# where can you see four countries at once? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 21, 2003, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454 "2003-06-21T19:17:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2003, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/21 "2003-06-23T13:05:36Z")
> [@](#): > > _dtilque_ > > > [@](#): > > > > Originally posted by _Antonius Block_ > > There’s Snaefell on the Isle of Man, > > > > > [@](#): > > > > > > the island’s highest point, from which the four countries of England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland can be seen on a clear day. > > One page I found claimed you could also see Ireland from that hill, thus making it 5 countries, albeit only two independent ones. Don’t forget that you can also see the Isle of Man itself, which would make it six countries. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2003, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/22 "2003-06-23T18:31:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Floater \* > > > [@](#): > > > > One page I found claimed you could also see Ireland from that hill, thus making it 5 countries, albeit only two independent ones. > > Don’t forget that you can also see the Isle of Man itself, which would make it six countries. Well, yes, but that opens up a different can of worms about the definition of “country”. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2003, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/23 "2003-06-23T20:55:41Z")
I would think that counting the United Kingdoms separately is already opening that can of worms, though… ---
**Author:** ![fierra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/58956e/32.png) [@fierra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fierra)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2003, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/24 "2003-06-23T22:24:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dtilque \* > \*\*For instance, a newspaper article from the New Zealand Sunday Star Times says you can see 5 countries from the summit of Mt Everest. Now two of those will be Nepal and China, of course and you might be able to see mountain peaks in India and Bhutan, but I’m not sure what the other one is. Unless they are counting Sikkim, which is technically not independent. Or is it possible to see Bangladesh from Mt Everest? \*\* I imagine they are including Tibet in the list, since Everest was originally half in Nepal & half in Tibet, before Tibet was invaded and claimed by China. ---
**Author:** ![Antonius\_Block](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/51bf81/32.png) [@Antonius\_Block](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antonius_Block)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2003, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/25 "2003-06-23T23:16:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by fierra \* > \*\*I imagine they are including Tibet in the list, since Everest was originally half in Nepal & half in Tibet, before Tibet was invaded and claimed by China. \*\* If you **include** Tibet as a country then you have to **exclude** China from the list. The nearest (non-Tibetan) part of China to Mt. Everest is in Qinghai province, about 700km away, with huge mountain ranges in between. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/26 "2003-06-24T03:59:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Chronos \* > I would think that counting the United Kingdoms separately is already opening that can of worms, though… Well, England, Scotland, and Wales are still called countries, even though they haven’t been independent for centuries. North Ireland, though, has never been an independent entity, so I guess you’re right. I’m not that up on the history of the Isle of Man, but I think it had kings maybe 13 or 14 centuries ago, although they may not have been completely independent from others. But despite that, it’s not called a “country” like Wales. ---
**Author:** ![blahedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a4c791/32.png) [@blahedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blahedo)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/27 "2003-06-24T15:43:37Z")
At the very eastern end of Turkey, there’s a narrow little finger that extends eastward—it looks to be about three or four miles wide—where you could probably see Armenia, Azerbaijan, Iran, and of course Turkey itself. ---
**Author:** ![djbdjb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a87d85/32.png) [@djbdjb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/djbdjb)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2003, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/28 "2003-06-24T20:00:22Z")
One way to make progress on an exhaustive list is to find points where the territory of n nations is within k km of that point, for various values of n (\>3 and \<6? , 5?) and k various values. With large value of k, (100 km?) you would need a large mountain to be your point of reference. Could a modern GIS (Geographical Information system ) handle this type of query? In looking through an Atlas, I found the Caprivi Strip, Liechtenstein as a positibility, The punjab area, and these ones not yet mentioned: Morocco , Western Sahara (technically an independent country), Algeria, Mauritania; Burma, Laos, Thailand, China. Looking from southern Austria into Hungary, Slovenia and across to Croatia looks even more doubtful, as I don’t think the mountains are high enough in south Austria. ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/29 "2003-06-25T04:55:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dtilque \* > \*\*And then there’s the area at the eastern end of the Caprivi Strip where Namibia comes within about 15 Km of Zimbabwe. It shouldn’t take too high a hill for someone to be able to see Namibia, Zimbabwe, Zambia, and Botswana. Not 100% sure what the terrain is in that area, but I think it’s fairly flat so there may not be a suitable hill. \*\* Doesn’t really matter what kind of terrain is there, since all you need to do is stand on the exact spot where all four countries’ borders intersect. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Speaker\_for\_the\_Dead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@Speaker\_for\_the\_Dead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Speaker_for_the_Dead)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/30 "2003-06-25T05:39:47Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dtilque \* > \*\*Well, England, Scotland, and Wales are still called countries, even though they haven’t been independent for centuries. North Ireland, though, has never been an independent entity, so I guess you’re right. > \*\* England’s not independent? