# Where did this totally preposterous claim come from. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 29, 2017, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050 "2017-08-29T19:40:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![zuer-coli](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ba9def/32.png) [@zuer-coli](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zuer-coli)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/1 "2017-08-29T19:40:38Z")
Dopers all Mods: I am not quite sure this belongs in Elections or not, please move as you deem appropriate. This does not represent any view of my own. I quote it from a private message board, What I am interested in is where did this claim come from? (It may well have been the brain child of the person who wrote it. For instance this person purports to believe that George W Bush shot down the plane that Congressman Hale Boggs was riding in when it went missing, I kid you not.) FWIW I don’t think that I will post a link as it is a private message board. “Do you think that only California, Oregon, Washington, New York, Massachusetts, Maryland, New Jersey and Illinois are states with more registered voters than voting age adults? You can bet that states which went for Trump, including our Indiana, also have this indiscretion. Just because someone is a registered voter does not mean that voter participates in an election.” As you can tell there is some confusion between the first two sentences and the last sentence. So we are clear here: I do not believe this claim, I am merely interested if anyone else has heard of it, and if so what was the source. Thank you all for what ever time and effort you may choose to spent replying. Zuer-coli ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/2 "2017-08-29T19:51:00Z")
Once registered in a state it is not unusual for a voter to remain on the voter rolls even if they move to a different state. So it would not be at all unexpected for a state’s voter roll to include people who are not actually eligible to vote in that state. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/3 "2017-08-29T19:59:11Z")
What exactly is the claim? That there are more voters registered than there are adults in those states and more states? That Trump won states where that was the case? That there was voter fraud involved? There doesn’t seem to be any coherent point there. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/4 "2017-08-29T21:01:58Z")
If Boards of Elections in other states are akin to the one in New York, their rolls contain: • multiple occurrences of the same voter, even at the same address. Mr. Scaramucci (yes, _that_ Scaramucci), for example, appears as a registered Nassau County NY voter twice. • lots of presumably dead people. People whose birth dates would make them nonagenarians and centenarians and whose voting history shows they haven’t voted in a few decades • people who moved to another state None of this involves citizen/voter malfeasance. And there’s no real evidence that it is associated with people voting more often than they should or in places they shouldn’t. ---
**Author:** ![igor\_frankensteen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/839c29/32.png) [@igor\_frankensteen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/igor_frankensteen)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2017, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/5 "2017-09-10T22:13:08Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > What exactly is the claim? That there are more voters registered than there are adults in those states and more states? That Trump won states where that was the case? That there was voter fraud involved? There doesn’t seem to be any coherent point there. Actually, all the claims that I’ve heard made about this, have come from pro-Trump people , pretending that the many states where Trump LOST, were where there were lots of phantom voters at the polls. Absolutely no proof at all has been shown that any such thing happened. The pro-Trump people also like to claim that since the registrars are, in most cases, also charged with removing names from the voting lists, for people who are no longer valid local voters, means that any time they failed to do so, meant that they were actively attempting to support fraud at the polls. They refuse to admit that the lack of any functional mechanism anywhere which would allow registrars to DO that, makes their claims absurd. I personally link this to another Republican behavior in recent times, which had to be forcibly opposed, is that they like to pressure registrars to eject voters from the roles, for all sorts of reasons which actually make no sense. For example, in at least one area, the local GOP tried to force registrars to remove from the rolls, any resident who returned Republican literature to the sender, regardless of WHY the literature was returned, including erroneous addressing by the GOP. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2017, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/6 "2017-09-10T22:18:43Z")
[Who Is Registered to Vote in Two States? Some in Trump’s Inner Circle.](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/27/us/politics/trump-cabinet-family-voter-registration.html?mcubz=0) > [@](#): > > Registered in two states > > • Steve Bannon, Mr. Trump’s strategist, was registered to vote in Florida and New York, the Sarasota Herald-Tribune found. > > • Tiffany Trump, Mr. Trump’s youngest daughter, was registered in Pennsylvania and New York, NBC News reported. > > • Sean Spicer, his press secretary, was registered in both Virginia and Rhode Island, according to The Washington Post. > > • Jared Kushner, his son-in-law and close adviser, was registered in New York and New Jersey, according to The Washington Post. > > • Steven Mnuchin, who is nominated to lead the Treasury Department, was registered in New York and California, CNN found. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2017, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/7 "2017-09-10T22:40:27Z")
Mnuchin is clearly part of the bicoastal elite! In fact, maybe he is the bicoastal elite. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2017, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/8 "2017-09-11T15:21:29Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > [Who Is Registered to Vote in Two States? Some in Trump’s Inner Circle.](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/27/us/politics/trump-cabinet-family-voter-registration.html?mcubz=0) And as that article goes on to say, consistent with **USCDiver’s** claim above, it is common, and not illegal. A new arrival registers in his new state but has no convenient way of deleting his old registration. As long as he votes once, in his current residence, he’s conforming his conduct to the law. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2017, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/9 "2017-09-11T17:03:26Z")
> [@zuer-coli](#): > > Dopers all > > Mods: I am not quite sure this belongs in Elections or not, please move as you deem appropriate. > > “Do you think that only California, Oregon, Washington, New York, Massachusetts, Maryland, New Jersey and Illinois are states with more registered voters than voting age adults? You can bet that states which went for Trump, including our Indiana, also have this indiscretion. Just because someone is a registered voter does not mean that voter participates in an election.” CA has 18,055,783 registered voters, comprising about 47% of its total population of 38.43 million. 24,621,819 of CA’s population is 18+ yo. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California\_locations\_by\_voter\_registrationhttps://www.infoplease.com/us/california/demographic-statistics-237](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_locations_by_voter_registrationhttps://www.infoplease.com/us/california/demographic-statistics-237) So, by no means are there more registered voters than voting age adults. About 6% of CA pop are undocumented aliens. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2017, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/10 "2017-09-12T02:33:27Z")
