# Where it's "@" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 2, 2000, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068 "2000-02-02T21:20:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![drollman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f04885/32.png) [@drollman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drollman)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2000, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/21 "2000-02-05T03:02:00Z")
I must say, I love the way th@ this tread is going. F@ chance we’ll ever find the true right answer, but we went to the m@ trying! * * * With God as my witness, I thought turkey’s could fly. ---
**Author:** ![handy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@handy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handy)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2000, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/22 "2000-02-05T17:22:00Z")
My TTY has no At Sign on the keyboard. Haven’t seen one with it either. But if I call someone using a computer & they type one, it shows up on the screen. ---
**Author:** ![Milossarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Milossarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milossarian)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2000, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/23 "2000-02-05T17:56:00Z")
I agree with the consensus here that @ stands for ‘at.’ But that begs another question: Why did anyone feel the need to abbreviate a two-letter word? And why \* that \* word? Seems like abbreviations on your typewriter or keyboard for ‘and’ and ‘the’ would make more sense. * * * “You should tell the truth, expose the lies and live in the moment.” - Bill Hicks ---
**Author:** ![Mrunner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@Mrunner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mrunner)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2000, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/24 "2000-02-05T19:15:00Z")
Laosiest! HAH! ---
**Author:** ![JBENZ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b77776/32.png) [@JBENZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JBENZ)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2000, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/25 "2000-02-05T23:20:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by NanoByte: > **But my dictionary says that, in Laos, 100 at = 1 kip, so @ that rate, when I buy a dozen apples, I should be able to kip the change. No, that can’t be the Laosiest pun you ever heard.** My boy, that may be the single most appalling sentence to appear on this board in months. If Groucho was alive today he’d horsewhip you…if he had a horse. Congratulations. “o"o====” * * * JB Lex Non Favet Delicatorum Votis ---
**Author:** ![NanoByte](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecc23a/32.png) [@NanoByte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NanoByte)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2000, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/26 "2000-02-05T23:26:00Z")
Well, of course there **is** a symbol for ‘and’, the ampersand (&). But why is it presently considered inappropriate for anything other than use in the names of businesses. The solution to abbreviating ‘the’ is to dispense with it completely. Russian doesn’t need it. . .well, at least, it usually gets away without expressing anything equivalent. But to answer the question of why one would ever choose to abbreviate a two-letter word – you would figure that the merchants who did it simply decided to cross their 't’s at the time they had already gone on to their next price tag. Instead of crossing a ‘t’ in a form something like a cross, they just thought it would be quick and cute to loop the “cross” around the ‘a’ of ‘at’. Try it in warp time. Ah, the first stage in their evolution to a [dot.com](http://dot.com). Maybe the English merchants were losing out in sales in competition with the French _à_ and Spanish _a_, because of the time it took to make that ‘t’ on ‘at’, complete with its cross. Not sure how the Germans made out with _für_(?). 😉 Ray (Well, if you don’t know. . .tell 'em what **sounds** good. . .or bad, as the case may warrant.) * * * “The more the universe seems comprehensible, the more it also seems pointless.” – Steven Weinberg, Physicist ---
**Author:** ![Astroglide](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6de8d8/32.png) [@Astroglide](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astroglide)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2000, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/27 "2000-02-06T07:29:00Z")
In INTERCAL, the @ is “whirlpool”. Disclaimer and proof of sanity: I have not actually written any code in INTERCAL. ---
**Author:** ![douglips](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@douglips](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/douglips)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2000, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/28 "2000-02-06T16:35:00Z")
If you wanna know what a symbol is called by various hackers of the world, the [Jargon file](http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/jargon/html/index.html) is the place to look. For example, in the entry for [ASCII](http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/jargon/html/entry/ASCII.html) they give this entry: \ \@ \Common: at sign; at; strudel. Rare: each; vortex; whorl; [whirlpool]; cyclone; snail; ape; cat; rose; cabbage; \. \ ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2000, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/29 "2000-02-07T16:23:00Z")
@ was developed by the dress-making industry, which stole the concept obviously from the Americans, since the circular part goes counter-clockwise… 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Nickrz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bbce88/32.png) [@Nickrz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nickrz)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2000, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/30 "2000-02-07T16:28:00Z")
The circle part goes clockwise in the southern hemisphere. Activate your Aussie keyboard if you don’t believe me. ---