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/31 "2003-06-25T06:18:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Speaker for the Dead \* > England’s not independent? 😛 No more so than Scotland. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/32 "2003-06-25T06:37:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by KGS \* > Doesn’t really matter what kind of terrain is there, since all you need to do is stand on the exact spot where all four countries’ borders intersect. 😃 I guess I was misled by my atlas which shows Namibia not quite reaching Zimbabwe. But several sites on the net say they meet. However, you’re going to have difficulty actually standing on the spot they meet, unless you’re wearing scuba gear. It’s in the middle of a river. ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/33 "2003-06-25T14:47:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dtilque \* > \*\*However, you’re going to have difficulty actually standing on the spot they meet, unless you’re wearing scuba gear. It’s in the middle of a river. \*\* You can always stand on a boat, right? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Spiff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiff/32/9852_2.png) [@Spiff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiff)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/34 "2003-06-25T19:27:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Floater \* > \*\* One page I found claimed you could also see Ireland from that hill, thus making it 5 countries, albeit only two independent ones. [/quote] Don’t forget that you can also see the Isle of Man itself, which would make it six countries. \*\* [/QUOTE] From the Isle of Man, can you see that off-shore oil rig that some guy claimed as an independent country? Or is that in the North Sea? ---
**Author:** ![Antonius\_Block](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/51bf81/32.png) [@Antonius\_Block](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antonius_Block)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/35 "2003-06-25T22:09:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Spiff \* > \*\*From the Isle of Man, can you see that off-shore oil rig that some guy claimed as an independent country? > > Or is that in the North Sea? \*\* You’re thinking of [Sealand](http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/8.07/haven.html). Yes, it’s in the North Sea, about 400km from the Isle of Man, so you can’t see it from the top of Snaefell. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/36 "2003-06-25T22:21:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dtilque \* > **How about Monserrat? The high point is 914 m in the Soufriere Hills. You might be able to see Antigua and Barbuda, St Kitts & Nevis, and Guadaloupe from there. The furthest of these is Guadaloupe at some 65 Km away.** Good suggestion. I found a site that said that it was possible to see St. Kitts, Montserrat, and Guadeloupe from a mere 300 ft. vantage point on Antigua, so that the reverse should be true from Soufriere, if the smoke from the volcanic eruptions doesn’t get in the way. However, my money is on Mt. Liamuiga (Mt. Misery) on St. Kitts, which at 3,792 ft (1,378 m) is the highest point in the Leeward Islands. This offers views of Anguilla and Montserrat (both U.K), Saba and Statia/St. Eustasius (Netherlands), St. Bart’s (France)and St. Maarten/Martin (Netherlands/France), making a minimum of four countries. If it’s also possible to see Antigua from there - I would think it might be, but I haven’t been able to confirm it - that would give five countries: St. Kitts-Nevis, Antigua-Barbuda, and dependencies of the U.K., France, and Netherlands. ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/37 "2003-06-25T22:22:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dtilque \* > \*\*North Ireland, though, has never been an independent entity, so I guess you’re right. > > I’m not that up on the history of the Isle of Man, but I think it had kings maybe 13 or 14 centuries ago, although they may not have been completely independent from others. But despite that, it’s not called a “country” like Wales. \*\* Sorry about the nitpick, but “The north of Ireland” or “Northern Ireland”, not “North Ireland”. Mann, or the Isle of Man, is indeed a country, like Wales, only with considerably more independence. The kingdom of Mann expired 5 centuries ago, not 13 or 14! ---
**Author:** ![froggg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8797f3/32.png) [@froggg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/froggg)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/38 "2003-06-25T23:03:37Z")
The obvious answer is at Disney land, although, you will have to put up with having “It’s a small world” running through your head for the rest of the day, not to mention the nightmares that all those dolls will certainly bring. And then there’s the line to get in. Oh dear, here come the dolls again!. On a more serious note, I think Europe would be your best bet for seeing for countries at once, as you would already have read above. Slight hijack though, what are my chances of successfully taking sealand by force? ---
**Author:** ![lite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b5ac83/32.png) [@lite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lite)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2003, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/39 "2003-06-25T23:22:39Z")
Hijack not intended. While they’re states and not countries, I’m proud to say that I was simultaneously in 4 states at once. In the US there is the “4 corner” area. The site where AZ, NM, CO and UT meet. You simply place each hand and foot in each state. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2003, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454/40 "2003-06-26T00:04:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Colibri \* > However, my money is on Mt. Liamuiga (Mt. Misery) on St. Kitts, which at 3,792 ft (1,378 m) is the highest point in the Leeward Islands. This offers views of Anguilla and Montserrat (both U.K), Saba and Statia/St. Eustasius (Netherlands), St. Bart’s (France)and St. Maarten/Martin (Netherlands/France), making a minimum of four countries. If it’s also possible to see Antigua from there - I would think it might be, but I haven’t been able to confirm it - that would give five countries: St. Kitts-Nevis, Antigua-Barbuda, and dependencies of the U.K., France, and Netherlands. \*\* Antigua is not significantly further away than several other islands you list, so there should be no problem seeing it. This is a stretch, but it’s about 200 Km to St Croix from Mt. Liamuiga and the high point on St. Croix is 474 m. It’s just open ocean in between, so maybe on a clear day you can see the US Virgin Is. too. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-can-you-see-four-countries-at-once/183454.md?page=3)