Hale Boggs was Big Magic at the time, IIRC. Daughter Cokie Roberts would be less influential with him in office. It’s a toss-up. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2017, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/11 "2017-09-12T15:10:41Z")
When I was active in California for the Libertarian party thirty years ago, the voter list had not been pruned to remove deadwood in years. This was annoying because we’d get a list of registered Libertarian voters and go to the residence to get a signature on a candidate’s petition only to find the voter hadn’t lived there for eight years. It was so bad we kept a list of known false hits and would use it to remove them from the list received that year from the Sec’y of State. Rumor had it that it was the Democrats blocking attempts to purge because they were afraid would slip from second place (after independent) to third, below the Republicans. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2017, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/12 "2017-09-17T15:12:46Z")
In many (most?) countries, it is the duty of the government to register voters before every election. In Canada, we would get canvassers come around house to house before every election. My wife and I got registered (before we were citizens), although we didn’t vote. If no one was home, they would ask a neighbor about us. They have abandoned this practice, but a month or so before our upcoming municipal elections we will get a postcard if we are on the list and instructions as to polling station. I think if the card is returned, we would get stricken from the lists. The upshot is that the government makes some effort to keep the rolls fairly accurate. ---
**Author:** ![zuer-coli](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ba9def/32.png) [@zuer-coli](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zuer-coli)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/13 "2017-10-19T18:21:13Z")
Thanks to all who have replied, I now think this must be one of those “I heard it from a friend who hear it from a friend” type of deal. However the evidence for an extensive attempt to influence the 2016 elections on the part of the Russian government seems to mount, certainly if it originally appeared on a Twitter account, or perhaps on Facebook. I would be very suspicious. Zuer-coli ---
**Author:** ![Evan\_Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b487fb/32.png) [@Evan\_Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evan_Drake)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/14 "2017-10-19T18:46:43Z")
In Britain we get a [**form**](https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/family/household-enquiry-form) once a year on which the householder fills changes if any ( the form has previous registrees listed in ) — if no change you just return it or naturally go online for a few seconds. For new voters there is a silly new [**system**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individual_Electoral_Registration), bypassing the householder bit ( which at least provided a responsible person ) whereby people go online with DOB and National Insurance no., but that takes about 2 minutes. I’m not sure why some States struggle to provide such a quick system. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/15 "2017-10-19T19:00:37Z")
> [@Evan\_Drake](#): > > In Britain we get a [**form**](https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/family/household-enquiry-form) once a year on which the householder fills changes if any ( the form has previous registrees listed in ) — if no change you just return it or naturally go online for a few seconds. > > For new voters there is a silly new [**system**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individual_Electoral_Registration), bypassing the householder bit ( which at least provided a responsible person ) whereby people go online with DOB and National Insurance no., but that takes about 2 minutes. > > I’m not sure why some States struggle to provide such a quick system. I don’t know if this has ever been raised in the US. But if it were, I’m pretty sure the Democrats would fight it tooth and nail. They tend to attract most of the votes from the low-motivated people who wouldn’t get around to confirming their registration and would thus be stricken from the rolls. They make enormous (and highly successful) GOTV efforts on and around election day, but having registration conformation requirements would make them have to go through the whole process twice, and would still be less than 100% successful. ---
**Author:** ![Evan\_Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b487fb/32.png) [@Evan\_Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evan_Drake)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/16 "2017-10-19T19:06:46Z")
Apparently Aussieland does it even better: \*The tragedy is all the greater because a more efficient and cheaper version of individual registration is available. Australia has used individual voter registration for years and works on the simple principle that once registered, voters stay on the register and are tracked by cross-referencing multiple databases if they move address. \* \*The state of New South Wales, with a population of 7 million, achieves a 95% accurate register through this process with fewer staff and smaller budgets than comparable areas in the UK. The UK, however, persists with a version of registration where eligibility has to be confirmed after every change of address and the whole process is administered by more than 400 local councils doing the same job in complete isolation. \* [**Guardian**](https://www.theguardian.com/public-leaders-network/2015/feb/05/missing-voters-individual-electoral-registration-disaster) ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/17 "2017-10-19T20:58:15Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > …Democrats would fight it tooth and nail. They tend to attract most of the votes from the low-motivated people who wouldn’t get around to confirming their registration… Do they, now? Well, I didn’t know that. Learn something every day, I reckon. Son of a gun, its a new one on me! ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/18 "2017-10-19T21:04:46Z")
You’re most welcome. Any questions, feel free to ask. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/19 "2017-10-19T21:18:30Z")
You’d be amazed how many dead people don’t take the time to remove themselves from the voter rolls. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2017, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-did-this-totally-preposterous-claim-come-from/795050/20 "2017-10-20T04:06:53Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > But if it were, I’m pretty sure the Democrats would fight it tooth and nail. They tend to attract most of the votes from the low-motivated people who wouldn’t get around to confirming their registration and would thus be stricken from the rolls. . No, but they do get a lot of votes from the poor and minorities, those who cant take a whole day off work to get a special ID.