**Author:** ![chique](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@chique](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chique)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2000, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/31 "2000-02-09T07:10:00Z")
Had a conversation on this very topic not too long ago with friends. We never did find the answer to the name for @, but # is called an oct-something. Octote? Octetal? Something like that…so @ has to have a name too, no? ---
**Author:** ![douglips](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@douglips](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/douglips)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2000, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/32 "2000-02-09T17:16:00Z")
Did you not see my post just a few inches above your own? If you want to see what the name for ‘#’ is, follow the [\ **LINK** \](http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/jargon/html/entry/ASCII.html) \The password is octothorpe.\ ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2000, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/33 "2000-02-10T01:13:00Z")
“Octothorpe” is a made-up word that no longer survives except as an urban legend. * * * John W. Kennedy “Compact is becoming contract; man only earns and pays.” – Charles Williams ---
**Author:** ![douglips](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@douglips](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/douglips)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2000, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/34 "2000-02-10T20:57:00Z")
I didn’t really check into the etymology, I was just irritated that someone could look right past my statement > [@](#): > > If you wanna know what a symbol is called by various hackers of the world, the Jargon file is the place to look. For example, in the entry for ASCII they give this entry: which included links to the very thing to look up the answers, and then muse about “octo something?” My apologies, sandyr, I should not have jumped down your throat so hard. The word you were looking for I believe is _octothorpe_, though as John W. points out it (along with many other computer geek terms for things) is a made up word roughly meaning _eight-pointed thing_ or something similar. ---
**Author:** ![SuperNerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@SuperNerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuperNerd)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2000, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/35 "2000-02-10T22:39:00Z")
Okay, for what it’s worth: [read this](http://www.qnx.com/~glen/deadbeef/762.html). it pretty much completely verifies the story about the octothorpe that I heard many years ago. I did a google search and came up with 358 references. Didn’t check many of them but the term does (did?) seem to be common in the telephone biz. ---
**Author:** ![SuperNerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@SuperNerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuperNerd)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2000, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/36 "2000-02-10T22:41:00Z")
Oops. That was in reference to the origin of the word octothorpe, I probably should have said that somewhere … ---
**Author:** ![chique](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@chique](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chique)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2000, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/37 "2000-02-11T04:02:00Z")
I got the octo-whatever from a column from The Washington Post’s Style section called The Red Pencil (don’t know how to put in links, go find it yourself). Octothorpe was NOT the answer, else i’d have mentioned it. ---
**Author:** ![douglips](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@douglips](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/douglips)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2000, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/38 "2000-02-11T20:08:00Z")
Well, I found a link to the current edition of [The Red Pencil](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/WPlate/2000-02/11/060l-021100-idx.html), the column to which **sandyr** refers. Unfortunately, after much searching I did not discover anything about the # sign. I searched for “pound sign”, “pound symbol”, “pound”, “#”, “octo” and “octothorpe” and found nothing there. Can you help out with a general date you saw this? I crawled through far too many google search pages looking for this and the only thing I found was the aforementioned octothorpe. I’m really curious about it now, but I am losing energy to keep wading through acres of search pages. Any additional info on the column you saw, like if you remember a word or turn of phrase that was used, would be helpful. ---
**Author:** ![douglips](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@douglips](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/douglips)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2000, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/39 "2000-02-11T20:18:00Z")
Found it! Sorta. Using the [archive search](http://search.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/searches/mainsrch.htm)\> feature at the [Washington Post](http://www.washingtonpost.com), I was able to find this: > [@](#): > > THE RED PENCIL > > Article 1 of 5 found > > REDGATE > © 1999 REDGATE / [WRYTOR@AOL.COM](mailto:WRYTOR@AOL.COM) > Wednesday, July 7, 1999 ; Page C12 > Section: Style > Word Count: 122 > > Q. Is there an official name for the # symbol? Unfortunately, you have to pay to get the article, $1.50 during off-peak times. **sandyr** , if you promise me the word is in this article and is not octothorpe, I’ll buy the article. Or, if I can get through to my library to see if they have this paper I might stop by. ---
**Author:** ![chique](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@chique](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chique)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2000, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068/40 "2000-02-12T02:05:00Z")
Erg ☹ July? Can’t remember what I had for breakfast Tuesday, let alone what I read in July. And, of course, the more I think about it the more I think I may be wrong. Or right 😕 Will saying I’m 99.99% positive it was NOT octothorpe do? Personally, the # thing isn’t bothering me nearly as much as the @ thing, but hey, if you think the answer is worth a buck and a half, go for it 🙂 When it’s all over do ya think we’d get credit from Redgate for telling him he’s wrong? If he WAS wrong, that is 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-its/7068.md?page=3)