a variety of options besides the so-called logic problems – the “Paint by Numbers” puzzles linked to in **Meeko** ’s post being one, and Sudoku being another. (I like Sudoko for this reason – other than cryptic crosswords, they’re about the only puzzles I do any more – well, that and my Mensa Puzzle A Day calendar puzzles.) ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2009, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/16 "2009-12-10T07:19:30Z")
Difficult puzzles as a whole are dwindling. _Games_ and _World of Puzzles_ mentioned above are still here, thank the lord. Dell’s _Math and Logic Puzzles_ (which I think has some new name now) comes out bi-monthly. It’s pretty much the only place to find new challenging Cross Sums/Kakuro.’’ The\* Atlantic Online\* just dropped their cryptic after many years. Fortunately, _Harper’s_ still has a great puzzle each month. Can’t figure out the popularity of easy puzzles. If the puzzle isn’t challenging…what’s the point? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2009, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/17 "2009-12-10T11:07:14Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > … Of course, if you enjoy logical problem-solving, as opposed to word manipulation, you’ve got a variety of options … I like Sudoku I like Nurikabe puzzles! I’ve constructed Logic Puzzles for Dell/Penny and will repost some here if there’s interest. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2009, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/18 "2009-12-10T20:36:48Z")
> [@](#): > > Can’t figure out the popularity of easy puzzles. If the puzzle isn’t challenging…what’s the point? Well of course, different things are challenging for different people. If you’re new to a particular type of puzzle, or just not very good at it, an easy one might be just the thing. ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2009, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-are-the-logic-puzzles/519024/19 "2009-12-10T21:37:27Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > If you’re new to a particular type of puzzle, or just not very good at it, an easy one might be just the thing. Sure. Without a lot of “easy” rated puzzles under the belt, it’s nearly impossible to solve advanced puzzles without cheating. But that’s what makes the absence of more difficult puzzles so hard to understand. Lots of people seem to be buying the “easy” varieties considering all the titles on the newstand. Yet one might suppose, after time, that a good number of these solvers would graduate from easier puzzles and want something more challenging. While some solvers wouldn’t have the ability, I would have thought lots more might demand something a little more difficult. Otherwise it’s just absently filling in numbers or letters — depending on the type of puzzle.